MG versus Black Horse PPI on car loan

[magiciansgirl]

Hi,

Would really appreciate some advice. My partner has a car loan with Black Horse and we want to reclaim the PPI as we believe it was mis-sold. Don't need to do an SAR - we have all the paperwork including the policy. I have several questions - forgive my ignorance:

1. Car loan arranged at the dealership. Amount of credit (PPI) £4165.84 repayment over 60 months at £87.14. Can't work out if this is this a single premium or not? APR 9.7%
2. Can we also try and reclaim the charge for credit on PPI - £604.56?


N.B Included with the agreement is a 'Demands and Needs Statement' headed:

'Decline to recommend' which says that 'the ppi being offered to you is not suitable for your particular demands and needs' and which my partner signed. It goes on to refer to the PPI as optional (and does say the insurance is 'single premium').

My partner says he was then passed on immediately without further discussion to another guy who on the contrary indicated that the PPI was necessary to secure the loan and speed up the process.

SO I'm not sure whether to bring in the demands and needs statement and say he was initially advised against purchasing PPI and then persuaded to? The pre-contract form had the PPI filled in prior to signature and the box has been ticked.

He was also on a fixed-term employment contract at the time so we think we have additional grounds.

He's currently on track with the loan payments but has been late a couple of times in the past - can we reclaim the late payment charges - £30 a time?


Any help much appreciated,

Kind regards,

MG

[WendyB]

Re: MG versus Black Horse PPI on car loan

Hi MG.

From what you've said, it would seem that the PPI could well have been mis-sold. If I were you I would fill in the FOS standard form, the link to it is on my thread, which I believe you've already read? Fill it in and send to Black Horse with a covering letter. Keep a copy for yourself, then if you don't get any joy from Black Horse, you can forward the copy to the FOS. By all accounts though, I'd think you will get a result from Black Horse, to be perfectly honest you have a much stronger case than my SIL did, in my opinion, and she's got a result with minimum hassle, just on the strength of the complaint form.

[Bill-K]

Re: MG versus Black Horse PPI on car loan

Glad you found the spready useful, MG. The PPI should be shown as a separate item in the loan agreement if it is a single-premium PPI. Was the total loan advance £4165.84 - or is this JUST the PPI ?

If this is still an active loan, then you can reclaim the PPI AND the apportioned interest charged on this - for all payments actually made so far. You can also claim 8% interest on each and every such payment made, from the date of each payment. The remainder of the loan then has to be re-scheduled by reducing the future payments to what they would have been if PPI had not been included.

The late payment charges MAY be reclaimable - plus account interest, plus 8% - BUT this depends on what the account balance would have been if the PPI had not been sold. If this would have been sufficiently in credit to cover such late payments, then the answer is yes. This needs a bit more looking at, though. If you want to fill in a spready and send it to me and Turbo at Simiantics@Gmail.com, we'll check it for you - along with the penalty charges.

I agree with Wendy - fill in the questionnaire and send it to the bank first, keeping a copy for yourself. My main concern here is that they seem to have secured a signature on a Needs & Demands form, which they might possibly try and use to show that you bought the PPI despite being advised against doing so. I think we may need to prepare ourselves for this being used as a rebuttal. We may be able to use this Needs & Demands form to our advantage.......maybe.

If you have the name and signature of the jerk who later told you (or your OH) that you still needed PPI in order to get the loan, then this will help - particularly if s/he is then confronted with the possibility that they may stand accused of knowingly and deliberately mis-selling you the PPI, in the full (and admitted) knowledge that the lender had already formally decided that PPI was NOT suitable for this loan.

[Amethyst]

Re: MG versus Black Horse PPI on car loan

try the FOS with the PPI, but I wouldn't try court and would definately take note of Blackhorse v Speak from July 2010 - http://www.bailii.org/ew/cases/EWHC/QB/2010/1866.html

However in that case the D&N showed PPI WAS recommended, in yours it shows it was not. Which brings a greater question in to play as to why it was taken out if not under extreme pressure to do so.

I think you need to make that a major point of your case.

[WendyB]

Re: MG versus Black Horse PPI on car loan

I can only go on what's happened in my SIL's case, and that was that I filled in the form with pretty sparse info, to be honest. Didn't elaborate at all, just said "we were told at the time it was a condition of the loan etc etc".Didn't provide any names or details of the sales person. Said we both got paid if we were off sick so wouldn't have needed it.
And to be perfectly honest, there is a signed demands and needs form signed by both peeps agreeing to it as well. I'm sure if Black Horse tried hard enough they could have shot her claim down in flames.

In your case, I personally wouldn't mention anything about the D & N form etc, would just point out the fixed contract etc and the fact that you were told that it was a condition of the loan, and take it from there. No point giving them any ammo to fire back at you is there?

[Amethyst]

Re: MG versus Black Horse PPI on car loan

Actually, I agree with Wends, only bring it up if they do...they may not even have a copy of your D&N. I'm sure you are aware that blackhorse had over 70% of their complaints that they had refused overturned in the consumers favour by the FOS.

[Bill-K]

Re: MG versus Black Horse PPI on car loan

It sure looks like we need to play this game by keeping our cards close to our chest, and getting LTSB to show us what they have, first.

P.p.p.p.p.poker-face, MG !!!

[magiciansgirl]

Re: MG versus Black Horse PPI on car loan

Thanks to everyone. I am just looking up a few things and will then get back to you. I think we need to get the letter off at the beginning of next week as I hear the Banks may try to fight PPI reclaims soon.

Best wishes, MG

[magiciansgirl]

Re: MG versus Black Horse PPI on car loan

Hi everyone, thanks again for the input.

Bill, the £4165.84 is just for the PPI; the car itself cost £9495. Thanks for the rest of the advice; the loan statements are a bit hard to digest but I will work on this and thanks for offering to help there.

We have the signature of the guy who undertook the demands and needs statement but not the chap who overruled my OH (we weren't a couple then). Black Horse obviously do the finance for the dealership so I guess it depends how tidy the dealers keep their paperwork - this goes back to 2007.

My instinct always has been not to reveal knowledge of the D & N at this stage, so relieved you agree.

I will use the fixed-term contract argument in that he had not worked continuously for the same employer for 24 months at that point therefore the policy would not pay unemployment benefits.

Also, he had and has critical illness protection and was not asked about this. I myself made a successful PPI claim against HSBC on those grounds. It was before the FOS form came into being but I shall certainly use it. I am also adding in that my partner's mother and brother had both recently died and he was not feeling very robust.

Thanks again folks!

Kind regards, MG

[messimoo]

Re: MG versus Black Horse PPI on car loan

had a loan with blackhorse and defaulted as lost my job . they sent court claim form and I I disputed the 3000 they added on for PPI and charges The judge agreed with me ordered 1.00 per month for them and wrote off the PPI and charges so there is hope if you keep a cool head

[magiciansgirl]

Re: MG versus Black Horse PPI on car loan

Hello all.

Black Horse replied fairly speedily saying the dealership were responsible for the PPI and they had passed on all the papers to them. So I guess we now have to tackle the dealership, from whom there has been a resounding silence (6 weeks).

However I am wondering if this is a fobbing-off move, since my OH has now repaid the loan and got an element of PPI rebate in the settlement figure?

Kind regards, MG