Lowell chasing a disputed debt.

[Diana M]

Re: Lowell chasing a disputed debt.

There is a prove it letter about these parts somewhere... ummm @warwick65 ? I can never find it.

[MENTION=48934]Debt Camel[/MENTION] has a "Prove It!" letter on her website where she puts it in context too.

It's straightforward, non-confrontational, written in Plain English and most importantly brief not wordy.

Maybe ask her if the forum could adopt/plagiarise it

https://debtcamel.co.uk/prove-it/

Sometimes it's best not to go on the offensive with a detailed threat of breaking FCA guidance etc unless you actually want to attract a court claim in response to a heavy-handed letter.

Di

[Amethyst]

Re: Lowell chasing a disputed debt.

Cheers Di

[Diana M]

Re: Lowell chasing a disputed debt.

my daughter cancelled a mobile contract over the phone. The mobile was originally registered to me, although she paid it from her account. We thought it was cancelled and done, but the company started chasing me for monthly payments. I disputed it because we have proof that customer services did cancel the contract and gave her a PAC code, which they say could not have been given.

^ ^ ^ This may be the awkward part if things do 'go legal' (hopefully not).

I'm not sure a third party (your daughter) can cancel your contract. There was a legally binding contract between you and Orange/EE not her. She was not party to that contract (from what you say).

Did you personally give Orange/EE authorisation for them to discuss your account with your daughter?

Did she pass Data Protection questions when she spoke to them about your account and asked for the PAC code?

Asking for a PAC code doesn't automatically cancel the contract. PAC codes self destruct after a period of time if no no further action is taken and the contract may remain in force unless expressly cancelled.

It's a pity your dispute with Orange fizzled out because this issue could and should have been settled through their complaints procedure and referred if necessary to the Ombudsman Services - Communications for a Decison.

Now that the perceived debt has been assigned to Lowells the story changes.

Di

[Diana M]

Re: Lowell chasing a disputed debt.

Lowell has been sniffing around for over a year. Last month and this, I got their 'pre-legal assessment' letter

One more thing needs clarification.

Did those two "Pre-Legal Assessment" letters come from Lowell Portfolio/Financial or from Lowell Solicitors?

If you raise a Formal Complaint (read @Debt Camel 's website link) and you're not satisfied with the response you can then refer your complaint to the Financial Ombudsman Service.

If the account has been referred to Lowell Solicitors then you may need to treat things in a different way. Was there a deadline to respond 'or else' at the end of the last letter?

Di

[Debt Camel]

Re: Lowell chasing a disputed debt.

You are welcome to use/adapt that letter however you want. I too am not keen on people starting to make all sorts of threats at a very early stage when a simple query will usually do!

- - - Updated - - -

If you raise a Formal Complaint (read @Debt Camel 's website link) and you're not satisfied with the response you can then refer your complaint to the Financial Ombudsman Service.

unfortunately many mobile debts are not CCA debts and can't go to the FOS. If you put in a formal complaint, the reply should usually make it clear if it can go to the FOS or not.

[Diana M]

Re: Lowell chasing a disputed debt.

unfortunately many mobile debts are not CCA debts and can't go to the FOS. If you put in a formal complaint, the reply should usually make it clear if it can go to the FOS or not.

Those consumer contracts which aren't covered by the FOS (because there was no handset finance involved just line rental) can make their complaint to the Ombudsman Services - Communications instead.

Orange/EE is a member > https://www.ombudsman-services.org/s...s-we-deal-with

It's a pity your dispute with Orange fizzled out because this issue could and should have been settled through their complaints procedure and referred if necessary to the Ombudsman Services - Communications for a Decision.

Di

[Janet6]

Re: Lowell chasing a disputed debt.

^ ^ ^ This may be the awkward part if things do 'go legal' (hopefully not).

I'm not sure a third party (your daughter) can cancel your contract. There was a legally binding contract between you and Orange/EE not her. She was not party to that contract (from what you say).
Did you personally give Orange/EE authorisation for them to discuss your account with your daughter?
Did she pass Data Protection questions when she spoke to them about your account and asked for the PAC code?
Di

The third party aspect is the sticking point as far as EE are concerned. Originally, I covered the payments. After the two year contract was up, we went into the local Orange shop and the payments were transferred to her bank account as she would then be paying it. Papers were signed, but unfortunately they have been lost along the way (she moved house).

So... she thought the contract was transferred to her, which is why she spoke to them about transferring the number. She was assured the contract had been cancelled and nothing else need be done. She got a PAC code, then couldn't activate it before it was due to expire. She phoned to ask why... was given another PAC code, which worked.

When she got a payment demand... several months later... she phoned to query it. She knew my password. That's when they asked to speak to me. When I called them, they didn't believe that she'd passed Data Protection or got a valid PAC code and ended up shutting down the account, so neither of us could access any details!

It's a right old mess!

- - - Updated - - -

One more thing needs clarification.

Did those two "Pre-Legal Assessment" letters come from Lowell Portfolio/Financial or from Lowell Solicitors?

If you raise a Formal Complaint (read @Debt Camel 's website link) and you're not satisfied with the response you can then refer your complaint to the Financial Ombudsman Service.

If the account has been referred to Lowell Solicitors then you may need to treat things in a different way. Was there a deadline to respond 'or else' at the end of the last letter?

Di

The letters came from Lowell Financial Ltd.

[Kati]

Re: Lowell chasing a disputed debt.

not being nasty ... as a layman ~ if THEY accepted her ringing up to get the pac code then THEY must have accepted that the account was hers at that time!?!

do you have proof that they gave HER the pac code [MENTION=105499]Janet6[/MENTION] ??

[warwick65]

Re: Lowell chasing a disputed debt.

Tbh they are not very bright. I mean I know most of his details so regularly phone people on his behalf. I always pass security. Of course I always stop this side or arranging a contract etc.

[Diana M]

Re: Lowell chasing a disputed debt.

if THEY accepted her ringing up to get the pac code then THEY must have accepted that the account was hers at that time!

Maybe look at it another way.

A bank is likely to reject any claim of fraudulent transactions if they believe the account holder revealed their PIN number to a third party even if it was not deliberate (e.g. the PIN number was written down on something in their handbag which was stolen etc).

The OP says that her daughter was given her password by her.

Allowing her daughter to access her account over the phone may not be the same thing as giving her daughter (legal) authorisation to cancel her legal contract.

It's also important to establish whether the OP had the right to cancel her contract if the minimum term hadn't expired etc regardless of who was given the PAC number. A mobile phone provider must give the PAC number to the customer even if the minimum contract has not expired.

And even if the minimum contract period had expired that doesn't necessarily mean the contract was terminated until or unless it was expressly cancelled by the parties to that contract.

This is the bit which needs exploring and perhaps a transcript of the call will be needed to get to the bottom of things.

It's also not clear what happened when mother and daughter went into the Orange store. Paperwork possibly signed has been lost so a SAR may be necessary to establish the true situation.

The OP recognises the debt but quite rightly disputes the amount being chased because of an ongoing unresolved issue with Orange/EE.

Lowell Financial isn't psychic so unless they're made aware of an historical dispute then how would they know?

According to the OP the account has not yet been escalated to Lowell Solicitors for legal action so maybe this is the correct time to deal with the dispute before things get out of hand (claim issued) when it'll become a lot harder.

Di