**DISCONTINUED**Howard Cohan Cockroaches and Co.

[Amethyst]

Re: Howard Cohan Cockroaches and Co.

Okay SB is a way off then.

You can send a CCA request now or wait until they bring court action. If now, ensure you put in the letter that you do not acknowledge the alleged debt.

If Hoist Portfolio Holding 2 Limited is not authorised to undertake consumer credit business, is it allowed to hire Robinson Way Limited or any other debt collecting agency to collect this debt.

Our rules do not prevent the firm from assigning a third party firm (Robinson Way Limited) to recovery the debt on their behalf, as long as the firm is authorised or has IP.

[charitynjw]

Re: Howard Cohan Cockroaches and Co.

From the FCA

Our guidance under regulated credit agreement as set in the Perimeter Guidance (PERG 2.8.14ZA confirms;

A person who is not an authorised person and exercises, or has the right to exercise, the lender's rights and duties under a regulated credit agreement does not require authorisation to do so where he:

1. (1) arranges for another person to do so and the other person is an authorised person with permission to carry on that regulated activity;

2. (2) does so for up to one month after an arrangement of the kind in (1) comes to an end; or

3. (3) does so under an agreement with an authorised person who has permission to carry on that regulated activity.

Further information on Regulated credit agreements can be accessed at PERG 2.8.14ZA.

[charitynjw]

Re: Howard Cohan Cockroaches and Co.

Got to dash - could some kind person pick the bones out of this:

http://www.lexisnexis.com/uk/lexisps...%80%94overview

@Amethyst @MIKE770 [MENTION=84288]dambuster[/MENTION]

Back soon!

[pandamonia]

Re: Howard Cohan Cockroaches and Co.

From the FCA

Our guidance under regulated credit agreement as set in the Perimeter Guidance (PERG 2.8.14ZA confirms;

A person who is not an authorised person and exercises, or has the right to exercise, the lender's rights and duties under a regulated credit agreement does not require authorisation to do so where he:

1. (1) arranges for another person to do so and the other person is an authorised person with permission to carry on that regulated activity;

2. (2) does so for up to one month after an arrangement of the kind in (1) comes to an end; or

3. (3) does so under an agreement with an authorised person who has permission to carry on that regulated activity.

Further information on Regulated credit agreements can be accessed at PERG 2.8.14ZA.

This seems vague and open to all kinds of interpretation. For example what is stopping no one being FCA approved except one person in the whole country who then gives 40 million people permission to carry out regulated activities. See the problem with this?

I would personally interpret this as an authorised person can give permission to another person to carry out regulated activities such as an IFA to another IFA. I dont see how an authorised person can give permission to a whole debt collection company which that person doesnt actually work for. Especially since that companies own FCA licence was cancelled.

Also note that it says that non FCA licensed companies cannot buy debt. So this shouldnt happen any more but is obviously a legacy of the old system. If anyone can employ any old approved DCA then why cant they buy debt?

Thoughts?

[Amethyst]

Re: Howard Cohan Cockroaches and Co.

Well it's not how you see it it's how the court sees it.

We can go around in circles for ever, I'm pretty sure [MENTION=551]pt2537[/MENTION] said there was a case coming up for appeal that involved the FCA issues ?

This is an old one about agents http://legalbeagles.info/wp-content/..._Ltd_-_199.pdf but obvs things have changed somewhat since then.

[pandamonia]

Re: Howard Cohan Cockroaches and Co.

Well it's not how you see it it's how the court sees it.

We can go around in circles for ever, I'm pretty sure @pt2537 said there was a case coming up for appeal that involved the FCA issues ?

This is an old one about agents http://legalbeagles.info/wp-content/..._Ltd_-_199.pdf

So it clearly is open for debate. Lets hope the people fighting this are good or yet again we end up with a one sided ruling benefiting a bunch of scumbags,

[Amethyst]

Re: Howard Cohan Cockroaches and Co.

Indeed. I wouldn't send anyone into court just arguing the authorisation issues. As a side argument it could be interesting and possibly useful, but I wouldn't rely on it for an entire defence.

[pandamonia]

Re: Howard Cohan Cockroaches and Co.

Indeed. I wouldn't send anyone into court just arguing the authorisation issues. As a side argument it could be interesting and possibly useful, but I wouldn't rely on it for an entire defence.

Personally i like to have 10 things for them to jump over in the hope they conclude there is an easier target out there.

[charitynjw]

Re: Howard Cohan Cockroaches and Co.

This seems vague and open to all kinds of interpretation. For example what is stopping no one being FCA approved except one person in the whole country who then gives 40 million people permission to carry out regulated activities. See the problem with this?
A small problem - one person would have to have 40 million signed agreements, acceptable to the FCA, in which they guarantee the behaviour of 40 million others, & accept liability for any wrongdoing. What could possibly go wrong, lol!

I would personally interpret this as an authorised person can give permission to another person to carry out regulated activities such as an IFA to another IFA. I dont see how an authorised person can give permission to a whole debt collection company which that person doesnt actually work for. Especially since that companies own FCA licence was cancelled.

Also note that it says that non FCA licensed companies cannot buy debt. So this shouldnt happen any more but is obviously a legacy of the old system. If anyone can employ any old approved DCA then why cant they buy debt?

Thoughts?

####

[pandamonia]

Re: Howard Cohan Cockroaches and Co.

####

its possible

[pandamonia]

Re: Howard Cohan Cockroaches and Co.

I have just been in to Santander for a debt that i used to have with them which is now owned by hoist 2. The Default date doesnt match any defaults i used to have and the bank says that the account number doesnt match any of my old accounts with them.

How on earth do i sort this mess our without admitting the debt in writing?

[Amethyst]

Re: Howard Cohan Cockroaches and Co.

Tell them that you have received a letter from them chasing a debt which you do not acknowledge or recognise under reference xxxxxxxxxxxxxx and ask for the agreement formally under the CCA ( with your £1 ). When they reply, if they know what it is, they will tell you, if they don't they'll just say they are getting the credit agreement. It could be an amalgamation of more than one debt with a new reference. Santander has lots of store / credit cards etc under its umbrella so it could be anything, not necessarily a santander branded account/card.

[pandamonia]

Re: Howard Cohan Cockroaches and Co.

Tell them that you have received a letter from them chasing a debt which you do not acknowledge or recognise under reference xxxxxxxxxxxxxx and ask for the agreement formally under the CCA ( with your £1 ). When they reply, if they know what it is, they will tell you, if they don't they'll just say they are getting the credit agreement. It could be an amalgamation of more than one debt with a new reference. Santander has lots of store / credit cards etc under its umbrella so it could be anything, not necessarily a santander branded account/card.

I know everything i used to have. They have changed the default date. This is the problem i also this the account number is wrong on the credit file...

I just got my Xperian credit file for £15 to see if its any better than noddle and it has LESS info than noddle does!

[dambuster]

Re: Howard Cohan Cockroaches and Co.

Okay SB is a way off then.

You can send a CCA request now or wait until they bring court action. If now, ensure you put in the letter that you do not acknowledge the alleged debt.

this post shows why the FCC do not understand the rules as set by the government What you need consumer credit authorisation for

OK hoist are not a lender, when they buy debt from the Leander they become the owner of that debt that now means there is no lender as they have payed the lender off (they put the fire out) so no rights of a lender now exists
once a debt is paid all rights by a lender is ended
also transferring the rights would need the new owner to be registered to enforce the rights of a loan (I.e right of lender to adjust interest rates etc that just one to mention)
that leaves hoist as the owner if you say he is a lender then he needs to be authorized

"(The FCA will allow certain regulated activities to be carried on by appointed representatives
(who are not themselves authorised)
where an authorised firm (the principal) appoints the representative on the terms prescribed by the FCA rules. The authorised firm remains fully responsible for any misconduct by their appointed representative during the course of carrying on the authorised firm's business. The rules require the principal to establish, implement and maintain adequate policies and procedures to ensure that the agent complies fully with the principal's regulatory obligations (CONC 14.1.4.R(1)).9)"


hoist are not (the principal because they are not authorized)
(hoist use their appointed representative Robinson way to collect money for them)
no one is employeing hoist as a representative
but
hoist are employing Robinson way as there representative
there fore hoist are the the principal and unlicensed
look forward to replys

[dambuster]

Re: Howard Cohan Cockroaches and Co.

Originally Posted by charitynjw
From the FCA

Our guidance under regulated credit agreement as set in the Perimeter Guidance (PERG 2.8.14ZA confirms;

A person who is not an authorised person and exercises, or has the right to exercise, the lender's rights and duties under a regulated credit agreement does not require authorisation to do so where he:

1. (1) arranges for another person to do so and the other person is anauthorised person with permission to carry on that regulated activity;

2. (2) does so for up to one month after an arrangement of the kind in (1) comes to an end; or

3. (3) does so under an agreement with an authorised person who haspermission to carry on that regulated activity.

Further information on Regulated credit agreementscan be accessed at PERG 2.8.14ZA.


as debt has been paid off by hoist no right of Leander exist because original lenders rights have ended on payment of debt hoist can not be a lender
and as hoist are unlicensed company the licensed rights that did existed with first company are regulated so they cant be transferd


fcc in document named Debt activities – Common misunderstandings
14. I don’t need debt collecting as I only collect under exempt
agreements
Debt collecting includes taking steps to procure payment of a debt under a credit agreement. This is irrespective
of whether the agreement is regulated or exempt. It does not though include debts under agreements which are
not credit agreements (or consumer hire agreements or regulated peer-to-peer loans), such as utility bill debts, or
debts owed by companies (as these are not ‘credit agreements’).