Can the bank ‘UNCLEAR’ cleared funds?

[Amethyst]

Re: Hello Lovely People!

Did your mother give you the £35k by another means ?

[des8]

Re: Hello Lovely People!

Des8,

I've re-read your last comment, can I ask what you mean by the 6 day rule becomes an 8 day rule? Using the Om's logic it would presumably become an indeterminate time rule, or did you mean something else?

NB

Co-op's T&Cs Para 2.1 states " If you pay a cheque into your account via a Post Office the payment into your account will be delayed by up to two business days"
You paid in on 5th Dec: the 7th Dec is Day 2: (weekend intervenes): The 11th Dec is day 4 : the 13th Dec is Day 6: (weekend intervenes) the 17th Dec is day 8, at the END of which you can be sure the money is yours.

If the Co-op hadn't got those two extra days the money would have been yours on 14th Dec.

I still do not believe you or your mother were acting fraudulently.
You were badly advised by the bank, and as i said in an earlier post people tend not to post full details on the forum so advice can be skewed

[des8]

Re: Hello Lovely People!

Hello Leclerc,

so am I right in thinking that you think that Des8's reference to 8 days means 8 calendar days and the reference to 6 days is just the 6 working days?

Do you think it likely that the bank would not tell the Ombudsman (let alone the police) if they were alleging fraud? I don't know what makes you think that fraud could possibly be involved. This set of circumstances could not possibly be created by me, it is the bank not meeting its own T&Cs that has created. It was the bank not chasing the cheque, it was the bank clearing the cheque etc. that has created this seemingly unique set of circumstances.

I agree that throwing the cheque in the bin is nonsense, (but I have the copy of the recording), but during the week, I was also told other nonsense, so when I was told about that the funds were cleared on a cheque that would bounce, that seemed to me to be similar nonsense. Please bear in mind that the bank is, in my opinion, deliberately withholding the recording of the final call as it so strongly supports my case. I told them it was nonsense, I asked how it would apply if it were for a million and they said it was just the same. A fraudster would presumably have gone straight to the bank, removed the cash and closed the account on the 14th.

However, the facts are the facts and you have not suggested any legal base to your view, the fact that it seems ridiculous does not make it a legal truth, so unless you do have some proper base to your view you are not bringing anything useful to the discussion, so I will leave it until you can.

Nicola, I don't believe Leclerc was accusing you of fraud. When he says "The bank must believe you to be in collusion" I believe he means "one".

[Nicola Bell]

Re: Hello Lovely People!

hello Amethyst,

Thanks for your view on this.

The T&Cs do not mention a time for deposits for payments made through the post office, only for payments made through the bank itself. The actual day of deposit was Wednesday 5th of December 2012, so Thursday 6th is day 2, Friday 7th would be day 3, Monday 10th would be day 4, Tuesday 11th would be day 5, Wednesday 12th would be day 6, Thursday 13th would be day 7, Friday 14th would be day 8,
The funds were only removed after that.
regards,
Chris

regards,

Nicola

[Nicola Bell]

Re: Hello Lovely People!

Des8,

thank you for your interpretation, I will assume that you are right.

Nicola

[Nicola Bell]

Re: Hello Lovely People!

Amethyst, you said that
T is the day the cheque is received by the financial institution and credited to the account, can I ask what makes you say that?

Also, to answer an earlier question that I have just seen, yes the £35,000 was paid, there was no loss to me,

Nicola

[spirit2534]

Re: Hello Lovely People!

Just a note of appreciation.

In today's world to find people who are not motivated by greed, by thoughts of personal gain but just wish to help others.

That does seem to be the essence of what Legal Beagles is about.:carolers:

[Amethyst]

Re: Hello Lovely People!

Amethyst, you said that
T is the day the cheque is received by the financial institution and credited to the account, can I ask what makes you say that?

http://www.co-operativebank.co.uk/bu...clearing-cycle


Judging by that page...

Weds 5th - Deposit to post office
Thurs 6th -
Friday 7th - received at bank ( T day )
s
s
Monday 10th -
tue 11th - - T+2
wed 12th -
thu 13th - T+4
fri 14th -
s
s
mon 17th - T+6
tue 18th - can use funds and be sure they won't be taken out of the account if the cheque bounces ( still would owe the money but they couldn't just take it back they'd have to arrange for you to repay it)

[Nicola Bell]

Re: Hello Lovely People!

hello Amethyst,

can I ask why you say it was received at bank on the 7th?

[Amethyst]

Re: Hello Lovely People!

Because you paid it in at the Post Office on the 5th ?


What day did the cheque first show on your account btw ( should be on your statement - actually it might help everyone if you post up a copy of your statement ( irrelevant bits removed of course))

[Nicola Bell]

Re: Hello Lovely People!

hi,

just seen your link, sorry! Had a look at the page but in my case the cheque was not shown on the account until the 14th, so if these were the rules, the cheque would not have cleared until the 28th of December - given the bank hols. In any event these would not override the T&Cs would they?

[Amethyst]

Re: Hello Lovely People!

Yes I'd agree with you there.

What date did you pay in the cheque which was subsequently cancelled ?

[Nicola Bell]

Re: Hello Lovely People!

hi, second cheque was paid in on the 13th, same day the other one was cancelled,

unfortunately I have to go out now but will be back, thanks for your interest, appreciate your thoughts and will respond latermashappy:

[Amethyst]

Re: Hello Lovely People!

So why are we working on the basis the cheque was paid in on the 5th ?

If the cheque paid in on the 5th was cancelled then you knew it would not be clearing into your account. Regardless of what the computer said you knew it was not going to be paid.

The cheque paid in on the 13th is the one we're bothered about. That one bounced and you'd taken the funds out before the 6 days. Therefore they had every right to take the money back out of your account.

Unless I'm just incredibly confused lol.

Anyway, Merry Christmas xxxx

[Nicola Bell]

Re: Hello Lovely People!

hi,

the relevant cheque is the first cheque, paid in on the 5th. The second cheque is not really relevant to the issue at all (except that it could explain the action of the bank in clearing the funds from the first cheque).

The issue is that the first cheque had cleared and so following the rules, I believe they are mine even though this would constitute a windfall. Once the 6/8 days are passed and the cheque cleared, the funds are mine and as far as I can see the bank has no right to take them back. That is what the 6/8 day rules are about.

I'm not sure if this will come out but I've put below the extract from the 18th

	[IMG]file:///C:\Users\chris\AppData\Local\Temp\msohtml1\01\clip _image001.gif[/IMG]	[IMG]file:///C:\Users\chris\AppData\Local\Temp\msohtml1\01\clip _image002.gif[/IMG]	[IMG]file:///C:\Users\chris\AppData\Local\Temp\msohtml1\01\clip _image003.gif[/IMG] [IMG]file:///C:\Users\chris\AppData\Local\Temp\msohtml1\01\clip _image004.gif[/IMG]
	Tuesday 18 December 2012
Recent Items [IMG]file:///C:\Users\chris\AppData\Local\Temp\msohtml1\01\clip _image005.gif[/IMG] CURRENT ACCOUNT Account Balance £9027.00 CR Overdraft Limit £ 0.00 Available Balance £9027.00 CR (Available balance does not include your agreed overdraft limit) 17/12/2012 TFR ************* £35000.00 17/12/2012 TFR ************* £25.00 17/12/2012 UNPAID £35000.00 14/12/2012 000000 CREDIT £35000.00 *Last Statement* - £44052.00 CR and on the 19th CURRENT ACCOUNT Account Balance £25973.00 DR Overdraft Limit £ 0.00 Available Balance £25973.00 DR (Available balance does not include your agreed overdraft limit) 19/12/2012 UNPAID £35000.00 17/12/2012 TFR *********** £35000.00 17/12/2012 TFR ********** £25.00 17/12/2012 UNPAID £35000.00 14/12/2012 000000 CREDIT £35000.00 *Last Statement* - £44052.00 CR

I don't know if this helps,

happy Christmas to you too:reindeer: