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Received County court claim Form for a PCN but I was not the driver?

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  • Received County court claim Form for a PCN but I was not the driver?

    Hello All

    A family friend of ours came to visit and borrowed my car for the day, later on I received a PCN 13/09/2017 from Britannia Parking.
    I went on line and took the advice most were saying on forums just ignore them and bin it.

    14 months later I have just received a County Court business centre claim form.
    At first I did not realise that it WAS NOT me who was driving and my friend instead was using it on that date.

    I have tried to contact him, but the last I heard he was going through a life crisis so i'm not to keen on pursing him and adding to his stress.

    The problem is my friend lives in another country and i'm not sure what to do about the County Court form ???

    I have never been in contact with Britannia or any other 3rd party debt collection agencies nor have I ever given any drivers details to anyone regarding this matter.

    Any help would be greatly appreciated.

    Many Thanks
    Tags: None

  • #2
    Ignore has not been the advice since 2012. Shame you didn't identify the driver earlier as they would not chase an overseas driver and you would have removed any liability from yourself.

    first thing to do is acknowledged the claim online using the details on the form and password. Do not put anything in the defence. This gives you 33 days from the date of issue.

    have you got the Notice to Keeper that you originally received? If so post up a redacted copy, leaving dates.

    Comment


    • #3
      Originally posted by MiniB View Post
      Hello All

      A family friend of ours came to visit and borrowed my car for the day, later on I received a PCN 13/09/2017 from Britannia Parking.
      I went on line and took the advice most were saying on forums just ignore them and bin it.

      14 months later I have just received a County Court business centre claim form.
      At first I did not realise that it WAS NOT me who was driving and my friend instead was using it on that date.

      I have tried to contact him, but the last I heard he was going through a life crisis so i'm not to keen on pursing him and adding to his stress.

      The problem is my friend lives in another country and i'm not sure what to do about the County Court form ???

      I have never been in contact with Britannia or any other 3rd party debt collection agencies nor have I ever given any drivers details to anyone regarding this matter.

      Any help would be greatly appreciated.

      Many Thanks
      Hi thanks for your reply.

      I'm afraid I really did bin them I only have some recent ones "letter of claim".

      There are a couple of things though, when I first got the PCN letter I went down to the car park and took some photos.
      I noticed that although the entrance and exit were parallel and right next to each other, that the only sign displayed was on the exit side.

      If there was no sign on entering the Car park then would that be a case for me?

      Also as soon as you drive down the slope and into the underground car park there is a sign, but it was not illuminated and the contract wording was so
      small it was almost unreadable, even if the sign was illuminated and clear,then once you have committed yourself to drive down the slope it would be dangerous to reverse back up the slope and into incoming cars.

      Also I have just recently been in contact with the driver and he tells me that as far as he can recall that he didn't even park as he couldn't find a parking spot partly because it appeared full and there were some cones blocking some spaces.
      Unfortunately He didn't take any photos of that!

      He told me that he bumped into a friend in the car park and was talking for about 30 mins and then he left.
      Also I do remember that particular car park used to be a pay and display but it was changed to NPR cameras with out any obvious warnings to customers,
      this must have caught out a lot of unwitting Parker's?

      Thanks again for your most appreciated and valuable help.

      MiniB

      Comment


      • #4
        SAR to the Brittania to get all the data they hold on you. Letter to the solicitor requesting all the documents that they intend to use in court in order to narrow the issues between the parties, as required by the courts. As the documents will be in their possession in order to perform due diligence before issuing the claim you require that the are delivered within 7 days

        Comment


        • #5
          Thanks for your quick response.
          I have acknowledged the claim online, and just emailed the info requests you mentioned to both parties, I will let you know when
          (If) I get a response, fingers crossed.

          Comment


          • #6
            Hi Ostell

            I have just received a response from Britannia Parking.
            It says that they have one month to respond? which will of coarse take it over the court date?
            I've uploaded the letter.
            Not sure what to do next??

            Many Thanks
            MiniB
            Attached Files

            Comment


            • #7
              Hi Ostell

              I have Just received the documents requested from bwLegal.
              most contain pictures of my car, but I'm guessing the important one you wanted to see is the original notice to keeper which I have attached.

              Many thanks
              MiniB
              Attached Files

              Comment


              • #8
                You may care to write to BW Legal suggest to them that they withdraw their claim as there is no possibility of success as their client has failed to comply with the requirements of Schedule 4 of the Protection of Freedoms Act 2012 to be able to transfer liability for the event from the driver at the time to you, the keeper.

                The failures are:
                • No period of parking specified contrary to 9 (2) (a). Timings from photos of a car moving in front of a camera is, by definition, not parking.
                • Invitation to pay is not in the format required by 9 (2) (e)
                • Failure to give the keeper liability warning required by 9 (2) (f)
                • Failed to specify the date sent as specified by 9 (2) (i)
                You were not the driver at the time, the driver is: [give full name and address of the driver who is abroad]

                To continue with the claim knowing that they cannot win is unreasonable and fuill costs will be claimed for their behaviour.


                Then start writing your defence. You have to get it to the court on or before day 33 from date of issue (assuming that you have acknowledged). Pick a recent defence already on the forum and edit to suit, remembering to put in all the POFA failures.

                Post on here for critique before you send.

                Comment


                • #9
                  That's Great! Thanks Ostell

                  I have written to bw Legal as to your suggestion(withdraw claim).

                  In the mean time I have been searching for an applicable defence but I cant seem to find any relating to my predicament.
                  I was wondering if you could point me in the right direction?

                  Thanks again for your Time.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Just find a parking defence and insert your own statements, the main ones being no liability because of the POFA fails.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Hi Ostell


                      I havent had any response from them yet apart from a voice message from bwLegal for me to call them?

                      Im abit confused as to how 9(2)(e) can be put forward as a failure, as I can see that in the Notice to Keeper it does state the requirements specified in 9(2)(e)??










                      Is this sufficient to submit as my defence?









                      I am xxx,the defendant in this matter and the registered keeper of vehicle xxx.

                      I deny I am liable for the entirety of the claim on the following grounds:


                      The Claimant has failed to comply with the requirements of Schedule 4 of the Protection of Freedoms Act 2012 to be able to transfer liability for the event from the driver at the time to the keeper.




                      The failures are:




                      . No period of parking specified contrary to 9 (2) (a). Timings from photos of a car moving

                      In front of a camera is, by definition, not parking.



                      . Invitation to pay is not in the format required by 9 (2) (e)



                      . Failure to give the keeper liability warning required by 9 (2) (f)



                      . Failed to specify the date sent as specified by 9 (2) (I)




                      Schedule 4 of the Protection of Freedoms Act 2012 specifies the following.







                      9(2) (a)The notice must specify the vehicle, the relevant land on which it was parked and the period of parking to which the notice relates.




                      9(2) (e)The notice muststate that the creditor does not know both the name of the driver and a current address for service for the driver and invite the keeper—

                      (I) to pay the unpaid parking charges; or




                      (ii) if the keeper was not the driver of the vehicle, to notify the creditor of the name of the driver and a current address for service for the driver and to pass the notice on to the driver.




                      9(2) (f) Warn the keeper that if, after the period of 28 days beginning with the day after that on which the notice is given—




                      (I) the amount of the unpaid parking charges specified under paragraph (d) has not been paid in full, and




                      (ii) the creditor does not know both the name of the driver and a current address for service for the driver







                      9(2)(i) specify the date on which the notice is sent (where it is sent by post) or given (in any other case).








                      The above Listed Failures of the Claimant and the following statements conclude that I can not be held liable for this claim:



                      I the defendant and the Owner of XXXXXXX was not the driver at the time of the alleged contravention and

                      details of the driver have be given to the claimant.



                      The vehicle in question was NOT Parked at any point within the times specified by the claimant.



                      The vague Particulars of the Claim disclose no clear cause of action. The court is invited to strike out the claim of its own volition as having no merit and no reasonable prospects of success.


                      STATEMENT OF TRUTH

                      I confirm that the contents of this Defence are true to the best of my knowledge and recollection.



                      xxx
                      XX feb 2019


                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Hi

                        Needs better formatting.
                        Paragraphs need numbering.
                        & bigger size lettering. (12)

                        Scrub 9(2)(i)......surely that's the issue date is on the top of the NtK?......25th September 2017

                        Imho, the most important defect here is 9(2)(e).
                        The notice must invite the keeper to pay

                        (e)state that the creditor does not know both the name of the driver and a current address for service for the driver and invite the keeper—

                        (i)to pay the unpaid parking charges
                        .
                        ...............etc


                        This is nowhere on the notice.
                        It only mentions that the driver must pay.



                        CAVEAT LECTOR

                        This is only my opinion - "Opinions are made to be changed --or how is truth to be got at?" (Byron)

                        You and I do not see things as they are. We see things as we are.
                        Cohen, Herb


                        There is danger when a man throws his tongue into high gear before he
                        gets his brain a-going.
                        Phelps, C. C.


                        "They couldn't hit an elephant at this distance!"
                        The last words of John Sedgwick

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          sometimes the issue date, date sent, can be several days apart.

                          the 9 (2) (f), the warning of keeper liability, is not there at all.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Spot on as usual, ostell!

                            Britannia ain't ruling any waves around here!
                            CAVEAT LECTOR

                            This is only my opinion - "Opinions are made to be changed --or how is truth to be got at?" (Byron)

                            You and I do not see things as they are. We see things as we are.
                            Cohen, Herb


                            There is danger when a man throws his tongue into high gear before he
                            gets his brain a-going.
                            Phelps, C. C.


                            "They couldn't hit an elephant at this distance!"
                            The last words of John Sedgwick

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Originally posted by charitynjw View Post
                              Hi

                              Needs better formatting.
                              Paragraphs need numbering.
                              & bigger size lettering. (12)

                              Scrub 9(2)(i)......surely that's the issue date is on the top of the NtK?......25th September 2017

                              Imho, the most important defect here is 9(2)(e).
                              The notice must invite the keeper to pay

                              (e)state that the creditor does not know both the name of the driver and a current address for service for the driver and invite the keeper—

                              (i)to pay the unpaid parking charges
                              .
                              ...............etc


                              This is nowhere on the notice.
                              It only mentions that the driver must pay.


                              Hi Charitynjw

                              The Lettering font is 14pt but for some reason when posting on forum its small??

                              The NtK states " Please be advised that the driver of the motor vehicle is required to pay this parking charge in full. As we do not know the drivers name or current address, and if you were not the driver of the vehicle at the time, you should tell us the name and the current postal address of the driver and pass this notice to them for payment."

                              Surely that meets the criteria of 9(2)(e) doesn't it ???

                              Thanks
                              MiniB

                              Comment

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