Judgment & Beyond ~ Budgie Vs Capital One

[Amethyst]

Re: Judgement Reserved ~ Budgie Vs Capital One

pmsl I soo have Monthy Python's Lumberjack song in my head now. Am sure Budgie would fit the role perfectly.

[Tools]

Re: Judgement Reserved ~ Budgie Vs Capital One

Fantastic day by the sounds of it Bud, well done.

I do not even begin to have a full understanding of Sempra and its finer points. Advantageously for you the Judge did and it seemed to be an area of interest for him. By the sounds of it the Judge was trying to find out if you did actually have a good understanding of Sempra and not just using it as a copy/paste exercise. This only reinforces my belief that if there is a possibility that you will have to stand in front of a Judge and argue your case you must have a full understanding of the caselaw you are using. If you are not confident in arguing the finer points of caselaw against a barrister and Judge you can easily lose your case whether the caselaw is relevant or not.

I take my hat off to you Bud, you sound to have conducted yourself really well in there, let`s hope the Judge rules favourably next week.

[Ladidi]

Re: Judgement Reserved ~ Budgie Vs Capital One

Hi Budgie,

I just wanted to say I have been reading your thread and well done on your court case on all the work and effort you have done which has shown in the way you presented your case at court and I think the Judge could see that. Fingers crossed for you mate and I hope it all goes your way in the final outcome.

Ladidi

[stevokenevo]

Re: Judgement Reserved ~ Budgie Vs Capital One

:rockon: You have done yourself (and beagles) proud Bud.

You are a credit to yourself and an asset to us!

well done

[Budgie]

Re: Judgement Reserved ~ Budgie Vs Capital One

Possible Outcomes

OK, Whilst the Judge is considering his judgment I thought I would ponder on some possible outcomes.

1) Judgment awarded to me, the claimant.

Judge could then order Capital One to settle as follows :-

i) Waiving of the default charges applied to the account but not actually paid by me totaling £220.
ii) Return of default charges actually paid as detailed in my updated spreadsheet totaling £639.
iii) Compound interest at an applicable rate of 30.34% per annum. But applied on a compounded daily basis and calculated from the date of application of each default charge actually paid across to Capital One ( £639 ) through to the date of the final hearing and totaling £4629.41
iv) Return of my Court fees incurred, Filing claim £225, AQ £200, Application hearing £75, Final Hearing fee £300 ; Totaling £800.

My calculation of the final settlement as at the date of the final hearing is £6068.41. I accept that the Capital One may deduct from this £373.55 to clear the revised balance of the account ( = 593.55 - 220 )

Note : The Judge may decide to award me compound interest at a different rate to the 30.34% that I have claimed.

Note : I have the option of seeking wasted costs from Capital One.

Note : Capital One have already stated that if the decision goes against them then they will seek permission to appeal

2) Judgment awarded to Capital One

Judge could then order either of the following :-

i) That my claim is dismissed in its entirety.

ii) That my claim for compound interest is dismissed but that he orders Capital One to settle my claim as per their proposed settlement offer as detailed in their WS and Skelton arguments

Note : Whatever happens here I will have the opportunity to seek permission to appeal.
Note : If either of the scenarios above comes to fruition then Capital One have already stated that they will seek to recover their entire costs owing to the vexatious nature of my claim.


So, in summary, I am probably still a long way from the finish line.

Even if I do succede and gain a succesful judgment ( which is by no means certain ) then Capital One are certain to seek permission to appeal.

As far as I am aware this is the first time a formal judgment will be handed down wrt compound interest ( argued on Sempra jurisdiction ) in a claim such as this. So a lot will depend on how confident the Judge feels in applying a judgment that will stick if taken to a higher court by appeal.

Capital One faced with a judgment that they are liable to pay compound interest on any future claims for return of default charges are likely to throw some super heavyweights behind any appeal that they might make. The costs risk, from my point of view and theirs, would go through the roof.

So all in all the next steps, once the Judge has made his decision, need to be very carefully reviewed.

It's gonna be an interesting wait for judgment and an even more interesting aftermath.

Budgie

[jax007]

Re: Judgement Reserved ~ Budgie Vs Capital One

Hmmmm ............. tough one that, Bud!

jax

[Amethyst]

Re: Judgement Reserved ~ Budgie Vs Capital One

Note : If either of the scenarios above comes to fruition then Capital One have already stated that they will seek to recover their entire costs owing to the vexatious nature of my claim.

Was that in their WS/Skels or a comment in court?

[Budgie]

Re: Judgement Reserved ~ Budgie Vs Capital One

Note : If either of the scenarios above comes to fruition then Capital One have already stated that they will seek to recover their entire costs owing to the vexatious nature of my claim.

Was that in their WS/Skels or a comment in court?

Both, Skelton argument and a comment by Barrister at court hearing.

Judges response to her in hearing was that it was possible that either party may actually wish to seek permission to appeal and / or apply for wasted costs and that the question of costs would be reserved to the hearing for handing down of judgment.

[TANZARELLI]

Re: Judgement Reserved ~ Budgie Vs Capital One

As far as I am aware this is the first time a formal judgment will be handed down wrt compound interest ( argued on Sempra jurisdiction ) in a claim such as this. So a lot will depend on how confident the Judge feels in applying a judgment that will stick if taken to a higher court by appeal.

Would they risk the appeal though for exaclty that reason? I think they may not. JMO

[Amethyst]

Re: Judgement Reserved ~ Budgie Vs Capital One

Point 27 of Skeleton argument ?

Did she say vexatious in court?

[Budgie]

Re: Judgement Reserved ~ Budgie Vs Capital One

Yep, she actually said "extremely vexatious" !!!!!!

[ed.]

Re: Budgie Vs Capital One

I`m with Tanz here, I get the feeling if they think they will lose properly you may well end up with a settlement. All you need to do is threaten the publicity.

Afterall, how many claimants know about pre 6 yr or compound interest aspects. I don't think they will be stupid enough to think one win against you - where you can then completely tear apart their arguements in defence - wouldn't lead to 500 per cent more costs to them because, even on a loss, they don't silence you.

Their best answer is a good settlment for you......to be honest I'd lay that on thick mate. Sorts you out, and we still know how you approached this. If you follow me.

[TANZARELLI]

Re: Judgement Reserved ~ Budgie Vs Capital One

Yep agreed ed.

[shooter]

Re: Judgement Reserved ~ Budgie Vs Capital One

Any news from the judge yet Budgie?

[Budgie]

Re: Judgement Reserved ~ Budgie Vs Capital One

Nope.

I spoke to Court this morning.
Judge hasn't yet passed his judgement to typing pool.
I asked clerk to try and get an update from Judges clerk as to when the judgment may be ready for me.

I have to call back at 3.30PM to see if any more news.

Budgie