Help us make Friends Life pay out Nic Hughes' critical illness policy

[Charlie505]

Re: Help us make Friends Life pay out Nic Hughes' critical illness policy

MissFM

You are right that FOS could be a win win - but not necessarily. If they were to reject the complaint the family could end up with nothing (although they should already have received their contributions back if Friends are voiding the contract).

I see you have taken the time to look at the FOS website - and what you will have seen is that the cases of non-disclosure are far from clear cut - there is a lot of nuance depending on the individual circumstances. FOS would for example need to take a view of why Nic non-disclosed and whether that was understandable, and how critical that was to the insurers decision to accept the contract.

However, complaining to FOS gives them a chance of winning. With the current campaign I believe they have no chance at all.

By the way - I haven't figured out out to leave thanks on these messages - probably embarrassingly easy

[TUTTSI]

Re: Help us make Friends Life pay out Nic Hughes' critical illness policy

Bottom left hand corner... with the thumbs up...

MissFM

You are right that FOS could be a win win - but not necessarily. If they were to reject the complaint the family could end up with nothing (although they should already have received their contributions back if Friends are voiding the contract).

I see you have taken the time to look at the FOS website - and what you will have seen is that the cases of non-disclosure are far from clear cut - there is a lot of nuance depending on the individual circumstances. FOS would for example need to take a view of why Nic non-disclosed and whether that was understandable, and how critical that was to the insurers decision to accept the contract.

However, complaining to FOS gives them a chance of winning. With the current campaign I believe they have no chance at all.

By the way - I haven't figured out out to leave thanks on these messages - probably embarrassingly easy

[Charlie505]

Re: Help us make Friends Life pay out Nic Hughes' critical illness policy

I can't won't and never will accept that a 'non diagnosis' is reason to not pay out an insurance.We've already thrashed the MS argument out and ,without sounding condescending or rude,anyone who thinks that the reasons FL are trying to declare the policy void are valid better hope and pray nothing happens to them where they know they are not going to live long enough to sort it out,and by dying they are going to leave their family ,when they pop off to the promised land,up crap creek without a paddle all because they mentioned they had 'pins and needles' to the Dr,,and even that Dr has come out in defence of the family. I wonder how FL's members would vote if they had the choice?
I have read all the articles,seen both sides of the argument and nothing has changed,,it still stinks

Inca

I am assuming you mean that 'non-disclosure' is not a valid reason not to pay out. Well, it depends on the non-disclosure (how important, whether accidental etc.) - and the Ombudsman agrees with that.

However let's consider your proposition - an insurance world where non-disclosure was considered fine. What that would mean is that every application would have to have a GP's report and every applicant sent for a medical examination. Huge cost - covered by increased premiums for all.

But even that wouldn't be enough - some illnesses are ones the individual knows about bu the doctor might not have been told, and would not be found by examination - particularly if you could non-disclose to the doctor.

So people who were seriously ill would rush to take out insurance - and those who were healthy would avoid it because the cost would be too high (they would be paying for all the non-disclosers).

What this would give us is an insurance world without underwriting - everyone entitled to cover, everone paying the same - some cross subsidising the others. This is how some European countries see insurance - almost as a contracting out of state responsibilities.

But actually that is already to some extent what we have. We have a system where we all pay the same % through taxation for a standard benefit for ill-health benefits - National Insurance

So what you are saying about non-disclosure logically takes us to a place where as an alternative we have a non-market solution - an extention of NI. I wonder how many people would put there hands up to pay the extra premiums (tax) for that.

[Inca]

Re: Help us make Friends Life pay out Nic Hughes' critical illness policy

Charlie me ole luv,,,we are never going to agree are we? I mean,in this case,where nothing was diagnosed,nondisclosure has been used as a get out clause by FL. I'm not debating the rights and wrongs of the insurance world,I'm simply commenting on this unique individual case and I pray on everything I hold holy that the FOS do the right thing by his family.

[Charlie505]

Re: Help us make Friends Life pay out Nic Hughes' critical illness policy

Well sounds like we might be the same page Inca - or at least almost :-)

I would also like to see FOS adjudicate this - and if they find for the family it will please everyone on this forum...and I will take a 'told you so' from you on the chin, happy that due process has been upheld.

So let's hope the family do eventually complain to FOS.

[Hurricane Puffrose]

Re: Help us make Friends Life pay out Nic Hughes' critical illness policy

<sub>or they could always just pay up, and honour the agreement Nic took out

this should never have gone this far, this could have been sorted very easily a loooooong time ago, will be watching Twitter closely for updates

now we have Stephen Fry on side too, so that's pretty cool</sub>

[Charlie505]

Re: Help us make Friends Life pay out Nic Hughes' critical illness policy

Miss FM

You made an interesting point above about Fiduciary duty. It is true that a company has the duty to act in the interests of their shareholders but they need to balance that with the recognition that simply screwing customers to maximise short term profit will not provide a sustainable benefit to shareholders - in fact given time the opposite will happen (as Puff has pointed out). If a company is considering its long term health, the interests of shareholders and customers will be seen to align.

But in any case, insurers also have a duty set out by the regulators (now the FCA) based on the Financial Services and Markets Act to act in the best interests of their customers. More specifically they must comply with an onerous TCF (Treating Customers Fairly) regime which requires them to demonstrate to regulatory auditors that they are manufacturing, marketing and operating in a manner that is clear, fair, and not misleading.

So, there are a number of duties in play - and they all have to be discharged in a manner that properly balances the interests of customers, shareholders ...and of course their statutory obligations to their staff

[MissFM]

Re: Help us make Friends Life pay out Nic Hughes' critical illness policy

Why can't the insurers take it to the FOS?

[MissFM]

Re: Help us make Friends Life pay out Nic Hughes' critical illness policy

Sorry that probably seems an exceptionally dumb question - but in extraordinary circumstances there must be some impartial mediation service trusted by both sides that could clear the logjam?

[Hurricane Puffrose]

Re: Help us make Friends Life pay out Nic Hughes' critical illness policy

Doesn't seem a dumb question hunny, there basically is with the majority of things. Unfortunately in this case the policy holder can't take his business elsewhere, but this is the second of these have heard of, daughter has a friend in class who's family member has bladder cancer and needs a transplant, Aviva won't pay out as they say its not a critical illness, it's every excuse not to pay they can think of!!

[MissFM]

Re: Help us make Friends Life pay out Nic Hughes' critical illness policy

Well that IS Swiftian - how could cancer not be a critical illness? At least that isn't the criterion being used by FL.

[Hurricane Puffrose]

Re: Help us make Friends Life pay out Nic Hughes' critical illness policy

http://m.facebook.com/messages/read/...24MURI__user=0

[TUTTSI]

Re: Help us make Friends Life pay out Nic Hughes' critical illness policy

I have similar with our health plan - we suddenly find out that we are only covered for Sugical and Cancer but not medical. So when I needed a blood transfusion whilst I was still undergoing test for what turned out to be a cancer of the blood I could not have a blood transfusion on my health plan. They seem to make the rules up as we go along unfortunately.

Also, hubby has previously see an ENT person for his ears, wanted to go back to see the same consultant they now say we are not covered for ENT - yet all of us have on the same policy seen the4 same consultant over the years/

The insurers bless do like to change policy conditions or move the goal posts when it suits.

[MissFM]

Re: Help us make Friends Life pay out Nic Hughes' critical illness policy

Thanks Puff but sorry couldn't find it - am not on facebook anyway. Any chance of a footnote? x

[Hurricane Puffrose]

Re: Help us make Friends Life pay out Nic Hughes' critical illness policy

Sorry hunny, his name is Danny Wild, he is a dad fighting bladder cancer I think he's on twitter too, there is a thread about him somewhere, but can't find a thing with this bloody phone, once the craptop Is fixed, I will find it for you