Hoist Portfolio/Robinson Way

[BasilBrush]

Hi
Looking for some advice regarding an ex Barclaycard account.

This account was originally a Skycard taken out in 2006 I think.
In 2009 I hit hard times and and had agreements made up with various lenders and over the years have paid the majority back with the exception of this Barclaycard.

I have never missed a payment on this account however at the beginning of last year I received a letter informing me that they were closing my account and may sell the debt on.

I phoned Barclaycard and spoke to a lady and offered to come to an agreement to pay a reduced amount to clear the account as I knew that the dept would be sold at a fraction of the amount owed. Just over £900, but couldn't get any sense from her. This call was to an office in the UK

In May 17 I was asked to ring Barclaycard with a view to clearing the account at a reduced amount. I was told by a lady with an Indian accent that I could clear the account for just over £300. I was keen to do this but explained that I couldn't do it until the end of July as I had some extra pay for working away from home due to be paid. This was deemed satisfactory and while I requested the agreement in writing, this was not forthcoming.

Towards the end of July I received three letters, Barclaycard informing me they have sold the debt, Hoist Portfolio informing they have purchased the debt and Moorcroft Debt Recovery informing me that they are working on behalf of Hoist.

The Barclaycard letter is an obvious fake although I must admit I didn't notice this at first and was also mailed in an identical envelope as the Hoist letter. At this point I had never heard of Hoist or Moorcroft.

I phoned Barclaycard and said Hi it's Mr Brush here, I wish to pay my account as previously agreed in May.
After some huffing and chuffing I was told the debt had been sold but wouldn't say as to who. I asked why wasn't I informed by letter, I was initially told they don't send letters but when I pushed it she said they do. I demanded a copy and I am still waiting for it. This person was also Indian.
I only mention this to point out that the calls were now going to an overseas call centre.

I took the letters to a local Barclays branch, a member of staff agreed the letter from Barclaycard was false and felt that some kind of fraudulent activity was going on.

At this point I wrote to Moorcroft demanding an explanation as to why their client had sent a fraudulent letter. The response was that they had handed the case back to their client and would have no further involvement.

Just prior to Christmas week (yes I know) I received a letter from Robinson Way informing me that they are now acting on behalf of Hoist.

I ignored that one one as I wasn't going to respond that side of the holidays as I felt it was an underhand move that could spoil a family's Christmas. I received another in the new year but have been ill the last few weeks. Then the phone calls started which I initially ignored but answered one last week to basically say bugger off and stop phoning me as I will only respond and correspond by letter so stop wasting my time and yours. I have not admitted to the debt or to anything else at this point.

What should be my next coarse of action, the Barclaycard debt was mine and my preferred outcome was the one I agreed to with them in May last year. However what does tick me off is that these cretinous lowlifes think they can use underhand methods, if they had been straight in the first place perhaps we could have come to some arrangement similar to the one with Barclaycard.

Now I just don't trust them at all.

Many thanks

[jaguarsuk]

As Barclaycard have sold the debt on I don't suppose writing to their bigwigs will actually have any effect, I'd guess they have had their money and so won't want anything to do with it.

As a fraudulent letter has been sent you could complain about the practices of Moorcroft to the Financial Ombudsman: http://www.financial-ombudsman.org.u...ting-note.html

In terms of the debt itself and Robinson Way I'd start by saying that you don't recognise the debt (I know you do, but they don't know that) and you're not going to pay what you don't recognise. Please provide a copy of the CCA, Default Notice, Notice of Assignment and Deed of Assignment.

Do an SAR to Barclaycard to get copies of all the documents they hold, so you can determine when you last made a payment and when the account defaulted, hopefully it'll be over 6 years ago and the debt statute barred. Guide here: https://legalbeagles.info/library/gu...ccess-request/

If it's barred then you simply write to Robinson Way saying nice try, but goodbye.

If it's not barred, once you get the information back post here and we can go forward from there.

[BasilBrush]

Thanks for that
i dont think it is statue barred for a long time yet but will respond as recommended and see what comes back.

many thanks

[BasilBrush]

Ok, so a quick update.

I sent a letter just explaining that I didn't recognise any debt with hoist or that I had ever entered into any agreement with them. I also mentioned that I am not in the habit of making payments to anybody just because of their say so.

I also mentioned about the false letter that was supposed to be from Barclaycard that was quite obviously from Hoist and that it was also confirmed by a member of Barclay's that it wouldn't have originated from them.

So far I have had phone calls which on two occasions I have answered. I had two very nice ladies who wanted to help me with this account, I told them both that I wasn't prepared to discuss the matter by phone and that I had sent a written response by recorded delivery and that calling me is a waste of their time and mine.

I have now received a letter today, which is not directly a response to my letter as I was expecting. The letter tells me that I can save money by paying 60% of the balance and the matter will be closed.

My question is, do I ignore it as its not a follow up to my previous letter or do I write to them again explaining that I don't recognise the debt etc.

I am not at the point of saying prove it although I am sure it will come to that and assume that the discount is in the hope that I will say oh ok then.

Many thanks

Basil

[jaguarsuk]

Ok, so a quick update.

I sent a letter just explaining that I didn't recognise any debt with hoist or that I had ever entered into any agreement with them. I also mentioned that I am not in the habit of making payments to anybody just because of their say so.

I also mentioned about the false letter that was supposed to be from Barclaycard that was quite obviously from Hoist and that it was also confirmed by a member of Barclay's that it wouldn't have originated from them.

So far I have had phone calls which on two occasions I have answered. I had two very nice ladies who wanted to help me with this account, I told them both that I wasn't prepared to discuss the matter by phone and that I had sent a written response by recorded delivery and that calling me is a waste of their time and mine.

I have now received a letter today, which is not directly a response to my letter as I was expecting. The letter tells me that I can save money by paying 60% of the balance and the matter will be closed.

My question is, do I ignore it as its not a follow up to my previous letter or do I write to them again explaining that I don't recognise the debt etc.

I am not at the point of saying prove it although I am sure it will come to that and assume that the discount is in the hope that I will say oh ok then.

Many thanks

Basil

The discount letter is a pretty standard letter that most DCA's send out.

It's a pretty standard tactic of send lots of scary letters threatening all sorts and then a nicer letter offering a discount to make it all go away. It's designed to play into people's psychological desire to avoid confrontation.

Basically they have bought the debt for pennies and even 40% of the original balance is a nice profit for them if all they have to do is send a few letters.

[BasilBrush]

I did think it would be something like that. As I mentioned in my original post that if they had been aboveboard at the start then we could have resolved this but the greed and underhanded actions have got my back up.

So do you think I should just ignore this letter and wait for something else as I have told them I don't acknowledge any agreement with their client or send another letter in a similar vain to the last one.


many thanks

[jaguarsuk]

I did think it would be something like that. As I mentioned in my original post that if they had been aboveboard at the start then we could have resolved this but the greed and underhanded actions have got my back up.

So do you think I should just ignore this letter and wait for something else as I have told them I don't acknowledge any agreement with their client or send another letter in a similar vain to the last one.


many thanks

Personally I would wait and see if they respond to your letter. Did you give them a time frame to respond?

[BasilBrush]

No I didn't give a time frame, I just told them that I have never entered into an agreement with their client or that I need to pay people just on their say so.

I also mentioned that I had not even heard of any of the parties involved until July last year when I received three letters, one of which is fraudulent and has been confirmed so. I went on to add that it was obviously sent from their client as the letter content was almost identical and the envelopes were exactly the same and now I think of it, they are different to any previously sent from Barclays/Barclaycard. At this point they were asked to stop contacting me over this matter.

I have a friend who is a County court bailiff and I was telling him about it. He laughed while at the same time giving a look of disgust and contempt and said that he had heard of all these characters and that he feels they are operating outside the law on times as If they are challenged enough then they back down.

Many thanks

[warwick65]

Hi I have read most of the thread and maybe a bit of clarification would help

I take it that the account was opened in 2006, you hit problems in 2009 but have been paying back regularly since then. If this is the case, the account is not going to be statute barred

Just how much are they claiming ?

This is for a barclaycard but it was originally a sky card?

I do not think the letter you received about the sale was a forgery at all, when a debt is sold all the law says is that the seller must 'arrange' for you to be told about it but it doesn't actually say who must tell you - thus you often get two envelopes ( sometimes just one) with a letter from the seller and a letter from the purchaser - job done as far as the NOA is concerned.

Was the prove it letter an actual CCA request with the £1 fee? If it isn't then I would send a CCA request off straight away

Your bailiff friend might have a point but I am guessing not in the way he is thinking and it would be a foolish mistake to think if you challenge them enough they will back down. You need to play what I call 'The game' - know the law, know what they need to do, and sometimes blag it

[MIKE770]

CCA Request Letter
if needed

[BasilBrush]

You are more or less correct there Warwick

I opened the account in about 2006 and it was branded as Skycard.

I had my own business that was doing well as a one man band outfit. I became seriously ill and was unable to work and eventually went from a guy that paid all his bills on time without fail. I made arrangements to pay a given amount every month and paid everybody off.

This was the last one and I was paying it up until the beginning of last year. Eventually I was told if I paid just over £300 the the debt would be settled.

I agreed to that but explained that I would not have the funds until the end of July and I was told this was ok.

July came and I get three letters, now I understand what you are saying however when I get a letter that is supposed to be from Barclaycard that has an incorrect logo in black and white rather than colour then I need to think what is going on here. Particularly as the letter content is pretty much word for word to the letter from Hoist.

That is why I rang Barclaycard who were no help and then took the letter into a local branch. I have looked into all these companies involved and the all have a bad reputation and use dubious methods. When one of my other debts was sold I had a proper letter fro MBNA saying they had sold it and also from the company that purchased it, nothing in the arrangement changed and it got paid off a year ago.

I know that it's not statue barred and think I said that in my earlier post. Had Barclaycard not jumped the gun, this would have been paid of at the end of July. I even have the money stashed away that was to pay it off.

With regard to my friend, I wasn't suggesting that it works in all cases, just in the dubious ones. Having said that, nobody pushes me around and I actually like confrontation as long as I have my facts correct. This is the reason for being here.

The amount is just over £900

Many thanks

[warwick65]

Thanks for confirming the details
Hoist do have a problem in that they are currently unlicensed I think but that does not stop them issuing claims as you will see by looking around the forums

If the balance is 900 they wont have paid that much for it - I am not sure what the going rate is these days, I think it varies from 5-20% so it is possible that they might take your offer of £300 for a quick turnaround although if you decide that make sure you head letters or start phone calls with 'this is without prejudice' . I would also start your offer off low at say 10% and then you can go up if needed- lets face it , anyone used to negotiation knows you never ever give your maximum price first (well as a rep I did because that was the price and if they were so stupid as not to see a good deal - but I digress). I bet if they are offering a 40% discount , they have room for movement.

If it were me, my first move would be to send a S78 request - if they can comply it makes things trickier but if they can;t you have the strong hand.

[warwick65]

Thanks for confirming the details
Hoist do have a problem in that they are currently unlicensed I think but that does not stop them issuing claims as you will see by looking around the forums

If the balance is 900 they wont have paid that much for it - I am not sure what the going rate is these days, I think it varies from 5-20% so it is possible that they might take your offer of £300 for a quick turnaround although if you decide that make sure you head letters or start phone calls with 'this is without prejudice' . I would also start your offer off low at say 10% and then you can go up if needed- lets face it , anyone used to negotiation knows you never ever give your maximum price first (well as a rep I did because that was the price and if they were so stupid as not to see a good deal - but I digress). I bet if they are offering a 40% discount , they have room for movement.

If it were me, my first move would be to send a S78 request - if they can comply it makes things trickier but if they can;t you have the strong hand.

Just to add, it is also not all about the agreement- sorry that was meant to be an edit

[BasilBrush]

Thanks for the reply Warwick, it is much appreciated.

Its their underhanded ways that has got my back up and the fact that Barclaycard sold it on after agreeing a deal with me for probably more money than Hoist gave them.

However, never mind and time to move on. I think that if it costs a few hundred quid to put it to bed then that's the ideal outcome for me. If it was several thousand then perhaps I would take a chance and play it out and hopefully in time it would become statue barred.

I also understand it's a case of playing a game with them so to speak.

What if you don't mind me asking, is an S78 request.

Many thanks

[warwick65]

A S78 request is also sometimes called a CCA request. It is a request made under the consumer credit act and they have to provide
A copy ( or reconstituted copy) of the roiginal agreement along with all the associated terms and conditions
The terms and conditions when the account was defaulted
A statement saying what the balance is

When the account is before Apr 2007 the agreement has to contain all the prescribed terms at the time of signing although by 2006 most did.

When I sent all my CCA requests back in 2012 , some replied they could not find them and thus the account was unenforecable and a couple sent back ones that did not contain the prescribed terms , I think that was about 10K's worth although maybe a little less