Can we sue ATOS & DWP to stop their victimisation of my son-in-law?

[MissFM]

Re: Can we sue ATOS & DWP to stop their victimisation of my son-in-law?

That's extremely encouraging news and well done you - will keep everything crossed that you do get the right result.

It's terrible that you have all been put under so much unnecessary stress by these vampire-like agencies that absorb & waste the resources provided by taxpayers intended to help the most vulnerable amongst us.

Good luck at the hearing! x

[enquirer]

Re: Can we sue ATOS & DWP to stop their victimisation of my son-in-law?

... the Atos nurse can kiss her arse goodbye ...

For the sake of all those whose lives she has already ruined, and for all those whose lives she will go on to ruin ... pursue her personally and to the bitter end.

[silverback12345]

Re: Can we sue ATOS & DWP to stop their victimisation of my son-in-law?

Things are at last on the move. After absolutely ages of getting documents together we received a Tribunal date last week Thursday for 24th of this month.

My Son in law has had his MRI, Nerve conduction studies etc (December) and has had 5 consultant appointments cancelled from December to now. He starts on anti-TNF therapy in a couple of weeks time. The results are back and all the medical evidence is being collected today - so the Atos nurse can kiss her arse goodbye because she will be hard pressed to say she "actually conducted a physical examination with the findings given" when her report is viewed alongside his MRI and range of motion study (done yesterday by consultant).
I will be taking him to his tribunal hearing at the end of the month and also to his PIP examination (the following day). With a little bit of luck we will get a lifetime award out of it this time

Hi VF700fen,
Sorry to hear all the problems you son in law is experiencing with ATOS. I wish him good luck with his PIP claim. The majority of PIP awards will be fixed term and even if he is awarded lifetime he will still be periodically checked.I too have advanced ankylosing spondylitis plus lots of other problems which in my case are secondary conditions of Crohns.
One thing I will advise never take medical evidence to a WCA THEY WILL DISREGARD IT EVERY TIME they rely on using LIMA which in many peoples opinion is unfit for purpose.Always send copies of medical evidence with the ESA50 that way he may not even need a WCA and the DM may award the appropriate benefit.
What benefits is he claiming is it ESA WRAG or support contribution based or income based?

[bluebottle]

Re: Can we sue ATOS & DWP to stop their victimisation of my son-in-law?

Hi VF700fen,
Sorry to hear all the problems you son in law is experiencing with ATOS. I wish him good luck with his PIP claim. The majority of PIP awards will be fixed term and even if he is awarded lifetime he will still be periodically checked.I too have advanced ankylosing spondylitis plus lots of other problems which in my case are secondary conditions of Crohns.
One thing I will advise never take medical evidence to a WCA THEY WILL DISREGARD IT EVERY TIME they rely on using LIMA which in many peoples opinion is unfit for purpose.Always send copies of medical evidence with the ESA50 that way he may not even need a WCA and the DM may award the appropriate benefit.
What benefits is he claiming is it ESA WRAG or support contribution based or income based?

Good solid advice, Silverback. If I may add to it, I am currently in receipt of ESA (Income-Related) due to Fibromyalgia. I was originally put in the WRAG, but since then, my condition has deteriorated to the point where I on DLA as well, the Mobility Component being Higher Rate. When I received an ESA50 back in October last year, I sent in the notes I dictated for the ESA and DLA, together with the award letter for revised DLA. This is because what affects you in your everyday life can also affect you in your working life.

You are absolutely right that the LIMA software used by ATOS has been slammed as "not fit for purpose".

[silverback12345]

Re: Can we sue ATOS & DWP to stop their victimisation of my son-in-law?

Good solid advice, Silverback. If I may add to it, I am currently in receipt of ESA (Income-Related) due to Fibromyalgia. I was originally put in the WRAG, but since then, my condition has deteriorated to the point where I on DLA as well, the Mobility Component being Higher Rate. When I received an ESA50 back in October last year, I sent in the notes I dictated for the ESA and DLA, together with the award letter for revised DLA. This is because what affects you in your everyday life can also affect you in your working life.

You are absolutely right that the LIMA software used by ATOS has been slammed as "not fit for purpose".

After 3 years of trying I was finally awarded DLA high rate mobility low rate care indefinitely that turned out to be a joke with PIP on it's way. A month later I was sent the ESA 50 to transfer from IB to ESA. Luckily I had requested the DLA HCP report I sent that and 25 pages of supporting evidence. I was surprised to be given the maximum 3 year ESA award and placed in the support group without a WCA. Yes I agree sending any support DLA evidence especially if it is from an HCP working for ATOS (SPIT) is certainly worth while.
I am lucky I have home visits by HCP's because I cannot travel so they cannot use LIMA.
One thing that will help with PIP is I note VF700fen son in law has some adaptations and you get awarded points for adaptions with PIP. Reducing the PIP mobility component to 20m from 50m will mean thousands of disabled people will lose their HRMC awards a particularly disgusting way for the Government to save money.

The reason I asked what benefits VF700fen son in law was on is if he is on contribution based he will be receiving less than income based.What the DWP don't tell you is you can transfer to income based I did and got £60pcm more.Contribution based is only better if you have more than £6000 in savings or your partner works neither applied to me.

[bluebottle]

Re: Can we sue ATOS & DWP to stop their victimisation of my son-in-law?

I had a HCP - a GP - come to my home when I was having a bad day and saw how I was as well as noting the adaptations my landlord was in the process of making to my bathroom and kitchen (both are adapted). Within four days, DWP went from "You're not entitled to DLA," to "You're entitled to low rate on both components". When I informed them of deterioration of my condition, I sent in dictated notes with the DLA434 and, within a week of my sending them, a DWP DM sent a very balanced and sensible decision, increasing the Mobility Component to Higher Rate.

To visit the assessment centre near to where I live requires me to use a motorised wheelchair. The pavement where the nearest bus stop is located is too narrow to alight from a single deck service bus, using the wheelchair ramp, without going over a sheer drop and falling 10 feet onto a stone-paved car park, suffering serious injury in the process. Also, the access to the building is not conducive to being in a wheelchair, especially with muscle-wasting. When I mentioned this to ATOS, informing them I had asked for a home visit, the ATOS employee started to say, "You're not entitled to a home visit," to which I pointed out that I am, to which they responded, "Oh, you may not have to do a WCA."

ATOS and its employees do not seem to realise they are subject to compliance with the European Convention on Human Rights (ECHR), enshrined within Schedule 1, Human Rights Act 1998, and Section 6 of the Act which makes it unlawful for any person or commercial entity acting for or on behalf of or as a public authority to perform any act which is incompatible with a person's Convention rights.

ATOS claims it is trying to get out of its contract with DWP due to alleged death threats against its employees, amongst other things. Personally, my gut-feeling is that a number of claimants are being backed to pursue proceedings against ATOS under ECHR.

Do not forget that Social Security Regulations are secondary legislation and are vulnerable to be struck-down (brought to an end) by a judge at the stroke of a pen. Imagine a judge who had had enough of IDS and Creepy Cameron's bullying of the disabled and chronically-sick doing that. IDS would probably go completely bald and Cameron would probably be looking for places to hide from his City puppet-masters.

[VF700fen]

Re: Can we sue ATOS & DWP to stop their victimisation of my son-in-law?

Success!!

Tribunal award - Maximum number of points required for "Fit to work" Medical. ESA Support Group and Not to be called for another medical until after 2 years from today's date.


Next big hurdle is tomorrow's PIP examination but we have been given a copy of the Tribunal ruling and all the supporting medical documentation to show them. So with a bit of luck that too will work out. We cannot expect the higher rate of mobility because although his hips and the nerves running down his legs are affected he can still walk reasonably well but the rest of his mobility (waist up) is crappy so if nothing else he should at least get some level of mobility and care component. Every little bit helps.

Now I will be going after the so called "nurse" who claimed to have examined my son in law and found him 100% fit and able. Let her now try in the face of the results of his MRI and Nerve conduction study (which by the way were really bad and showed impingement on his spinal cord in places) say that he can do all the exercises she claimed he could. I will pursue her until she is struck off by the nursing and midwifery council for malfeasance and downright dishonesty. Then perhaps she can find out the hard way just how disheartening it is to have insufficient funds on which to live and have to struggle just like all the other "benefits scroungers" as they like to call us.

And as soon as Jamie gets paid what he is owed from last year we will look at the DWP and their loss of his records too.

[VF700fen]

Re: Can we sue ATOS & DWP to stop their victimisation of my son-in-law?

Can I just say too a huge thank you to everyone here who has given me advice and support over the last few months. Without all of you, we would still be battling the system

[Amethyst]

Re: Can we sue ATOS & DWP to stop their victimisation of my son-in-law?

Congratulations doesn't seem appropriate for the hard work you and your family have been through in trying to get fair treatment and the right assessment. No one should be subjected to this treatment. Well done for standing your ground. Let's hope by the time 2 years is up for the next assessment the system has undergone a radical change.

[bluebottle]

Re: Can we sue ATOS & DWP to stop their victimisation of my son-in-law?

Success!!

Tribunal award - Maximum number of points required for "Fit to work" Medical. ESA Support Group and Not to be called for another medical until after 2 years from today's date.


Next big hurdle is tomorrow's PIP examination but we have been given a copy of the Tribunal ruling and all the supporting medical documentation to show them. So with a bit of luck that too will work out. We cannot expect the higher rate of mobility because although his hips and the nerves running down his legs are affected he can still walk reasonably well but the rest of his mobility (waist up) is crappy so if nothing else he should at least get some level of mobility and care component. Every little bit helps.

Now I will be going after the so called "nurse" who claimed to have examined my son in law and found him 100% fit and able. Let her now try in the face of the results of his MRI and Nerve conduction study (which by the way were really bad and showed impingement on his spinal cord in places) say that he can do all the exercises she claimed he could. I will pursue her until she is struck off by the nursing and midwifery council for malfeasance and downright dishonesty. Then perhaps she can find out the hard way just how disheartening it is to have insufficient funds on which to live and have to struggle just like all the other "benefits scroungers" as they like to call us.

And as soon as Jamie gets paid what he is owed from last year we will look at the DWP and their loss of his records too.

At last the battle is won. As regards going after people, can I suggest the following -

Dodgy ATOS Report - Take this up with ATOS in the first instance. If you have a copy of their report to the DWP, check it against hospital records, highlighting discrepancies. ATOS need to be given the opportunity to explain the discrepancies in the report with what hospital consultants - including a neurophysiologist - have said before the matter is referred to the Information Commissioner's Office (ICO). Failing to maintain accurate records is an offence under the Data Protection Act 1998. You should also request a copy of the decision-making notes ATOS sent to DWP.

ATOS HCP - Before approaching the Nursing & Midwifery Council (NMC), it would be wise to post up ATOS's response on this thread. The person who makes the decision as to whether someone is fit to work is a Decision Maker (DM) at the DWP. Also, there is a likelihood an ATOS manager changed the report the HCP originally compiled before it was submitted to the DWP. This is why you should approach ATOS in the first instance. Avoid involving the NMC unless is is glaringly obvious the HCP has committed a breach of the NMC's Code of Professional Conduct.

Loss of Records by DWP - This is a favourite ploy of DWP. However, it is wearing thin and people are getting wise to it. Contact the DWP office concerned and enquire as to whether they have found the records yet. If they claim they have not, say something like -

"Am I to understand the Department of Work and Pensions is admitting to being in breach of the Data Protection Act 1998?"

You will be surprised just how quickly they will find them. When they do, make a note of where they said they found them. If it is anywhere other than a secured filing cabinet or strong room, say something like-

"I have concerns as to the security of claimants' records at your office. It would appear that your office is not compliant with the Data Protection Act. Is it your wish that I refer this matter to the Information Commissioner's Office for investigation and necessary action?"

Parliamentary & Health Service Ombudsman - Contact your MP about taking this to the PHSO as a case of maladministration on the part of DWP. It also sounds like your SIL's Convention rights under Schedule 1, Human Rights Act 1998 have been breached. Press this with your MP.

Hope this helps.

[IsItRequired]

Re: Can we sue ATOS & DWP to stop their victimisation of my son-in-law?

Can we sue ATOS & DWP to stop their victimisation of my son-in-law?

Will you adopt me...or even better have you another daughter who`s about 30 ish?...lol only joking...I wish someone would fight for me, if you can find a solicitor please let me know his details as I really want to have them answer to a court room judge one day...Atos deserve all they get.Good luck .

[wales01man]

Re: Can we sue ATOS & DWP to stop their victimisation of my son-in-law?

Have you bucket loads of money for Legal fees when you sue ATOS they have Billions of public money and the British Government behind them?

[VF700fen]

Re: Can we sue ATOS & DWP to stop their victimisation of my son-in-law?

Have you bucket loads of money for Legal fees when you sue ATOS they have Billions of public money and the British Government behind them?

Thanks for the input hon - I know you are only being realistic but.....

I for my sins, am a mother who will always go the extra mile for my kids, especially when some huge corporation keeps putting the boot in. Believe me I looked long and hard when they stopped my SiL's benefits for the 3rd time in 6 years and could not find any references anywhere to anyone actually taking Atos on in court.

Hence my heading of "Can we sue...." I had hoped that this being a forum with a lot of legal expertise someone might know the answer to that question.

I didn't get an answer but I did get a whole lot of really useful information and pointers of where to look, what to look for, what to ask for etc and that to me has been invaluable and for which I was truly grateful.

Unfortunately half way through this fight all legal aid was withdrawn by the government so no I don't have bucket loads of money because what we have has been better spent helping our kids live from day to day, feed their family and pay their bills. All I can do is to keep fighting on their behalf and take what help is offered to me, whether that is pro bono or not. Someday, somehow I trust that we will be rid of the scourge of the Conservatives and their Atos partners but I dread to think what we might get in their place, as in my experience most all politicians tell you "what you want to hear" to get elected and soon renege on the deal when they get into power

[wales01man]

Re: Can we sue ATOS & DWP to stop their victimisation of my son-in-law?

I think I am right labour brought ATOS into this

[Student nurse]

Re: Can we sue ATOS & DWP to stop their victimisation of my son-in-law?

Hi there,

I'm a student nurse and also a 2.1 criminology graduate. I do not know anything about welfare rights as it has been purposefully guarded under Civil law (balance of probabilities), and not Criminal law (otherwise Judges in this country would be inundated with misconduct/malfeasance in public office trials). However, I can help you in the fact that all of us nurses have to abide by the NMC code of conduct (Nursing and Midwifery Council). Any breach of this code which includes, and is not limited to; Care, Compassion, Competence, Communication, Courage (including whistleblowing/ transparency) and commitment.

The nurse cannot be complicit in any fraud with ATOS/DWP, and must ensure that their actions are not in breach of this code (including treating the patient with utmost dignity). The best angle I can see you going with this is to report the nurse to the NMC (if there is a belief that the wrong assessment of your son's condition has led to the stopping of his benefit). This is the hard part, because it has to be proven the nurse has acted in a manner that entails gross misconduct, or if it was ATOS or the DWP that have changed or ignored the nurses accurate assessment of his condition. However, if you felt you were also treated with rudeness or contempt in the interview, this is enough to breach the NMC code, and at it's worst severity is a sackable offence when the NMC are in no doubt the nurse has willfully breached it as such. You first need to complain to the NMC and take it from there. Then if the nurse is at fault, and is sacked, then a judge will automatically question the role of ATOS and DWP, in the fraud and breach of the NMC code. Very complicated indeed, and is not fair. I wish you the best of luck, and in the future I may just have the honour of treating him xx