(2) Old Lloyds Loans/PPI mid 90's

[Turboman]

Re: (2) Old Lloyds Loans/PPI mid 90's

:target::target::target::target::target::target:

Di-----You are one hell of a superstar-----you having all this success and me procratinating since2007--

---I'm springing into action---to hell with the sums----lets get my letters off-----am working on it now---will post up first draft tomorrow

btw----you got a copy of PPI Policy for Sapphy's thread (see chatbox)

Turbs

[di30]

Re: (2) Old Lloyds Loans/PPI mid 90's

LOL cheers Turbo, you will be fine with yours as well.

Been hunting some details for sapphy, see what i got for 2003.

Yes better get yours off Turbo, will it be letter or questionnaire? xx

[Bill-K]

Re: (2) Old Lloyds Loans/PPI mid 90's

That's just about what I make of it too, Di.

So, we have two loan account numbers - how sure are we of those - are they definitely the correct numbers ?

If so, then we have two start and stop dates for the above two loans.

We have records of two payments of £111.18 made AFTER the first loan was closed, but if these were toward the second loan, then the first of these was paid BEFORE the recorded loan start date (or date of first payment).

We have two loan agreements with PPI, one of which MAY be the first loan, as it has no consolidated amount brought forward. The other MAY be the second loan, but this appears very unlikely, as the payments are not £111.18. As CCA-regulated agreements, I'm pretty sure that these should carry an account number and a date within the agreement document. Can you possibly check the original documents you have for this info ?

Also, can you find any more statements showing loan repayments during the period we're looking at ?

Assuming that we have the agreement for loan #1, I'll work on the figures for that, meanwhile.

[di30]

Re: (2) Old Lloyds Loans/PPI mid 90's

That's just about what I make of it too, Di.

So, we have two loan account numbers - how sure are we of those - are they definitely the correct numbers ?

If so, then we have two start and stop dates for the above two loans.

We have records of two payments of £111.18 made AFTER the first loan was closed, but if these were toward the second loan, then the first of these was paid BEFORE the recorded loan start date (or date of first payment).

We have two loan agreements with PPI, one of which MAY be the first loan, as it has no consolidated amount brought forward. The other MAY be the second loan, but this appears very unlikely, as the payments are not £111.18. As CCA-regulated agreements, I'm pretty sure that these should carry an account number and a date within the agreement document. Can you possibly check the original documents you have for this info ?

Also, can you find any more statements showing loan repayments during the period we're looking at ?

Assuming that we have the agreement for loan #1, I'll work on the figures for that, meanwhile.

Hi Bill

These are definately the loan numbers of those accounts, also shown on letter and matching the account numbers of start and closing dates.

Its typical really because we only have the statements from when the loan of £111.18 a month that started in 1997, but we did have a smaller loan before that which was the first loan taken out, and no statements for that one. Just a possible agreement.

I have most of the statements for the £111.18 a month, so when this was taken out in April 2007, I have not got the statements that shows the full amount being paid in, but I do of the first monthly payment being made, a few in between to the final payment in 1999.

I will check again though in case anything I missed,. thank you honey x

[di30]

Re: (2) Old Lloyds Loans/PPI mid 90's

Have agreement signed April 2007 of loan that paid out £111.18 a month, the first payment was debited on May1st 2007 and the final payment made 1st April on early settlement, so 24 months of £111.18 paid.

Do not have the statements for previous loan taken out 1996 to 1997.

[di30]

Re: (2) Old Lloyds Loans/PPI mid 90's

I am baffled on why i have 2 signed agreements as well one for March 97 and the other April 1997, so I thought maybe it was a short term loan, but that still doesnt make any sense because of the info on the paperwork of start and closing dates, strange.:tinysmile_aha_t:

But the April 2007 one signed must be for the £111.18 account.

[Gorang]

Re: (2) Old Lloyds Loans/PPI mid 90's

Di

This could be a daft thing I am about to sugest and appologies if you have done this already, BUT it could/maybe/poss help you figure out what is what

Start a spready list in date order like a timline

xx/xx/xxxx agreement signed
xx/xx/xxxx £xxx.xx paid

and do that for every agreement and payment that you have there in black and white

with this you may get a better pic of the layout over the years of the loans

It MAY help you never know

and appologies if I am teaching suck eggs here

[Bill-K]

Re: (2) Old Lloyds Loans/PPI mid 90's

I agree, Gorang, a bit like a linear jigsaw puzzle, and we try and put in as many pieces as we can in order to assemble a rough picture. I've been doing that with two spreadies here, and getting somewhere with them.

Three questions for Di, now.
1. You say you have an agreement with a date for the second loan, Di. Is the date AND the account number on the same piece of paper as the consolidation loan agreement you posted ?
2. Does the agreement you posted for the smaller loan have a date and account number on the same document ?
3. You have mentioned 2007 in above posts in connection with the £111.18 p/m loan. Can you confirm that this should really read 1997 ? Just to be sure, to be sure...

[Gorang]

Re: (2) Old Lloyds Loans/PPI mid 90's

I agree, Gorang, a bit like a linear jigsaw puzzle, and we try and put in as many pieces as we can in order to assemble a rough picture. I've been doing that with two spreadies here, and getting somewhere with them.

LOL that eggs taste fine then lol

Sorry guys I should of known better I'll shut up now, and just watch and learn lol

[di30]

Re: (2) Old Lloyds Loans/PPI mid 90's

I agree, Gorang, a bit like a linear jigsaw puzzle, and we try and put in as many pieces as we can in order to assemble a rough picture. I've been doing that with two spreadies here, and getting somewhere with them.

Three questions for Di, now.
1. You say you have an agreement with a date for the second loan, Di. Is the date AND the account number on the same piece of paper as the consolidation loan agreement you posted ?
2. Does the agreement you posted for the smaller loan have a date and account number on the same document ?
3. You have mentioned 2007 in above posts in connection with the £111.18 p/m loan. Can you confirm that this should really read 1997 ? Just to be sure, to be sure...

Thank you Gorang, yes that is a good idea, cheers, will see what I can find.

Hi Bill

I have just been searching on every statement to date (lots of it) lol, and I believe the 2nd statement I posted yesterday must be the first loan taken out, there is no actual date on this agreement and no account number shown, nor that of a previous loan/debt, this one is the lowest loan we ever taken out and with it being a first loan as well, so we assume it must be this one but cannot find the signed dated part of the agreement to go with it unfortunately.
So this one is that was amount of credit with PPI £3986.00, so this one had ended in time for the 2nd loan.

2nd loan - £111.18 a month x 24 monthly payments made.
With this loan paid off - with another loan taken out in 1999 was resolved by lloyds a few months ago.

I have corrected date now Bill, sorry, yes 1997 and not 2007.

Maybe it will be a little tricky, I understand that with lack of the paperwork we do actually need.

[di30]

Re: (2) Old Lloyds Loans/PPI mid 90's

I agree, Gorang, a bit like a linear jigsaw puzzle, and we try and put in as many pieces as we can in order to assemble a rough picture. I've been doing that with two spreadies here, and getting somewhere with them.

Three questions for Di, now.
1. You say you have an agreement with a date for the second loan, Di. Is the date AND the account number on the same piece of paper as the consolidation loan agreement you posted ?
2. Does the agreement you posted for the smaller loan have a date and account number on the same document ?
3. You have mentioned 2007 in above posts in connection with the £111.18 p/m loan. Can you confirm that this should really read 1997 ? Just to be sure, to be sure...

Thank you Gorang, yes that is a good idea, cheers, will see what I can find.

Hi Bill

I have just been searching on every statement to date (lots of it) lol, and I believe the 2nd statement I posted yesterday must be the first loan taken out, there is no actual date on this agreement and no account number shown, nor that of a previous loan/debt, this one is the lowest loan we ever taken out and with it being a first loan as well, so we assume it must be this one but cannot find the signed dated part of the agreement to go with it unfortunately.
So this one is that was amount of credit with PPI £3986.00, so this one had ended in time for the 2nd loan.

2nd loan - £111.18 a month x 24 monthly payments made.
With this loan paid off - with another loan taken out in 1999 was resolved by lloyds a few months ago.

I have corrected date now Bill, sorry, yes 1997 and not 2007.

Maybe it will be a little tricky, I understand that with lack of the paperwork we do actually need.




Fixed rate loan start date - 30/10/1989 (this should be 1996) error on year
Closing date - 24/04/1997

Fixed Rate loan start date - 25/05/1997 - Closing date - 29/04/1999

Fixed Rate loan start date - 27/04/1999 - Closing date 21/01/2001 - £111.18 a month (Statement signed for this April 1997).

Gold Service loan start date - 18/01/2001 - Closing date - 21/11/2001

Gold Service Loan start date - 9/11/2001 - Closing date 03/08/2002

Personal Loan Start date - 01/07/2003 - Closing date 29/11/2003

Personal Loan Start date - 22/12/2004 - Closing date 01/12/2005

Special offer buy now/pay later loan Start date - 22/12/2006, Closing date - 07/10/2009

Buy Now pay later Start date - 01/08/2007, Closing date - 08/10/2009

[Bill-K]

Re: (2) Old Lloyds Loans/PPI mid 90's

OK., concentrating on loan #1. IF we can prove that the agreement posted above IS for loan #1, then we have what I have assumed is a loan taken out on 01/10/96 for £3300.00 plus £686.00 PPI. Starting on 01/11/96, it appears that 7 repayments of £96.34 were made before the loan was consolidated into loan #2 on or around 25/5/97. The PPI actually paid comes to £116.06, plus £136.39 SI (@ 8%) - totalling £252.45 as of today.

So - a £1200 settlement seems VERY favourable...BUT....this loan was consolidated into loan #2, and the settlement amount included PPI which would have been carried forward to loan #2. I need Turbo's help with this, now, as he is ace at amortisation - which I believe is what we need here, now.

We seem to have two options. One is to treat these two loans as entirely separate entities (ie., with NO consolidation 'carry forward.') - and this is how LTSB are treating them, I believe. The second is to take what seems to be pretty factual here, and continue with the calculations by carrying the remaining PPI forward to loan #2. If we can come up with enough factual data, then that would be better, I believe.

In conclusion (with regard to loan #1), I suggest that we consider £252.45 as the claim we make in that case, but we then have to estimate what amount of PPI was carried forward to loan #2 upon settlement of loan #1. VERY roughly - I submit that we consider this method:
The PPI Premium charged was £686.00. This comes to £11.43 per month (ie., 686/60);
We've paid 7 of these, leaving 53 to pay, which is £605.97;
We therefore add £605.97 to the PPI included in loan #2.

There is, though, the likelihood that LTSB included a 'PPI rebate' in the settlement of loan #1, and this is where we need to ask Turbo if he can elucidate, as the £605.97 may need to be reduced by whatever rebate we must assume was made.

Can you help with this, Turbo ?

[di30]

Re: (2) Old Lloyds Loans/PPI mid 90's

Thank you Bill.
So with the offer of £1,200 x 2 on each of the 2 loans, that is a very good goodwill offer in regards of them holding no paperwork in relation of these accounts.
So maybe it would therefore be a good idea to accept if this in the case of not knowing for definate if that is the correct agreement from that first loan (although it possibly is), but no dates included to prove this?

As said, I just have the statements proving the payments on the 2nd loan of £111.18 a month where 24 payments were made in total. (and no statements proving the monthly repayments for the first loan as such).

[Bill-K]

Re: (2) Old Lloyds Loans/PPI mid 90's

Sure, £1200 looks good as a settlement on loan #1, Di - BUT we have two other factors to consider before we accept £2400 in total settlement on both loans.

1. Loan #1 only ran for a short time, before being consolidated into loan #2, so it would have yielded a low PPI payout because of this, because quite a large amount of PPI was probaly rolled forward into loan #2 - and LTSB's £1200 estimate will not have taken account of this.

2. I don't know how Loan #2 was settled, but I'm guessing that this was consolidated into another LTSB loan on which you have already reclaimed the PPI. If that is the case, then the PPI on loan #2 which was still remaining in the settlement was probably NOT rolled forward into loan #3. If that is the case, then we need to treat loan #2 as if it had been settled WITHOUT being consolidated further. In this case, the reclaimable PPI on loan #2 COULD be a lot higher than £2200, and we need to try and check this.

As a VERY preliminary estimate, I have a possible £3360 claim on loan #2, if we treat it as un-consolidated into loan #3. This COULD be reduced by any PPI rebates which LTSB made, but the way I look at it is this. LTSB have admitted that they have no further data than that which they have provided. YOU have further data to suggest that the above scenario is likely. NEITHER side has complete proof, it seems. In that case, I would suggest that you let LTSB know what data you have, and that this suggests that £3600 is nearer the mark, and see what they say. They have offered £2400. Perhaps you can settle for £3000 - considering the additional data you can provide ?

[di30]

Re: (2) Old Lloyds Loans/PPI mid 90's

Thank you Bill.

Yes that seems to be very fair indeed, so £3000 for both accounts?

Considering lack of concrete proof.

I remember some time back actually finding the signed agreement for the 2nd one and for the life of me - unable to find it now, nothing would surprise me if Scooby burnt some of it when he had the new garden bin to burn rubbish :tinysmile_aha_t: lol, and possible the previous loan paperwork as well for the first one.

I have hunted high and low.

I suppose I could let Lloyds know that I have more evidence of the monthly repayments on the 2nd one but not anything to show on statements for the first one, apart from some dates (where i am sure is wrong on the year).

When the 2nd one was paid off, its possible they "may" still hold some info on that taken out straight after that one as they upheld that one a few months back, but not sure if this would include them having info of any rebate to the 2nd one above when carried over into this one they addressed.