Lowell/shop direct court paper ...what next

[màid_Màrián]

Re: Lowell/shop direct court paper ...what next

OK thanks guys

[charitynjw]

Re: Lowell/shop direct court paper ...what next

Btw

The lady was also using the HSBC case

If this was Carey v HSBC [2009]
http://www.bailii.org/ew/cases/EWHC/QB/2009/3417.html
At 231

...........for so long as the breach persists. If it does, the agreement remains unenforceable

The breach referred to is non-compliance with s78 CCA

[màid_Màrián]

Re: Lowell/shop direct court paper ...what next

I am right in thinking a copy of the contract even if it was a 2006 one isn't not sufficient since this was a 2006 debt and it should have been a signed one ?

[charitynjw]

Re: Lowell/shop direct court paper ...what next

I am right in thinking a copy of the contract even if it was a 2006 one isn't not sufficient since this was a 2006 debt and it should have been a signed one ?

Not necessarily a 'wet ink' signature, though.
http://www.legislation.gov.uk/uksi/2004/3236/note/made
http://www.legislation.gov.uk/uksi/2...article/4/made
Applicable from 31/12/2004.

[màid_Màrián]

Re: Lowell/shop direct court paper ...what next

But the copy would have to be a signed one and not a blank one like what they produced and convinced the judge was OK?

She was saying pre 2007 or not it's all the same

[charitynjw]

Re: Lowell/shop direct court paper ...what next

But the copy would have to be a signed one and not a blank one like what they produced and convinced the judge was OK?

She was saying pre 2007 or not it's all the same

It's all very complicated, but as far as I know re signatures:
The Electronic Communications Order (links above, post #139) amended the Agreements Regs 1983 s6 (http://www.legislation.gov.uk/uksi/1...ulation/6/made) to allow for online/electronic signatures.

However, the 'pre-2007' issue concerns the so-called 'prescribed terms' (or lack of them).
In the original CCA 1974, if any the relevant terms were missing from the agreement, then s127.3 kicked in & the court was barred from enforcing the agreement.
This was changed via the Consumer Credit Act 2006, & so from April 2007, s127.3 was done away with & enforcement is now at the court's discretion.

I think I've got that right! :dizzy:

[màid_Màrián]

Re: Lowell/shop direct court paper ...what next

So the judge can just
Make his own mind up like he did :/ ... well best arrange my 1st payment of 6 years worth

[charitynjw]

Re: Lowell/shop direct court paper ...what next

So the judge can just
Make his own mind up like he did :/ ... well best arrange my 1st payment of 6 years worth

In your particular case I believe the judge made an error.
If the Claimant has failed to comply with s78 CCA, the agreement is unenforceable until the non-compliance is remedied.
It is not for anyone to presume that it can/may/possibly be able to remedy; s78(6) is clear on that.
At the very least there should have been an adjournment; even better would have been an 'unless' order. (ie 7 days to produce or the claim is struck out, that sort of thing).
If it were me as a Defendant, unless the judge at the hearing explained carefully why he came to his decision (& I agreed with his explanation) I would probably want written 'reasons' with view to taking it further. (With one eye on potential costs, of course).

[màid_Màrián]

Re: Lowell/shop direct court paper ...what next

Thanks I'm going to speak to a solicitor in person this week and take all the info and see what she makes of it may. You guys have been fantastic. His reason for not asking to see a copy was that he felt seeing a true copy of the terms was going to make me remember the debt so it was pointless

[Diana M]

Re: Lowell/shop direct court paper ...what next

By the time you sit down to Christmas Dinner this ordeal will all be history and your life won't have changed one iota

When I made the above post last month I meant every single word of it.

You may have grounds for an appeal but a transcript of the hearing (the first essential for an appeal) could cost you £200 depending on the length of the hearing. Then if you lose the appeal you are vulnerable to the other side's legal costs despite this being a Small Claims Court Issue. This is a £1k claim (give or take).

Do you really want to put yourself through more purgatory?

From the way you describe the events of the hearing the other side's legal representative ambushed you before you even went into court.

It seems from what you say that you were tricked into admitting your PTSD may have been responsible for clouding your recollection of events (not getting the Ts & Cs etc.)

That then enabled the DJ (who was given this information by the other side's legal representative) to take the view that on the balance of probabilities you got them but your head was in a fog so you didn't remember.

If I've misunderstood the situation then I apologise.

What I can say from following your thread is that to me you come across as a good person who tells the truth. If the DJ didn't see that then that's his problem.

It's your choice as to how you deal with things from now on.

If you can agree a respectable payment option so you can walk away from this horror knowing you have the moral high ground and move on with your life then that's one option to consider.

If you want to fight on then I'm sure you'll get the support you need from the forum to do that.

Either way you'll sit down to Christmas dinner as the same person you were before all this horrid legal stuff got in the way of you enjoying your life

Di

[charitynjw]

Re: Lowell/shop direct court paper ...what next

Thanks I'm going to speak to a solicitor in person this week and take all the info and see what she makes of it may. You guys have been fantastic. His reason for not asking to see a copy was that he felt seeing a true copy of the terms was going to make me remember the debt so it was pointless

Hi MM

When you speak to your sol, also ask her about the possibility of court fee remission.
I do (reluctantly) agree with [MENTION=87380]Diana M[/MENTION]; it is easy to get carried away with righteous indignation, especially when you've been hard done by, but it is sensible to step back & consider from a pragmatic POV. (Hence my previous comment re costs).
I'll be interested to see what your sol has to say.
I wouldn't be at all surprised if part of her advice is that, sometimes, the law is an ass!

[màid_Màrián]

Re: Lowell/shop direct court paper ...what next

Hey guys ... I think iv come to the desission I'm just going to pay it off. This has really took its toll on me and I have other things to take my time like my 4 beautiful kids. Iv also had my medication changed and it's making me feel awful so the last thing I need is another day at court lol thanks for ALL your help. Every single one and I hope anyone else reading this gets some help. If I was to do it again and be armed with as much legislation as you can get and be prepped for them twisting it lol

[nemesis45]

Re: Lowell/shop direct court paper ...what next

Hey guys ... I think iv come to the desission I'm just going to pay it off. This has really took its toll on me and I have other things to take my time like my 4 beautiful kids. Iv also had my medication changed and it's making me feel awful so the last thing I need is another day at court lol thanks for ALL your help. Every single one and I hope anyone else reading this gets some help. If I was to do it again and be armed with as much legislation as you can get and be prepped for them twisting it lol

A good choice I think!!

Best wishes for Christmas and the new year.

nem

[Diana M]

Re: Lowell/shop direct court paper ...what next

I do (reluctantly) agree with @Diana M; it is easy to get carried away with righteous indignation, especially when you've been hard done by, but it is sensible to step back & consider from a pragmatic POV.

I agree with that

Since the OP didn't ask the DJ for permission to appeal at the end of the hearing they will have to first make an application for permission to appeal before any appeal will be considered.

My personal view is that sometimes it's just not worth the emotional wear 'n' tear. Being in the right can be good enough.

MM you did brilliantly. You faced your fears and survived. You should be proud of yourself for doing that. Christmas spent with your four children more than compensates for the time spent in court.

Di