HELP! What Now? Hardship conclusion?

[natweststaffmember]

Re: HELP! What Now? Hardship conclusion?

what about the providers you were in arrears with?
Did they offer any help either?

the Lending Code, section 9 states this:

"137. Subscribers should be sympathetic and positive when considering a customer’s financial difficulties. Although there is
an onus on customers to try to help themselves, the first step, when a subscriber becomes aware of a customer’s
financial difficulties, should be to try to contact the customer to discuss the matter. This applies to both personal and
micro-enterprise customers."

The questions may sound as though I am saying what did you do to help yourself with the creditors that you are in arrears with but I am making sure that everything possible has been done and can be given to the banks so that they cannot say that you have not done everything prior to approaching the bank on financial hardship.

[MrsSkint]

Re: HELP! What Now? Hardship conclusion?

Good Luck Catinahat xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
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You know the more I read about how people are treated by the banks, the more I'd love to round the whole bloody lot of them up, put them all into a field and BOMB the barstewards.
Rant over x

[catinahat]

Re: HELP! What Now? Hardship conclusion?

[

The questions may sound as though I am saying what did you do to help yourself with the creditors that you are in arrears with but I am making sure that everything possible has been done and can be given to the banks so that they cannot say that you have not done everything prior to approaching the bank on financial hardship.[/QUOTE]

That's a fair enough point Nattie. I think I did as much as I could have. In terms of the utility bill arrears, I paid a set amount off the arrears and a fixed amount from my benefits, which I asked the DWP to arrange on my behalf through the fuel direct set up. (ie they deduct the money from my benefits and pay it to the utility companies; this reduces the amount owed and ensures the debt doesn't increase cos you're always paying ahead; winter and summer the same. This was fine with all except british gas who for whatever reasons, weren't happy or willing to accept this arrangement. The others, ie electric/water mainly, I paid the arrears and then the gov changes with benefits and other probs meant the bills piled back up and at that point, I wasn't even getting benefits through properly nor knew when my money was gonna be sorted, so had nothing, literally, to offer. I think I did as much as I could, but I suppose the bank might argue that. I don't know to be honest. Just been a constant ebb of different problems and at times, I've felt like I was really at the end of the line, so maybe I did stick my head in sand some of the time. I am being honest when I say I did as much to help myself as I could, at the time and within my limits Nats. (If that makes sense?)
In a word tho, I don't think there was any of the companies whom I owed, who were even remotely helpful or did anything to help. I suppose too I didn't expect them to help. Just hoped they'd be a bit 'human'. (naive maybe).
CatX

[TUTTSI]

Re: HELP! What Now? Hardship conclusion?

Hi Cat

You wrote explaining about your hardship on 19 Oct 2009 which was definately during the FSA waiver and then on 4th November they asked you to complete an I &E statement and forward more documents to them which I presume you sent them back before the 25 Nov 2009.

Please draft a letter up and post it on here to the Co-Op as you will need a final response from them before complaining to the FOS. Also remind them that your claim for hardship was definately made during the FSA waiver and the rules for hardship were in place at that time. (Maybe for some reason they never received your documents)

Fully document by way of a timeline in your letter the complete history and personally I would address it to the CEO. I will give you his details shortly and maybe send him copies of all the correspondence for ease of comfort.

<<<<<hugs>>>>>>>.

Tuttsi xx

http://www.co-operative.coop/

Peter Marks, Chief Executivepeter.marks@co-operative.coop sorry could only find an email address.

[catinahat]

Re: HELP! What Now? Hardship conclusion?

HI Everybody,
wondered if I might ask once again for your collective brain power; I honestly can't see the wood for the trees with my bank claim at the moment. I know it probably seems exceptionally dense on my part, but to be honest, everytime I start to try and reply/ respond to the last letter I got from them (which is posted in this thread I believe?) I'm just hitting a blank. I understand this letter is pretty 'standard format', the one the bank sent me a couple of weeks ago, but since I've already sent them documents (of which I have proof they were signed for by the bank - on 2 separate occasions for the proof of hardship docs) I'm just not sure really how I need to word my response. I was thinking along the lines of, " its been well over 8 weeks since I lodged my complaint/reclaim under hardship, I've done all you've asked of me, jumped through the hoops, sent you all the requisite proof of hardship etc, been patient and accepted your 'apologies for tghe delays in resolving this'; and now, after you've tied me up and bamboozled me with legal gobble de gook (after all, I am only a cat....) fobbed me off with waiting games, passed the book under the guise of responding to my hardship issues under 'separate cover', you have the audacity to send me this standard brush off letter, which fails to adress any of the issues I raised... and frankly, I am mightily P****d off now. I therefore am politely informing you that I'm not happy with the abyssmal way you've dealt with me, you've been anything but fair, or sympathetic, so I am now taking my bat and ball to someone you might not be able to p**** about so easily, the FOS!!! Hopefully, they'll have bigger bats and more balls in which to exert a more lasting slap up your procastinating smug little mugs, than you think you've given to me. Thanks for nothing oh ethical ones... yours cynically and almost fossilised in time (waiting for your 'swift resolution' not...!!!) Cat. (or something along those lines... My PS would be sorely tempted to advise them that their right hand has no idea of the mucky stuff their left is up to... and vice versa!!) Ok, I admit I have perhaps included a little bit of a vent in this 'draft' but you get the general idea... Is that the kind of thing I should be saying to them now as I don't want them to just 'close' my file and think that's the end of ir. I'm kind of concerned about this 8 week time frame too. Even if they logged my initial complaint as Oct 7, that's well over 8 weeks (their delays, not mine) so would FOS listen cos they might say my case 'timed out?' Your suggestions as always, would be very welcome.

PS Tutts, I appreciate you getting that email addy of the smile bank's big cheese, I'm wondering if sending a response to their letter generally as along the gist of the above, whilst simultaneously following your suggestion with a cover letter, might be an idea? I just keep drawing a blank and hitting a brick wall every time I try to get it all together though. Hope some of this makes even a tiny modicum of sense...? Cheers again dear LB's, Hugs, CatXXX
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General gist of how I should proceed/ letter to reply to my banks recent 'brush off'....

...." its been well over 8 weeks since I lodged my complaint/reclaim under hardship, I've done all you've asked of me, jumped through the hoops, sent you all the requisite proof of hardship etc, been patient and accepted your 'apologies for tghe delays in resolving this'; and now, after you've tied me up and bamboozled me with legal gobble de gook (after all, I am only a cat....) fobbed me off with waiting games, passed the book under the guise of responding to my hardship issues under 'separate cover', you have the audacity to send me this standard brush off letter, which fails to adress any of the issues I raised... and frankly, I am mightily P****d off now. I therefore am politely informing you that I'm not happy with the abyssmal way you've dealt with me, you've been anything but fair, or sympathetic, so I am now taking my bat and ball to someone you might not be able to p**** about so easily, the FOS!!! Hopefully, they'll have bigger bats and more balls in which to exert a more lasting slap up your procastinating smug little mugs, than you think you've given to me. Thanks for nothing oh ethical ones... yours cynically and almost fossilised in time (waiting for your 'swift resolution' not...!!!) Cat. (or something along those lines... My PS would be sorely tempted to advise them that their right hand has no idea of the mucky stuff their left is up to either!!! And Vice versa.... ;-)

[charitynjw]

Re: HELP! What Now? Hardship conclusion?

Hi cat

,...............sorely tempted to advise them that their right hand has no idea of the mucky stuff their left is up to........

pmsl

Why be coy - why not tell them what you really think of them (only joking msl

[TUTTSI]

Re: HELP! What Now? Hardship conclusion?

Hi Cat

What you need is a letter set out in straight forward points and just email to the CEO and (if you can scan in your letters with the email then do so and say in the letter that you have included them)as I have given you his details alteady. It should go something like this:-
Cat xxxxxx
Addr xxxxx
xxxxxxxxx

Phone number xxxxx


Dear Mr CEO xxxxxxxx

My Account No:- xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx

I am writing this letter of complaint to you following my disappointment from your customer services team who have not dealt properly with my claim under Financial Hardship and which was commenced during the time of the FSA waiver rules for Financial Hardship, I have never received a final response to my hardship claim.

1. My first letter advised the The Co-Operative Bank of my financial hardship and this was sent on xxxxxxxxxx .

2. A response from your Customer Services on requesting further evidences xxxxxxx

3. I sent the all evidences they requested which included (list all the evidences you sent them)xxxxxxxxxxx on xxxxxx

4. I then received a letter dated xxxxxxxxx from your customer services team on xxxxxxxxxx advising me that xxxxxxxxxxx

I do not consider that The Co-Operative Bank xxxxx had given any consideration to my claim in accordance with the FSA waiver rules for Financial Hardship as the claim was sent in to them well before the expiry of the lifting of the waiver. Can I please ask you to look into this matter and remedy.

Should I not receive a satisfactory response from you I will definitely send my complaint to the FSA for further investigation.

YS
Cat


Maybe someone else can add or tighten this letter up a bit more, but this is the type of complaint letter I sent to Aviva by email recently got a hamper out of it a Policy re-instated etc etc...and it worked for me. If you cannot scan the letters I would be inclined to tell them you can post them to them if they require. Just ensure that the time line in the letter fully documents what happened.

By this time next week you will have had a response - trust me.

Tuttsi xxx

[Amethyst]

Re: HELP! What Now? Hardship conclusion?

I might also add in something about this from the Lending Code Standards Board on 29th January ( http://www.lendingstandardsboard.org...lletin_no1.pdf )

''Complaints about financial difficulties arising from bank charges
Following the conclusion of the unauthorised overdraft charges
test case the complaint handling waiver was withdrawn and we
are aware that the FSA is working with firms on the processes to
clear reserved complaints. Despite the Supreme Court
judgement, we would remind firms that wherever a customer
contacts their lender expressing concern about financial
difficulties, they should be treated as required by Section 9 of the
Code, irrespective of the way that these difficulties have arisen.
We have seen media reports that some consumers are not being
treated sympathetically and positively when they contact their
lender to say that bank charges are creating or exacerbating their
financial difficulties. We are doing some research in this area and
if we feel that there is a potential issue of systemic concern, we
will undertake a more detailed investigation. In the mean time,
Compliance Officers should remind business line colleagues of the
need to investigate and respond to complaints appropriately.
LSB Bulletin''

[catinahat]

Re: HELP! What Now? Hardship conclusion?

Lol, believe me, I would LOVE to let rip and tell them my true thoughts...
Alas, I somehow think that honesty would most certainly NOT be the best policy on this occassion...;-) X
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Tutts you are a saviour!

Thank you so much! My brain cell just kept locking up every time I started to try and draft something. This is absolutely a huge help and just the thing I've been trying to construct (without success due to brain fog) and I cannot thank you enough. Big hugs, Cat
Xxx

[catinahat]

Re: HELP! What Now? Hardship conclusion?

Draft of Letter to Co-op bank re- hardship/complaint rejected

To the CEO of Smile internet bank

Huge thanks to Tuttsi for walking me through this. I would probably still be banging my head up against a brick wall trying to get the words in which to start this.

I am writing this letter of complaint to you following my disappointment from your customer services team who have not dealt properly with my claim under Financial Hardship and which was commenced during the time of the FSA waiver rules for Financial Hardship, I have never received a final response to my hardship claim.

1. My first letter advised the The Co-Operative Bank of my financial hardship and this was sent on October 19 2009 and was signed for by the recipient on October 23 2009. This letter clearly outlined that I was in financial hardship and I enclosed substantiating documents along with my letter at this time.

2. I received an acknowledgement letter from your customer feedback people dated October 29 2009. This letter made a brief acknowledgement that my letter ' refers to the fact I have experienced difficult financial circumstances...'
It then went on to explain at length, about the legal proceedings between the O.F.T. and a number of banks. The letter also explained in detail, that a 'stay' was in place on all reclaim cases etc/ the waiver and stated my case would be resolved as quickly as possible once these legal proceedings were completed.

3 I received a response from your Customer Services dated November 4 2009 requesting further evidences namely, a financial statement and specifically, proof of income/benefits/pensions for the last six months and proof of rent/mortgage payments.

4. I sent the all evidences they requested which included proof of state benefits ie Income support, which was then changed over to Employment support allowance, proof of ESA entitlement, Disability living allowance documentation, proof of rent, copies of rent statements, notification of rent increases and charges for coming year from my landlord (Housing Association), proof of lone parent benefit/status, copies of utilities bills; Gas, Water,Electric. Copies of pre legal action letters, non payment/ unreturned direct debit letters for other bills such as TV license, proof of multiple applications for crisis loans from Social Fund at DWP, copies of letters from hospital detailing appointments/investigations ie MRI brain scan etc and just about every proof I could find to inform you of how dire my circumstances are. I also included proof of letters receieved from your own debt collection agency ' Moorcroft'.

4. I then received a letter dated December 4 2009 from your customer services advising me that my concerns would be investigated by a case handler from this department. I was also sent your A4 leaflet - Our Commitment to handling complaints. This letter assured that the individual investigating my case would be in contact should further information be needed to investigate matters I have raised.

5. I received a further letter on December 16 2009 apologising that a decision connected to my complaint could not yet be given as 'investigations were continuing'. The letter assured me that my concerns were still receiving attention, I was thanked for my patience and informed that they expected to reach a conclusion by January 16 2010.

6. I received a standard letter January 8 2010 from your customer feedback people that yet again, detailed the OFT case V banks, the supreme court rulings/findings etc etc

7. The final letter I received dated January 20th 2010 reiterated previous letters, insomuch as detailing the legal proceedings between the OFT/Banks and the supreme court rule detailed in the November 25th judgement. This letter concluded the outcome to my complaint and I quote... " We are satisfied that our charges are lawful and fair and, given the supreme court's decision, we have decided that your complaint should be rejected...." (end quote)

I do not consider that The Co-Operative Bank had given any consideration to my claim in accordance with the FSA waiver rules for Financial Hardship, as the claim was sent in to them well before the expiry of the lifting of the waiver.I sent in numerous documents evidencing that myself and children were experiencing severe hardship; this I reiterated in every letter I sent. Can I please ask you to look into this matter and remedy. To my knowledge, no case handler was assigned to my complaint. If they were, then they did not identify themselves in such a role as every single written document I have received from the Co-op bank, in relation to this matter, has had a different name signed at the end. The same person's name has never appeared more than once in any of the correspondence I have received.
I am frankly disappointed with the lack of real help and proper attention given to my situation/complaint.It has caused me an immeasurable amount of stress and only exacerbated what was already a very difficult time for myself and my family. I had expected more from the 'Ethical bank'. At the very least, that they would uphold their promise/commitment in handling hardship cases.

[catinahat]

Re: HELP! What Now? Hardship conclusion?

:beagle:

Ame, Tutts, Nattie, Enaid, Budgie, Sapphy and all LB's, can I just let you all know just how blooming FABULOUS you all are?
Now I may have said this before, but it happens to be true. So Thank you, from my heart. I can't tell you how good it feels to have got that letter and time line written up at last. Y'know when something that you'd normally find a relatively straightforward task, suddenly grows horns and a fork tongue and starts going 'Blaaaaaaahhhhh!!!' in your face...? Not to mention grows bigger than ten storey giant!!??? Well, that's what that letter had become. So, whatever the outcome as a result of this, right now I feel like I've shooed a monster away (with a lotta help from some friends:-)) Just don't want you to think these things get taken for granted. They don't. So.... cheers to you all and my thanks..... and .... win, lose, or draw,
.... here's to glasses that cheer but don't inebriate...!!! (though if its a win, they might just do....

[Amethyst]

Re: HELP! What Now? Hardship conclusion?

Thats great, get it sent off

[charitynjw]

Re: HELP! What Now? Hardship conclusion?

Re post #25

cat highlights a typical problem here:-

"To my knowledge, no case handler was assigned to my complaint. If they were, then they did not identify themselves in such a role as every single written document I have received from the Co-op bank, in relation to this matter, has had a different name signed at the end. The same person's name has never appeared more than once in any of the correspondence I have received."

Perhaps included in the initial correspondence (or if already ongoing, the next response) there is a request for a nominated person/dept. to "take ownership" of the dispute, & to identify that person/dept.

[TUTTSI]

Re: HELP! What Now? Hardship conclusion?

Well done Cat, has it gone yet???

Tuttsi xx

[catinahat]

Re: HELP! What Now? Hardship conclusion?

Hi Tutts, Ame, everybody,

Yup, sent it off earlier today:-)) well, yesterday now should I say, its after midnight:-)) Thanks again guys, I await the next enthralling episode from Mr Big enchilada at smile... Hugs, CatXXX
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Hi Charity,
you're right, it would be helpful if they assigned a specific person to head a particular customer's case. Its always better to have a letter or any correspondence addressed to a particular person as opposed to a 'whom it may concern' scenario. Gives you a 'point of contact' and it'd make the who complaints procedure far more cohesive than the 'itty-bitty' raggle taggle disorganised manner than things are running at present.
Perhaps another point worth mentioning in the 'Banks changes etc what do you want' manifesto or 'wish list...?' Cheers Charity:-)) X