Ernest Wilson

[tonsorial.artist]

Re: Ernest Wilson Debt

Yes I printed hard copy of the 8 glowing reviews (or not) before e w had them removed!

Hi there is there any chance you could get the hard copy's to me

[EW Client]

Re: Ernest Wilson Debt

Hi there is there any chance you could get the hard copy's to me

The reviews are archived on wayback machine at http://web.archive.org/web/201211300...t-Wilson-Leeds and there are a few references to Ernest Wilson on just answer which might be of interest. Also there was apparently an Ernest Wilson complaints blog that seems to have disappeared...

[EW Client]

Re: Ernest Wilson

I've found out a little more about Ernest Wilson. In its 2011 accounts the debtors figure was £792,000, with cash in hand and at bank £35,000. In 2012 debtors were reduced to £104,000 and cash increased to £308,000. I can take a guess with interpreting the figures but I'd be grateful for informed opinions!

Also, I'm preparing a submission to OFT about the trading practices of business transfer agents in general as the ombudsman has basically stuck his fingers in his ears and said 'I can't hear you, na na na'. I know there are a few people on here who've had to deal with the unpleasant side of the business transfer agency industry and I'd welcome any testimonies as evidence of sharp practices.

[EJB]

Re: Ernest Wilson

[QUOTE=EW Client;419946]I've found out a little more about Ernest Wilson. In its 2011 accounts the debtors figure was £792,000, with cash in hand and at bank £35,000. In 2012 debtors were reduced to £104,000 and cash increased to £308,000. I can take a guess with interpreting the figures but I'd be grateful for informed opinions!

Sounds like they decided to use loopholes in there at best 'ambiguous' contracts to retrieve money from all of the business they had on their books who were no longer viable, and who had racked up thousands of pounds in charges.

My brother and sister in law have had a letter to state that there property sale is no longer viable to Earnest Wilson, and unless they agree to an amendment of their commission terms, from 'no sale no fee' to £2000 plus VAT upfront and all marketing and advertising fees accrued, upon sale (which will never happen)

They say if they don't agree to change these terms, that they will end the contract and they will be liable to pay almost £10k in advertising and marketing fees. What I don't understand, is that, due to the property being worth well in excess of £60k the contract clearly states only a 5% plus VAT commission will be taken. Nowhere does it state that they can charge all marketing and advertising fees in the event that the contract is ended by Earnest Wilson. Is this the case with anyone else?

[EW Client]

Re: Ernest Wilson

Seems like there are a few different versions of their contracts floating around. Some don't mention fees and some have them hidden in the small print - there are also documented cases of the client being given a different contract to the one they've signed. In every case I've seen though the common factor is that the client has been categorically told no sale, no fee (which sounds perfectly plausible if you've only dealt with residential estate agents) then when the property doesn't sell, the agent turns off the niceness and starts chasing for hefty fees.

[Amethyst]

Re: Ernest Wilson

I don't know much in the way of detail but one customer of EW did go to court to defend against their charges and lost. Whether that was because it was poorly argued or the Judge actually deemed the T&C's fair, or because it was deemed a business contract and thus should have been individually negotiated before signing etc I don't know, but just thought you should be aware of that as with all these kind of things one loss in court gets bandied about when others try to fight back.


EJB - ''My brother and sister in law have had a letter to state that there property sale is no longer viable to Earnest Wilson, and unless they agree to an amendment of their commission terms, from 'no sale no fee' to £2000 plus VAT upfront and all marketing and advertising fees accrued, upon sale''

Could you possibly post a copy of the letter up? (redacted of course)


Also EW Client - '' there are also documented cases of the client being given a different contract to the one they've signed.'' - can you point us in that direction?

[EW Client]

Re: Ernest Wilson

I don't know much in the way of detail but one customer of EW did go to court to defend against their charges and lost. Whether that was because it was poorly argued or the Judge actually deemed the T&C's fair, or because it was deemed a business contract and thus should have been individually negotiated before signing etc I don't know, but just thought you should be aware of that as with all these kind of things one loss in court gets bandied about when others try to fight back.

Yes, that seems to be the problem - EW are very clever when it comes to the finer details and as far as I can gather they have plenty of experience in the small claims court. The client may well believe that terms have been individually negotiated but EW have been able to successfully argue otherwise.

Also EW Client - '' there are also documented cases of the client being given a different contract to the one they've signed.'' - can you point us in that direction?

It's in the notes from this NFoPP disciplinary tribunal hearing in June 2012: http://www.nfopp-regulation.co.uk/me...co_limited.pdf

The Tribunal found that one of the firm's practices is unfair to the public. The practice is the giving to a seller client a copy of the agency agreement document for the sale of their business that is not identical to the version the client has signed. The first page recording details of the business, including the asking price, as well as any separate valuation figure, is replaced by a page setting out a summary of the firm's charges and the title is changed to a Terms of Business document.

[EW Client]

Re: Ernest Wilson

Shameless bump - a FOI request has revealed that EW has made 49 claims through the small claims court!

Which means that they're extremely unlucky, being forced to chase all those clients through the courts for non payment of invoices, or that they frequently use the courts for dispute resolution and don't have any qualms about suing their clients.

[Amethyst]

Re: Ernest Wilson

Does it show cases bought, or just CCJ's ?

Who did you FOI ?

Registry Trust will show CCJ's (ie cases where they either won in court or the defendant admitted and offered installment payments)

[EW Client]

Re: Ernest Wilson

Does it show cases bought, or just CCJ's ?

Who did you FOI ?

The FOI request was to the County Court Money Claims Centre in Salford, which handles small claims. The only information they supplied in response to my original enquiry was the number of claims - I've asked them for more details (eg dates etc.).

Registry Trust will show CCJ's (ie cases where they either won in court or the defendant admitted and offered installment payments)

Thanks for that, I wasn't aware of Registry Trust. The CCJ Register doesn't contain details of the claimant though, unfortunately.

[Amethyst]

Re: Ernest Wilson

Yes, that is rather annoying, I just wondered if you'd FOI'd registry trust to get the list sorted on claimant, as that could be useful for other issues.

Good to know Salford will respond to an FOI on claims bought. Presumably it's the same with Northampton bulk centre (or has the history been moved to Salford too now?). Can think of a couple firms I'd like to find out just how many claims they bought in the last few years.

Thank you.

[EW Client]

Re: Ernest Wilson

Yes, that is rather annoying, I just wondered if you'd FOI'd registry trust to get the list sorted on claimant, as that could be useful for other issues.

Being able to search by defendant but not claimant seems like quite an omission really, with the benefit of hindsight there are times when it'd be handy to find out whether the company you're thinking of dealing with is likely to sue you!

Good to know Salford will respond to an FOI on claims bought. Presumably it's the same with Northampton bulk centre (or has the history been moved to Salford too now?). Can think of a couple firms I'd like to find out just how many claims they bought in the last few years.

The court docs are headed Northampton County Court but the address is Salford CCMCC, if that helps. Never been a defendant before so this is all new to me...

[EW Client]

Re: Ernest Wilson

Bit more info I've just received - the time period for Ernest Wilson's 49 claims was June 2012 to November 2013.

49 claims in 16 months!!

[tonsorial.artist]

Re: Ernest Wilson

Hi

i am currently researching Ernest Wilson business transfer agents as i am locked in a complicated legal battle with them.


In 2008 a sales rep from Ernest Wilson came to value my business under a strict no sale no fee understanding

the agent was told that in 8 months from that point if they had not sold the business the lease would be allowed to run and the property returned to the landlord as we had already started relocation
they valued the business way over what i believed to be a reasonable or fair amount but they were confident that's what they could achieve ;
i was skepticle to say the least but with a no sale no fee arrangement what did i have to lose ??
subsequesntly the lease ran down and Ernest Wilson failed to find a viable buyer and so i informed their rep that the premises had been vacated and the business was no longer for sale
that was the end of that i presumed ??
not so fast ...
least year their legal attack dog Mr Stuart Morehouse started legal proceedings for £4245.80 mainly made up of advertising fees to which i never agreed to nor do they have an authorized signature allowing them to do so

after many days in court ( mainly not knowing what the hell i am doing ) they have managed to gain a court judgement against me for the amount of £6700.....to which i was absolutely speechless at !!!
i came away baffled at the way Stuart Morehouse conducts himself in court, there am i not knowing what is happening and this man seems very much at home there ??
over the last week since losing the case ( which i am of course appealing as they are now trying to put a charging order on our property!!)
i am starting to uncover information that i am not the only person this may have happened to, so far i have found your article named and shaming them publicly and the N.F.O.P.P publication relating to their displeasure of Ernest Wilson's vague contracts, not to mention the Internet forums packed with people who seem to have had very similar experiences to me relating to the way these companies are doing business

Below are some of the points i am finding



1. overvaluing business's at source wilfully knowing it's unachievable just to get you to sign the contract.

2. knowing that even if the business does not sell they will still get paid for fees i did not agree regarding unauthorised advertising costs.

3.using their knowledge and experience in the small claims court to enforce these vague contracts.

4.adding paperwork at will to win court cases.
5.failing to fill abide by their own terms of business as laid out in their terms.
6 willfully making up a case as they go along in order to win



i am currently building a case against Ernest Wilson hoping to gain as much support as i possibly can ??
I am also contacting my local paper and the BBC to enquire if watchdog would be interested in my case

any help or support you could give me would be gratefully received

many thanks for reading this

[MissFM]

Re: Ernest Wilson

http://www.nfopp-regulation.co.uk/co...-outcomes.aspx

If you scroll down you will see that there are several findings against EW (who seem to be almost supernaturally able to wipe any unflattering info about themselves from the internet - all the links provided in posts above no longer work, and that's just the tip of the iceberg as regards what was once on this thread before it was purged).

The fines imposed are, as you see, negligible in comparison to the alleged gains made from what could appear to be a business model based on deception and client gullibility.

I have no personal stake in this but am horrified by the experiences reported and will help and support in any way I can.

Good luck to you all x