Disclosure rules

[Boxerdog8]

Hello,
I hope you can help..........I am in a Court Case with a DCA. The DCA has made up a great deal of the documents which I can show errors at the hearing. My question is under CPR Rules, Disclosure, the Judge has given dates for compliance three weeks later, but in the CPR it states you must respond within 7 days.
Do I comply with the Judges directions or the CPR Rules?

The DCA solicitors have asked for copies of their own bank statements, letters and five of the Case Law Authorities I have listed. As a firm of solicitors can they not access the case Law it is going to take me a week to copy the documents?
Can I refused to copy the Case Law reference?

Last question, if there is made up data on the documents do you know how I can get the documents removed from the Claim?

Thank you for your time in looking at my post.

[SpringerSpaniel]

Re: Disclosure rules

If the Judge has allowed more time, you can rely on following his / her Directions. However there is nothing to stop you disclosing within the 7 days if you are ready to do so.

It is not unreasonable to provide copies of the authorities you are seeking to rely on, to the other side and to the court.

It is better not to seek to have the false/erroneous documents removed from the Claim, but rather to cross examine witnesses from the other side as to previous inconsistent statements (I will make a separate post about how to do this: let us know if this is not necessary), and then make closing submissions as to the unreliability of their evidence and how it therefore cannot be relied on.

Similarly you should cross examine on the fact that they did not have their own statements.

If there are members of the DCA staff who can give evidence on these matters, make sure they are going to appear as witnesses. If they are not being called by thier own side, make an application for a Witness Summons to compel them to attend so you can cross examine them.

[SpringerSpaniel]

Re: Disclosure rules

Putting a Previous Inconsistent Statement to a Witness in Cross Examination
(mods: you may like to make this sticky as it will be helpful to anyone having to conduct a case in court, not only to Boxerdog8)


In cross examining the other side's witnesses, you should have a list of points you want to make/bring out from each witness eg here the documents are not consistent so they cannot all be true and authentic, they do not keep proper records (implying everything is run in a slipshod way).

It is usual to mainly ask closed questions, so that the witness has to say 'yes' or 'no'.

At the beginning of questioning, ask some seemingly innocent questions to get the witness used to you and if possible lull them into a false sense of security, then confront them with inconsistency etc.

Get them to agree that the original document is what they say it is; that they prepared it carefully; that they believe it to be correct etc.

Then show them the inconsistent statement. Ask them about the discrepancies. Then point out that they said something different only a short time ago; that they cannot both be correct and ask them to explain this to the court.

Make a note of the answers you are given. Use any useful points which come out in your closing submissions for the case.

[charitynjw]

Re: Disclosure rules

Hi,

Not wishing to hijack the thread, but as an LIP in a recent employment case, a friend of mine showed, not just an inconsistency, but a complete u-turn on a grievance statement made by the respondent's main witness;, the ET judge chose to completely ignore this.

What would be the best way to address this?

[CleverClogs]

Re: Disclosure rules

Not wishing to hijack the thread, but as an LIP in a recent employment case, a friend of mine showed, not just an inconsistency, but a complete u-turn on a grievance statement made by the respondent's main witness;, the ET judge chose to completely ignore this.

What would be the best way to address this?

Ask the ET how perjury was dealt with on his home planet?

[Boxerdog8]

Re: Disclosure rules

Hello Springer and Clever, Thank you very much for your kind response and time.
I will go for a witness from the DCA.

The DCA disclosure list have listed documents that they do not wish me to see. How dose this work in a Trial or hearing?

I have an orginial bank statement that states the correct APR which on their bank statements the have put the APR at 0. I am worried that they will just re print out the bank statements with the correct APR and state they have just found them etc, do I still need to disclose this document or can I put it on the list of documents I do not want them to see until the Hearing? Any advice would be most welcome as this document is vital to my evidence that the documents have been made up.
Again, thank you.
------------------------------- merged -------------------------------
P.S. any case law with Defected Defaults?

[SpringerSpaniel]

Re: Disclosure rules

You can challenge their wish not to disclose certain documents and insist that these need to be disclosed in the interests of a fair and just conduct of the case.

If need be you can make a request for a court order for these to be disclosed and this may required an interim hearing or case management conference. Is your case in the High Court of the County Court ?

[Boxerdog8]

Re: Disclosure rules

Hi Springer, thank you. The Claim is in the County Court.
Could I ask another question I am in Court second week of September and I have to list a trial bundle; do I need to do copies for the court and the Defendant? How do I list them, I am guessing letters one section, court documents, in another, evidence, in another? This needs to be done by Tuesday, so any help would be most welcome.

last question,.............if a Judge orders orginials documents for evidence for the hearing/trial but the otherside has admitted they do not have orginials, that they no longer exsist what happens then?

Enjoy the Bank holiday...............
Boxer8

[Boxerdog8]

Re: Disclosure rules

help..............I am getting confused over what needs to be included in the Trial Bundle. I now know I have to give the other party a TB.
Do I need to do a Case Summary and a Statement of Case?
I have the WS documents for both parties.
Which of the two do I point to case law and bank failings? The case summary or Statement of Case.
I am panicking a little just becasue I do not know CPR and paperwork expectations. I wish the Judge to not feel, this is a muddle...................
I am very grateful for anyone experience in attending court.........
P.S how is this fair when I am facing a muti million pound bank and firm of solicitors!

[SpringerSpaniel]

Re: Disclosure rules

I will be able to answer this and will post later but have just got in froma long and tiring jounrey and need time to recover.

[SpringerSpaniel]

Re: Disclosure rules

last question,.............if a Judge orders orginials documents for evidence for the hearing/trial but the otherside has admitted they do not have orginials, that they no longer exsist what happens then?

Boxer8

They are in breach of the Judge's order, and you can make a submission to that effect.

[SpringerSpaniel]

Re: Disclosure rules

help..............I am getting confused over what needs to be included in the Trial Bundle. I now know I have to give the other party a TB.
Do I need to do a Case Summary and a Statement of Case?
I have the WS documents for both parties.
Which of the two do I point to case law and bank failings? The case summary or Statement of Case.
I am panicking a little just becasue I do not know CPR and paperwork expectations. I wish the Judge to not feel, this is a muddle...................
I am very grateful for anyone experience in attending court.........
P.S how is this fair when I am facing a muti million pound bank and firm of solicitors!

You are absolutely correct that making a good impression and being helpful to the judge in both what yuo say and in your paperwork will help you a great deal.

As to the Court Bundle:

The POC are the Claimant's Statement of Case and will have already been served. The Defence statement is the Defendant's Statement of Case.

A separate Case Sumary should be provided for proceedings in the High Court. In the County Court it is not obligatory but may be helpful if the case is complex. The Case Summary must not exceed 250 words, so it is vital to be concise.

All the documents you prepare yourself (as opposed to those included as copies) should be double -spaced with generous margins. Each item (eg POC, witness statement) should have a heading in tramlines stating what it is. The bundle should be indexed and paginated, with page numbers in the bottom right hand corner. Use Time New Roman font, 12 pitch, throughout.

Neither the Statement of Case nor the Case Summary should describe case law in any details, simply give the reference to any caselaw decision you seek to rely on and state that you rely on that decision; likewise for legislation.

The place where the discussion of case law and how it applies to the facts of your case belongs is in a separate Skeleton Argument. I would make this a separate item to the bundle of documents unless epcifically requested otherwise.

A suitable order of the contents of the document bundle in your mattter could be:

- index page headed with 'Claimant's / Defendant's Bundle'

- Case Sumary (if used);

- Copy of claim form;

- Particulars of Claim;

- Defence Case Statement;

- witness statements from each witness you intend to call, in the order you intend the witness to give evidence. If at all possible, any documents relating to each witness' evidence should be exhibited to their witness statement, in the order in which they become relevant chronologically in the dispute. I would try to label each exhibit numerically in sequence, prefixing this with the initials of the witness, eg SS1, SS2, SS3 etc

- other correspondence relevant to the dispute and its conduct, in chronological order

- copies of any statutes and judgements relevant to your case


- anything else which is relevant

- make sure you include a copy of any agreement or contract which the dispute is about, this should ideally be exhibited to the POC or otherwise to your own witness statement.



You need to provide a copy of your bundle to the court, another to your opponent and retain one for your own use. These need to all be absolutely identical and served at least 7 days before the hearing. The bundle should be either bound or in a lever arch file.

I woudl serve a skeleton argument as a separate item but ideally posted out together with the bundle in the same package with a brief covering note statingt hat the Claimant/Defendant's Bundle of Documents and Skeleton Argument are enclose herewith. Send these by recorded delivery so that if there is any dispute as to whether you have complied with the court's directions, you have proof that you did.
:beagle:
Do post again if you have any other questions. Good luck

[Boxerdog8]

Re: Disclosure rules

Dear Springer,

thank you again. I got stuck on a closed A34 with my young son yesterday so I went to bed early and started again today. I need to serve the bundle tomorrow for some reason it is 14 days prior to the Trial. I will do the argument later, to tired. In my career I was know for short to the point reports! So the 250 words was not a problem! I do not think I will be able to put in case law print outs (59 pages each!) will this be a problem if I bring them to Trial/Hearing?
Thank you again.

[SpringerSpaniel]

Re: Disclosure rules

If you cannot include the authorities (CASELAW) in the bundle, send them when you can or at least bring them to the hearing. Make sure you have 3 copies of everything.

[Boxerdog8]

Re: Disclosure rules

Dear Springer,
I have just received costs from the otherside for the hearing next week. They have managed to bring it to £5K. It appears it takes a solicitor at £200. ph 14 hours for something that took me five! Do you know how I can object and point out it a small claim case so why are the fees so high?

I am begining to have sleepless nights as I have argued the best I can but it is a claim about the Data Protection Act and I do not think the DJ will want to go out on a limb for inaccurate data, plus I am finding it hard to find any case law. I was in Default it is the amount and date we can not agree upon. I do have evidence that it was inaccurate but unclear if this will be enough.

As always thank full for any help...........a boxer that is loosing it spring!