Small Claims Process-Could do with some guidance

[Michael2208]

Hi there.

My brother and I run a company designing and selling a range of products. We hired a company last year to manufacture the products for us, paying a 50% deposit on two orders. The quality was atrocious and when questioned the company made a lot of excuses, then decided they couldn't do the job we had hired them for and terminated things. We have not been fully refunded so we are looking to go to the Small Claims Court.

I have downloaded all the forms and filled them in, detailing the grievances. I thought it would be quicker to submit online. Looking at the information you are asked to provide online there is nowhere near the same amount of detail about the claim as there is in the paper claim.

Which is the best route to take-online of offline? The reason I ask is the company has been so flippant, almost laughing at the fact we have asked for a refund that the online version looks pathetic, whereas the offline form makes a strong claim, which I think might have more impact in presenting a case to the company in question.

I am puzzled why the online form doesn't follow the same process.

I'd appreciate thoughts on which is the best route to take.


Thanks in advance.

[nemesis45]

Re: Small Claims Process-Could do with some guidance

Hi there.

My brother and I run a company designing and selling a range of products. We hired a company last year to manufacture the products for us, paying a 50% deposit on two orders. The quality was atrocious and when questioned the company made a lot of excuses, then decided they couldn't do the job we had hired them for and terminated things. We have not been fully refunded so we are looking to go to the Small Claims Court.

I have downloaded all the forms and filled them in, detailing the grievances. I thought it would be quicker to submit online. Looking at the information you are asked to provide online there is nowhere near the same amount of detail about the claim as there is in the paper claim.

Which is the best route to take-online of offline? The reason I ask is the company has been so flippant, almost laughing at the fact we have asked for a refund that the online version looks pathetic, whereas the offline form makes a strong claim, which I think might have more impact in presenting a case to the company in question.

I am puzzled why the online form doesn't follow the same process.

I'd appreciate thoughts on which is the best route to take.


Thanks in advance.

Good morning, welcome to LB,
Good practice would be to make a written formal complaint or letter before claim to the company concerned, if this fails then take them to court.

nem

[ostell]

Re: Small Claims Process-Could do with some guidance

The letter before claim summarises the complaint and why and what you expect from them in compensation. Give them 14 days to respond then raise the claim on line using a precis of what and why you are claiming in the particulars of claim. The full details can be notified to them with another letter. You will be providing full details of your claim later in the court process, the quick precis in the claim form is not the end of the matter.

They receive your claim form, acknowledge within 14 days and it they don't then you claim a default judgement on day 15.

On line also gives you a better chance of monitoring what is happening.

[Diana M]

Re: Small Claims Process-Could do with some guidance

They receive your claim form, acknowledge within 14 days and it they don't then you claim a default judgement on day 15.

On line also gives you a better chance of monitoring what is happening.

The Defendant has 19 days from the claim Issue Date to file the Acknowledgement of Service (unless they can prove they received it more than five days after it was issued) so the OP can apply to enter Judgment on Day 20 if they don't file it by the deadline.

In fact it's midnight on Day 19 that the bar is lifted on the MCOL system so if the Claimant cares to stay up all night they can do it then (i.e. 12.01 am)

I agree that issuing online gives the Claimant a better chance of monitoring the situation wihout having to make incessant phone calls to NCCBC where they'll be left on hold forever.

Di

[R0b]

Re: Small Claims Process-Could do with some guidance

I would suggest before you jump in at the deep end, just make sure you have what you need and the evidence to back up your claim. Some questions you should be asking yourself would be:

1. Was the agreement made verbally or written? Did either party agree the orders on their standard terms of business?
2. You said you terminated, was there any specific way to terminate? how did you temrinate?
3. Assuming the goods were not of satisfactory quality or fit for purpose as the basis for your claim, were these implied terms excluded as part of the order
4. Was there any limitation of liability on part of the manufacturer?
5. What are you claiming? Damages, loss of profits etc. Can you prove those losses? How much is the value of that, as it may very well take you over the small claims limit.

As for issuing the claim online, the box to put your particulars is limited to a number of characters. If you want to send more detailed particulars on paper in the usual way, there is a tick box above it that says you agree to send detailed particulars 14 days after service. The manufacturer's 14 days to acknowledge will begin once it has been received following deemed service.

[Michael2208]

Re: Small Claims Process-Could do with some guidance

Thanks for the replies, very useful information, which I'm grateful for.

I will definitely put a formal letter before to the company indicating our complaint in detail. We have stressed it many times in emails over the past couple of months and they have practically laughed at us. Maybe something more formal will show our intent.

I do have plenty of evidence to back up the claim. As well as photographic evidence showing the poor quality of the products received we also have a very long email trail that includes many contradictions from the company about our complaint.

To answer some of the points:

1. The agreement was written. The orders were agreed on their standard terms of business.

2. They terminated, not me. They basically said their process wasn't going to work for us. Their process is exactly the same as every other manufacturer in our industry.

3. The claim is for items being not of satisfactory quality and not fit for purpose. The implied terms were not excluded as part of the order.

4. There was no limitation of liability on part of the manufacturer?

5. We are claiming for breach of contract for providing goods not fit for purpose, and failure to fulfill contract. We paid a deposit for two orders but have received very inferior products and nowhere near the value of goods in relation to the deposit paid, coupled with them saying they couldn't do what we wanted and abruptly ending things.

I missed the tick box on the online section!! I had filled out the PDF expecting to just copy and paste everything into the online form.

[R0b]

Re: Small Claims Process-Could do with some guidance

1. The agreement was written. The orders were agreed on their standard terms of business.

Have you read the terms fully? What does it say about termination, particularly when and if the manufacturer may terminate - they may be in breach of contract by wrongful termination.

I am surprised a manufacturer (unless it is a really small one) has decided not to exclude or limit their liability in their standard terms - it is a key clause for any business. It is common for companies insert a clause limiting their liability to direct losses only or put a cap on what can be recovered. If you issue a claim that exclude specific liability then you might fall flat on your face. If there is no clause for limitation of liability, you should consider claiming for loss of profits as surely any business would want to recover any expectation of profits had the goods been made to the standard expected.

Happy to look over the terms and conditions if you want an extra pair of eyes to be double sure there's no clause on limitation of liability - just upload the document.

[Michael2208]

Re: Small Claims Process-Could do with some guidance

Thanks for R0b for the detailed information. The industry we are in is niche and consists of mostly very small businesses, so there was a very basic T&C, nothing more.

You mentioned a letter before claim. Is there a formal way to lay this out and present it? I think this will be a good first step and I am hoping this will be enough to show him we are serious about our claim-to date he has treated it like a joke.

[enaid]

Re: Small Claims Process-Could do with some guidance

Help with letter before claim HERE tells what should be in the letter and also an example amend to suit.

[Michael2208]

Re: Small Claims Process-Could do with some guidance

Quick question regarding the claim. This is for Business to business. I know the CRA is for business to consumer. What protection is there between B2B contracts these days? Surely businesses are still protected.