CCJ Please - Court Hearing help

[nemesis45]

Re: CCJ Please - Court Hearing help

1. There has only on judgement in this case? yes

2. The current " case " is for set aside of that judgement? yes

3. There is no other claim proposed at this time. no

As advised by you will take all pages photocopies X 3 to prove I was out of the country + original passport.

thanks

Thank you MG that make every thing clear simple and uncomplicated at last :tinysmile_grin_t:

nem

[mightyg]

Re: CCJ Please - Court Hearing help

I will let u know the hearing outcom

thanks for ur help

[nemesis45]

Re: CCJ Please - Court Hearing help

I will let u know the hearing outcom

thanks for ur help

You are most welcome!!

Good luck
nem

[nemesis45]

Re: CCJ Please - Court Hearing help

I will let u know the hearing outcom

thanks for ur help

In reply to your PM mightyG,

You counter the claimants WS claim that an NOA was sent by stating that you do not believe
an NOA was sent as you have a file of documents relating to the alleged debt and there is no
such document included.

nem

[mightyg]

Re: CCJ Please - Court Hearing help

thanks nem

[mightyg]

Re: CCJ Please - Court Hearing help

Hi I’ve been to the court today and claimant solicitor was already waiting for me and he then took me to the room and advised to share any evidence after providing him with copes of my passport he went back to deal with other case by saying he be back in the room, However when he came back it was already the hearing time.

Judge room
Judge start by saying that gives me the reason to defend the case if I set aside the judgement and he was reading the claimants witness statement.
I’ve advised that this is not my account I never have contract and provided evidence with different addresses at this point claimant solicitor interrupted by saying he need to see these as he is not aware and there can be secondary addresses.
Next argument solicitor raised was claim sent to the old address which judge supported and advised you have sent the claim to last known registered address. I argued here by saying as this is not my account and I’ve no responsibility to update claimant and I’ve never received any prior correspondence regarding this debt. Judge queried solicitor if they can provide any evidence of contract/assignment. Solicitor said he needs time for that as need to speak to O2. Judge said in your witness statement (claimants) you have mentioned that deed agreement has been provided where is it? Solicitor said he will check he is not aware.
I’ve then provided letter sent to show I promptly responded as solicitor queried why it took so long judge was happy with my explanation. I’ve then shown documents showing conflict in information provided by O2 and DCAs however judge was not impressed by that and refused that this is not a statue barred debt (he said in dec-13 it would have been not in nov-13).
Judgement
In the end judge agreed to set-aside judgement using 13.3 (I’ve used this in my witness statement as well) and main reason he gave me was that he haven’t seen any contract/assignment and claimant need to provide that. Solicitor tried his best by arguing that judge should rather adjourn this hearing and give 54 days time however judge refused and also mentioned that no legal costs to be added but again solicitor argued and quoted some paragraphs this time judge said he will leave this to the next judge who will deal this case.
In the end I am given 7 days to file my defence. Here are my defence points which I’ve presented today to judge n sols.
Defence
2. The defendant does not acknowledge any debt to the Claimant or any other company or organisation that Claimant claim to be representing.
3. Each and every allegation in the Claimants statement of case is denied unless specifically admitted in this defence.
4. The Claimants statement of case fails to give adequate information to enable defendant to properly assess defendant’s position with regards the claim.
5. The Claimants statement of case states that the account was assigned from T-MOBILE to Lowell DCA. Claimant have failed to provide notice of this assignment.
6. The particulars of claim fail to state the account ownership. The Defendant’s address details at the time account was opened are wrong (Copies Attached).
7. The Claimants statement of case fails to give adequate information related to account. As per the Subject Access Request details received from the claimant, Claimant’s record shows that the last payment made to original creditor company T-MOBILE is on 26-Aug-2008, however Subject Access Request details provided by the original creditor company T-MOBILE shows no payments made during this period.
8. Under Civil Procedure Rule 16.5 (4) where the claim includes a money claim, a defendant shall be taken to require that any allegation relating to the amount of money claimed be proved unless he expressly admits the allegation. Therefore It is expected that the Claimant be required to prove the allegation that the money is owed as claimed.
9. The defendant has sent a letter to the Claimant by recorded delivery on 08-Jun-2015 requesting the Claimant for the disclosure and the production of a verified and certified copy of Deed of Assignment & Deed of Novation. The Claimant has failed to produce any verified and certified copies of the Deed of Assignment, Deed of Novation and Default Notice under S.7 Data Protection Act 1998 & CPR 31.14. The defendant demands that in accordance with s.136 (1) of the law of property act 1925, that the claimant do provide proof of absolute assignment, by providing a certified copy of the deed of assignment between T-MOBILE and the Claimant to show proof of complete transfer and ownership (all rights, title, interest, benefits and liabilities) and that they have the power to give good discharge pursuant to s.136 (1) (c) of the law of property act.
11. Under the Limitation Act 1980 Claimant cannot take court action unless claimant can provide evidence of payment or written contact from me within the past six years.
12. The dates listed for this alleged debt would also mean that the debt would have been unenforceable due to the fact that it was over six years old and
• The Defendant has not paid any part of this debt in the last six (6) years.
• The Defendant has not acknowledged the debt in writing in the last six (6) years.
• The Defendant has reminded the Claimant that the debt has become statute barred in accordance with THE LIMITATION ACT 1980 (SECTION 5), by letter dated 08-Jun-2015 (Recorded Delivery).The debt is statue barred under the Limitation Act 1980 Section 5 and no further acknowledgement or payment has been made since that time.
13. Defendants credit reports show registered UK address during the period of claim and Claimant had no reason to have sent the court papers to the previous address.
14. I request the court orders the Claimants to provide the necessary documentation in order for me to fully plead my case else the Claim should stand struck out.
15. In the event that the relevant documents are received from the Claimants I will then be in a position to amend my defence, and would ask that the Claimants bear the costs of the amendment.




I would need your expert advice to get rid of this. I’ve no idea what I’ve to do next.


Thanks alot

[FlamingParrot]

Re: CCJ Please - Court Hearing help

Hi I’ve been to the court today and claimant solicitor was already waiting for me and he then took me to the room and advised to share any evidence after providing him with copes of my passport he went back to deal with other case by saying he be back in the room, However when he came back it was already the hearing time.

Judge room
Judge start by saying that gives me the reason to defend the case if I set aside the judgement and he was reading the claimants witness statement.
I’ve advised that this is not my account I never have contract and provided evidence with different addresses at this point claimant solicitor interrupted by saying he need to see these as he is not aware and there can be secondary addresses.
Next argument solicitor raised was claim sent to the old address which judge supported and advised you have sent the claim to last known registered address. I argued here by saying as this is not my account and I’ve no responsibility to update claimant and I’ve never received any prior correspondence regarding this debt. Judge queried solicitor if they can provide any evidence of contract/assignment. Solicitor said he needs time for that as need to speak to O2. Judge said in your witness statement (claimants) you have mentioned that deed agreement has been provided where is it? Solicitor said he will check he is not aware.
I’ve then provided letter sent to show I promptly responded as solicitor queried why it took so long judge was happy with my explanation. I’ve then shown documents showing conflict in information provided by O2 and DCAs however judge was not impressed by that and refused that this is not a statue barred debt (he said in dec-13 it would have been not in nov-13).
Judgement
In the end judge agreed to set-aside judgement using 13.3 (I’ve used this in my witness statement as well) and main reason he gave me was that he haven’t seen any contract/assignment and claimant need to provide that. Solicitor tried his best by arguing that judge should rather adjourn this hearing and give 54 days time however judge refused and also mentioned that no legal costs to be added but again solicitor argued and quoted some paragraphs this time judge said he will leave this to the next judge who will deal this case.
In the end I am given 7 days to file my defence. Here are my defence points which I’ve presented today to judge n sols.

You say above that the judge agreed to set aside the judgment as per CPR 13.3 and that he refused to adjourn and give the claimant 54 days. YOu also say you presented your defence at the hearing. What is it you have to do in 7 days then?

[mightyg]

Re: CCJ Please - Court Hearing help

Sorry if there is a confusion: I will make this clear

Judgement has been set aside. Solicitor did requested for 54 days delay however judge turned that down.

At the start of meeting judge asked me present something which will convince him to think if judgement is set-aside I am able to defend it. Then I prsented the drafted defence and Judge was ok for me to present the 'draft defence'.

And in the end when judgement was set aside, Judge told me to submit defense in 7 days to court and to Claimant.

Thanks

[nemesis45]

Re: CCJ Please - Court Hearing help

Sorry if there is a confusion: I will make this clear

Judgement has been set aside. Solicitor did requested for 54 days delay however judge turned that down.

Judge told me to submit defense in 7 days to court and to Claimant.

Thanks

Don't worry mg it's quite clear what is needed,>I see you have PM'd me so I'll take a look .

nem

[nemesis45]

Re: CCJ Please - Court Hearing help

Sorry if there is a confusion: I will make this clear

Judgement has been set aside. Solicitor did requested for 54 days delay however judge turned that down.

At the start of meeting judge asked me present something which will convince him to think if judgement is set-aside I am able to defend it. Then I prsented the drafted defence and Judge was ok for me to present the 'draft defence'.

And in the end when judgement was set aside, Judge told me to submit defense in 7 days to court and to Claimant.

Thanks

HelloMG,

Responding to your PM,

It's clear I think that the judge was " unhappy" with both parties submissions and has on " the balance of probabilities " that it was fair/reasonable to set the original judgement aside on the evidence of your passport entries showing you out of the UK at the time the claim was issued.

Then the Big BUT!! You now have to formulate a defence to the actual claim it seems that what we have to work with is a little lacking in impact.

Please clarify where were you at the point when this alleged account was opened?
Resident in the UK at the address provided when the alleged agreement was signed?

Resident in the UK but not at the address on the agreement?
Have you at any time been resident at the address on agreement?
Your main submission is that you have never at any time been a customer
of the original creditor?

The claims that you have never made any payments to or acknowledgments of the debt, and that it is statute barred appears to have caught the judges eye, so please clarify this point the debt was not SB in November xxxx but was SB in December XXXX.
Is this because of alleged payments to the account being made?

The alleged payments: How were the payments made: A Direct Debt appears to have been disclosed allegedly signed by you??
What do you submit to counter this item of evidence.?? As I understand it, this has your banking details, complete and correct?
Were any payments debited to that account and when were they made??
Confirm the above and we can build a more logical defence.

nem

[mightyg]

Re: CCJ Please - Court Hearing help

Please clarify where were you at the point when this alleged account was opened?
I was at different address I’ve moved couple of months before the contract date as obtained from order details page in T-Mob SAR.
Resident in the UK at the address provided when the alleged agreement was signed?
Yes But different address same county. I only have my bank details and Dell contract for that period to show that I was at different address.
Also I’ve shown these evidences to judge and claimaint during hearing and they did mention that could be my secondary address.
Resident in the UK but not at the address on the agreement?
Yes
Have you at any time been resident at the address on agreement?
Yes, for around 6 months it’s a shared accommodation flats in house.
Your main submission is that you have never at any time been a customer
of the original creditor?
Yes that’s true, that’s why I asked to provide copies of contract.
‘During hearing yesterday Judge basically told me that its not possible to otain contact without defendant physically going to the shop and sign contract’ – Here basically he was trying to say that I must have signed a contract and I am liable for this. Then I’ve explained judge that’s not the case and O2 told me that there is no contract as phone can be ordered by phone call or internet. And Judge was convinced with my explanation as I mentioned that this is fraudulent activity in my absence.
The claims that you have never made any payments to or acknowledgments of the debt, and that it is statute barred appears to have caught the judges eye, so please clarify this point the debt was not SB in November xxxx but was SB in December XXXX.
When I said Sir, if there were payments the debt should have reduced or there should be credit note, judge was convinced and asked claimant to provide more details regarding the payment which is showing in their records however claimant has no record of that.
Then he looked into the 3 invoices (produced on 27^th in may,jun,jul) in total which makes the total balance outstanding. And these are produced may,jun, jul-07. Based on the last invoice date judge concluded that SB date is Jul-13 which is after the claim date 05/06/2007 and judgement date 29/06/2007 (Sorry yesterday I put Nov dec pls ignore)


Is this because of alleged payments to the account being made?
No he was convinced no payments been made
The alleged payments: How were the payments made: A Direct Debt appears to have been disclosed allegedly signed by you??
In O2 SAR it shows 12/06/2007 dd payment been claimed and 13/06/2007 its failed. I’ve checked my statement for this period and there are no DDs been claimed ever from O2
What do you submit to counter this item of evidence.?? As I understand it, this has your banking details, complete and correct?
Judge Didn’t look into the page showing failed DD as he was convinced that there are no payments been made however he calculated SB date based on the last invoice date i.e 27-JUL-07.
Were any payments debited to that account and when were they made??
No Payments ever from my account
Confirm the above and we can build a more logical defence.

I would just like to summarise the hearing outcome yesterday.
In my view the only part which made judge to set-aside was insufficient documents provided by Claimant like no assignment copy and he was also convinced with my dispute on payment record not reconciling. He completely ignored me being outside country my different address proof he was more convinced with the CPR sections and other paragraph stuff.
I appreciate your help Nem. I was also wondering, now when the CCJ has been set aside, is there an option to negotiate with the claimant on payments rather than sending the defence. Will that force claimant to withdraw case? I am just looking at this option if my defence looks weak I would rather preffer to pay thatn having CCJ for 6 years as I am planning to buy a house. Or if you think I have enough evidence to challenge the case I can proceed with defence.

Thanks.

[nemesis45]

Re: CCJ Please - Court Hearing help

Why would one want to negotiate a payment for an account/debt they do not owe??

nem

[mightyg]

Re: CCJ Please - Court Hearing help

Its just because I thought if I lose there will be CCJ straight away however I’ve called court and they confirmed in case I lose will be given 28 days to pay. Now I’ve decided to file my defence with your help.

Thanks.

[mightyg]

Re: CCJ Please - Court Hearing help

:doggieyes::doggieyes::doggieyes::doggieyes::doggi eyes::doggieyes::doggieyes::beagle::beagle::beagle ::beagle:

[FlamingParrot]

Re: CCJ Please - Court Hearing help

Its just because I thought if I lose there will be CCJ straight away however I’ve called court and they confirmed in case I lose will be given 28 days to pay. Now I’ve decided to file my defence with your help.

Thanks.

Statute barred is an absolute defence. :thumb:

If you are able to pay in full a CCJ within one month of the date the judgment was made, it gets wiped off the record. That obviously wouldn't apply to a judgment that was made some time ago, such as the one you are setting aside, unless there was a new judgment made, if that makes sense.