Is it safe to contest the CCA?

[pt2537]

Re: Is it safe to contest the CCA?

Reference the Mrs J case on the Watsons website. http://www.watsonssolicitors.co.uk/n...tail.php?id=18

If, a creditor can't provide a true copy of the CCA and if, a reconstructed CCA is also unavailable or is unacceptable (I don't fully understand the technicalties but undersdtand that recons can sometimes be invalid), then does it follow that this would be irredeemeably unenforceable?

unenforceability can still be argued on older credit agreements and I am really interested in getting a solicitor to look into mine with Barclaycard if they don't send the FOS the reconstructed copy they claim to have. The card goes back to 1999 so is a recon likely to be acceptable anyway?

Also, how are these cases funded? Do Watsons and other firms of solicitors work on a no-win no fee basis? But what about adverse costs?

Apologies if these are dumb questions.

I actually did the summary judgment hearing agaisnt the bank, so i can speak from personal knowledge.

There could be no true copy of a document that never existed, that is a fallacy if the bank suggests other wise, we had a letter from the bank confirming their error, so 61(1)(a) was never complied with end of story, the judge did not hesitate in granting summary judgment, and indemnity costs tooo



In respect of costs and no win no fee

lets clear some myths,

CFA - Conditional Fee Agreements are no win no fee documents, they do not mean that the solicitor works for free at all. The indemnity principle means that the loser of a claim pays the winners costs within reason.

CFA means that there will be a bill which the client will be liable for at the end of the litigation but the client will in most cases be able to recover the bill from the opponent

Disbursements are the responsibility of the client, this is in the agreement itself, these are things like application fees and Counsels fees.

However, we do at our discretion, assist people with Counsels fees, but that does depend on each case.

If the claim is lost, then there is no bill save for disbursements, payable to us but the other side will be entitled to their costs.

Thankfully, we dont lose much, so it doesnt arise that often,

[The Debt Star]

Re: Is it safe to contest the CCA?

Thanks on the cfa clarification. I suspect though that most debtors acn't afford a barrister's opinion on the merits though and most firm's would be reluctant to shell that out as a disbursement. that must put a lot of potential claimant's off I think.

is the insurance expensive? is it based on counsel's opinion?

on the absent agreement issue, does it follow that if a true copy and a reconstructed copy can't be supplied, that it can be argued there never was an agreement....a la Mrs J? I guess it would be unacceptable to say "I can't remember" if there was a CAA it was so long ago"..............?

[pt2537]

Re: Is it safe to contest the CCA?

no Mrs Js case wasnt that she couldnt remember, it was that she was asked in branch if she would like a credit card, she said no, she then received one through the post without warning

I cant really answer those questions as each case does turn on its merits

[The Debt Star]

Re: Is it safe to contest the CCA?

ok. if Barclaycard don't have a copy CCA then I'll probably be in touch!

[middenmess]

Re: Is it safe to contest the CCA?

ok. if Barclaycard don't have a copy CCA then I'll probably be in touch!

Looking like there might be a glimmer of light at the end of your tunnel

[The Debt Star]

Re: Is it safe to contest the CCA?

Looking like there might be a glimmer of light at the end of your tunnel

I need it mate. Barclaycard have been complete pigs in their dealings with me. The FOS have indicated I can't expect any help, but at least they have written to BC asking for a copy of the CCA, reconstructed or otherwise.

[Chalkitup]

Re: Is it safe to contest the CCA?

Hello Debt Star,

I might be in touch also!!

Barclaycard are still adding £270 a month interest on my account.

They only started adding it after CCCS stopped my DMP as I am on benefits with no cash over each month to pay creditors!!!!

Hardly fair!!!!! Seeing as they stopped the interest about two years ago but then I fall into deeper hard times and they start it again.

Where is the sense and logic in that?

[The Debt Star]

Re: Is it safe to contest the CCA?

The biggest hurdle we face, if we bring proceedings against BC, is paying for Counsel's Opinion on the merits of a case. Barrister's would charge £1000-£1500 plus VAT for an Opinion, or thereabouts. Thats the problem.

It looks like there is insurance available and CFAs for costs, on the strengths of a case.

What is needed is some sort of fighting fund and which, one wonders, could be raised on sites like this from voluntary donations? A panel of solicito rs and barristers could be set up and, based on the 'merits' of any given case, the fighting fund used to pay for Counsel's Opinion and possibly other disbursements.

[Amethyst]

Re: Is it safe to contest the CCA?

Me v Tesco/Incasso - Appeal in process

Circuit Judge refuses appeal saying DN deemed served on day it was posted, not day it was received. (ie interpretation act doesnt apply)

[pt2537]

Re: Is it safe to contest the CCA?

yeah, the judges logic does appear sound, sadly,


the CCA does address service of documents and the IA 78 s7 does include the words "unless the contrary intention appears"

Therefore the judge has concluded that the IA is ousted. In general contract law, where the postal rule applies to acceptance of offers, the offer is deemed accepted when the letter is put in the hands of the royal mail. I guess the judge has drawn a likeness to this in his judgment

[The Debt Star]

Re: Is it safe to contest the CCA?

Me v Tesco/Incasso - Appeal in process

Circuit Judge refuses appeal saying DN deemed served on day it was posted, not day it was received. (ie interpretation act doesnt apply)

I can't comment on CCA stuff, but in probate matters eg application to have a caveat warned off, the applicant is given 8 days to respond and the first of those 8 days includes the date the notice was posted ie it is deemed to have been served on the caveator on the day it hits the post box. In this CCA case the judge is presumably thinking along these lines.

Does this mean then that creditors have 12 days to supply a CCA from the date the request was posted? That would have been my view...

[Angry Cat]

Re: Is it safe to contest the CCA?

Me v Tesco/Incasso - Appeal in process

Circuit Judge refuses appeal saying DN deemed served on day it was posted, not day it was received. (ie interpretation act doesnt apply)

Astonished!

[pt2537]

Re: Is it safe to contest the CCA?

I think the problem that OP had was that if the default was considered served in the ordinary course of posting, then it would have provided the statutory 14 days in any event.

So, this goes back to what i said before, that each case must be judged on its own merits

[Amethyst]

Re: Is it safe to contest the CCA?

I think the problem that OP had was that if the default was considered served in the ordinary course of posting, then it would have provided the statutory 14 days in any event.

So, this goes back to what i said before, that each case must be judged on its own merits

http://i968.photobucket.com/albums/a...photos/DN1.jpg

http://i968.photobucket.com/albums/a...photos/DN2.jpg


Sent 25th Sept

Remedy by 12th Oct

Why is this in court on the service issue then in the first place, thats a clear 14 days with at least 2 days for postage.


Does this circuit judges refusal to appeal mess things up completely or can we still hold out for Brandons appeal in Dec on the same issue ? (will check his DN dates now too!)

[Amethyst]

Re: Is it safe to contest the CCA?

Or can we tell peeps now that the 14 days is no argument (which'd be nice actually) tho I am rather thinking of Zhan in court today.