Court hearing imminent

[sam17]

Sorry, previously posted in wrong forum
Hello
Previously I was just a lurker and have learned a fair deal through this forum. Many thanks.
Anyhow… I am now out of my comfort zone and any help would be much appreciated.

Out of the blue I received a county court order for an alleged debt (account date) Feb 2006.
I filed my defence stating I do not acknowledge the debt, I have not made any payments or signed any agreement with the plaintiff for more than 6-yrs. I did repeatedly ask the plaintiff for proof of debt. (up to about 5 years ago) when they were phoning and writing on a daily basis with threats.

Eventually, to a point the letters and phone calls stopped although they did write and call occasionally (less than once a month) I always asked for proof and would then refuse to speak on the phone or reply to their letters….their letters were always filed, unfortunately in the bin.

Anyhow I have no proof for my requests for documents at that time.
But after the court document arrived I wrote to the DCA and asked for said documents with the £1 fee. The cheque has been cashed but still no documents have arrived (now 30 days ago).

I wrote to the court 10 days ago informing them the DCA have ignored my request…(not sure if that was a good idea)
Anyhow, today I have received a letter back from the court, and I presume a copy to the plaintiff. That they (DCA) produce said documents to me within 21 days and a copy sent to the court. They go on to say I have a further 14 days to amend my defence?. They also say if the original document cannot be produced a reconstituted one will suffice.

I was 100% sure this alleged debt was statute barred, however after recently seeing online my credit file, a default was issued in Nov. 2010 which according to the default leaves me a few months short of the limitations. They also have issued a default every month this year.

I am unsure what happens next, I am absolutely certain I have made no payments or signed any agreement ever.
The default in Nov 2010 is a worry. The court asking for amended defence (I didn’t realise I asked to)
The reconstituted cca, the alleged debt stems from 2006, I was under the impression pre-2007 it had to be a copy of the original and the original produced in court. They say (DCA) I made a contractual agreement with them, I did not, can they reconstruct that also?

This is a credit card alleged debt, passed on many times to different DCA’s
Thanks…long winded I know, I hope it is easy to follow.

[JulieM]

Re: Court hearing imminent

How much is the claim for?

There is case law that says the default date is not necessarily the cause of action, t is when the amount first can be due. [MENTION=87380]Diana M[/MENTION]

[sam17]

Re: Court hearing imminent

Thanks for the reply.
The amount is £1320.

I would agree about the default date, but then why would the dca proceed. I would imagine they will say I signed an agreement between July and November 2010 but who knows what they will come up with yet

[sam17]

Re: Court hearing imminent

...in the meantime. The dca have wrote, they will endeavour to produce the documents I requested but they don't have them to hand, they go on to say they may not be able to produce in the time I asked. It must have been posted before they got the letter from the court (21 days to produce) Can they ask for more time? I have already been waiting 32 days. I am of course hopeful the judge will say no. I can of course understand some delay contacting others etc, but they could have sent the agreement with them I allegedly signed with no delay, could they not?

[Amethyst]

Re: Court hearing imminent

I think you might need to post a copy of the letter from the court, or at least type the exact wording of the letter so we can see exactly what you need to do. Is there a sanction on the order for non-compliance ? Did the court order an amended defence or only once documents had been supplied ?

[sam17]

Re: Court hearing imminent

Thank you for your reply, I’m sorry but I’m a bit paranoidand I do know DCA’s read these forums and am reluctant to give full details…..anyhow
This is the letter from the court (which arrived before the plaintiffs response to my request, the plaintiff responded 1 day later, so it is safe to assume the plaintiff had not got this letter at the time of writing to me)
General Form of Judgement or Order
Before District Judge… sitting at the ……
Upon referral to the District Judge
IT IS ORDERED THAT
1, The claimant shall by 4pm 10 October file at the court and send to the defendant a copy of the credit agreement with ……bank or if no longer available a reconstituted copy and a copy of the default notice served and the account history.
2, Upon receipt of the documents the defendant shall by 4pm 24 October send to the court and the claimant an amended defence.
-------------------------------

In the meantime as mentioned, the dca letter arrived, it is not possible they saw the letter from the court before posting this.

Dear Sir
Our Client…….
Balance Due £1320.00
Original Creditor……..
Original Account Number:…….
We acknowledge receipt of you letter dated 30 Aug 2016, the contents of which have been noted.
We are currently awaiting documentation which has been requested from your original creditor.We will try to provide these documents as soon as possible but this is contingent on receiving the documents from the original creditor within a reasonable timescale.
If you have any queries please do not hesitate to contact us.
--------------------------------------------------------

[Kati]

Re: Court hearing imminent

tagging [MENTION=6]Amethyst[/MENTION] xx

[Amethyst]

Re: Court hearing imminent

Ahhh ok that's good then. Nothing for you to do but wait for the docs or for 11th Oct in the case they don't supply them. Then you can either do your defence or inform the court of the claimants non compliance, the court can then strike or give them more time. . Sometimes with these orders the claimant will apply to the court for an extension.

[sam17]

Re: Court hearing imminent

Thank you Amethyst, sorry for the q's. But why would they not supply what they already have...their alleged agreement with me, surely they should produce this without delay...I can understand the delay with the supposed initial creditor but not their own stuff

[Amethyst]

Re: Court hearing imminent

You don't have any agreement with the dca only by assignment. If the original claim says different could u type the particulars of claim out pls.

[sam17]

Re: Court hearing imminent

Thanks for the reply
The court claim form merely stated. Failed to keep to contractual agreement

[Amethyst]

Re: Court hearing imminent

Okay, that will mean between yourself and the original creditor ( now them by assignment ) - could probably have argued the particulars were vague in your original defence.

They SHOULD have had sight of the documents before bringing the claim, but in reality they pretty much just have a list of names and amounts owed. The Civil Procedure rules committee have been looking for a long time now at introducing strict preaction protocols for debt claims - by where the claimant would have to provide copies of the agreement etc BEFORE even starting a claim - but of course industry is dead against that - currently I believe they get something like only 5-10% of claims defended.

Stat barred - the default date showing on a credit file isn't necessarily anything near the actual date of default so although can be used as an idea the claimants can't rely on it for cause of action.

[sam17]

Re: Court hearing imminent

Ok thanks, I guess I should just wait for the docs to arrive and see what they say.

[sam17]

Re: Court hearing imminent

Just wondered..
Only a few days left for the dca to comply with the courts order:-
To produce documents.. to me and the court.
I have strong hunch they will not, assuming they don't, should I write to the court and ask the case be struck out? If so, how would I word it?
I assume they will ask for more time but given they have had well over 6 years already (although I know they would dispute that) can I argue that would be unfair or would the court grant them more time automatically?.
Thanks..

[sam17]

Re: Court hearing imminent

Hello
The claimant has failed to produce documents to me (not sure if they have sent them to court..(would that be sneaky?)...anyhow, I thought I should write to the court.
Could someone please have a look at my proposed letter to the court before I post...thanks in advance

Date: 07/10/2016
Claim No. xxxxx
Claimant: xxxxx
Defendant: xxxxxx
Dear Sir
I am the defendant.
Further to your letter dated 6 September 2016; ‘General Form of Judgment or Order’.
“Before District Judge xxx at the County Court at xxxx”
IT IS ORDERED THAT
The claimant shall by 4pm 7 October file at the court and send to the defendant a copy of the credit agreement with xxxBank or if no longer available a reconstituted copy and a copy of the default notice served and the account history.

Upon receipt of the documents the defendant shall by 4pm 21 October send to the court and the claimant an amended defence.
…………………………………………………..
I have not received any such documents ordered by the court.
I did formally request these documents on 28 August and enclosed a cheque for the statuary £1.00 fee, which was cashed.
This claim only came to light when I received the court papers.

I notice on the claim; the alleged account start date 12/01/06 and opening balance of £1,320
Now almost 10 years later (according to the claimant’s dates) the balance is the same, except for the claimant’s added fees; interest and court costs.
So in a 10 year period I have not paid or acknowledged any such debt.

I then, after taking advice, obtained a copy of my credit file, where I noticed a default was issued, dated 02/12/2010.
Previously I did not know anything about this default, I have never ever seen my credit report before this time.
I believe the claimant is vexatious, where they clearly have no grounds for court action.

They have failed to provide my request and the courts order for documentation.
PRACTICE DIRECTION – PRE-ACTION CONDUCT AND PROTOCOLS
https://www.justice.gov.uk/courts/pr...n_conduct#17.1
Para 6
Steps before issuing a claim at court
(a) the claimant writing to the defendant with concise details of the claim. The letter should include the basis on which the claim is made, a summary of the facts, what the claimant wants from the defendant, and if money, how the amount is calculated;
(c) the parties disclosing key documents relevant to the issues in dispute.

I would add

Time limit for actions for sums recoverable by statute.
http://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/1980/58/section/9
(1)An action to recover any sum recoverable by virtue of any enactment shall not be brought after the expiration of six years from the date on which the cause of action accrued.

The claimant may argue on the date of action, where they issued a default on my credit file, dated, 02/12/2010. However I had no knowledge of this action and the claimant failed to send me any documents/agreements for me to sign at that time.
Or indeed I have had sight of to this day.
Yours faithfully
XXX