Bills not paid..can i take legal action for this problem ..

[vctmfraud]

HI ALL..

I am writing to get an URGENT assistance advice with regard to my bproblems.,

I trusted a relative so that gave my 2 contract phones to be used by him since October 2016. Contract ends in September 2018. He promised he would pay till contract ends.

But from July 2017 he stopped paying so that money has been taken from my Debit account. Guy s now hiding no contacts with me..
Phone co says I am the responsible one for all payments, ( phone plan fees , VAT , any excess bank charges..etc ). I am very worried and nervous..

When I went to Police , they said its a civil matter , take legal action.

Now I decided to cancel all contracts and pay balance payments to the phone company. Then with all proof of documents ,I will take him to court for justice and recover my payments paid to phone comp

Further , Guy has been reported to action fraud for a phone fraud . Also he has a court judgment to pay against a creditor. Having all these , guy is now preparing to Leave UK in 3 weeks according to his friend..

My questions ;

Can I sue him in the Small Claim Court through Money Claim Online? or

Should I instruct a Solicitor ?

How to stop him leaving the UK and make him available to court?

Please advise me .. I will be very grateful for all who advise me.
please..

[jaguarsuk]

Re: Bills not paid..can i take legal action for this problem ..

Hi, you should first consider whether realistically you will get your money back before filing a claim with the court. You will have to pay fees (depending on the amount you claim will depend on the fee) and will only get those back IF you win a judgement AND you are able to enforce the judgement.

You state this person is intending to leave the UK, so even if you get a judgement you won't be able to enforce it as he won't be in this country.

You may issue a claim on Money Claim Online, this will be sent to him and if he Acknowledges Service he'll have 28 days to file a defence. At that stage he'll be out of the country and you'll apply for a default judgement. Basically you'll have paid the cost of a court fee for a piece of paper as that's all it is when you can't enforce the judgement.

If he does choose to stay in the UK and defends the claim you say he agreed with you to pay the bill, was this is writing? When he paid the bill did he give you cash or pay to your bank account?

Without a written agreement or paper trail it will beimpossible for you to prove he agreed with you and he can simply claim you let him use your phone, that he never agreed to pay anything.

It's really bad he has done this to you, but I think you'll have to chalk this one up to experience.

Added: He's not committed a criminal offence and unless a judge issues a warrant he can't be stopped from leaving the UK and even if in the UK without a warrant he can't be made to come to court.

[slainte caragh]

Re: Bills not paid..can i take legal action for this problem ..

Hi welcome to Legal Beagles.

I am pretty clued up with regards to the contract side of things, the phone provider have done everything right with regards to you having to pay the balance of the accounts and not waiving termination fees. The contract is with you alone, not your relative so you are responsible.

With regards to the police having not taken the case, again this is a dispute about a bill with relatives, not a crime so their hands are tied.

What kind of fraud has been reported? Was it yourself that made the allegation (I am not judging you here, just clarifying information). If the fraud was about this particular issue, again this will likely as not be disregarded as this is not fraud. You took the contract out knowingly. If he didn't pay it that is not fraudulent, it's more breach of verbal contract. It would only be classed as fraud if he called in as you and took contracts out without consent,.

Can you sue him: Do you have a written contract saying that he will make these payments or was it a verbal agreement?

Should I instruct a solicitor?: To be honest, if you have no contract my gut feeling is a solicitor would say there is no evidence for a case, this was more an agreement and a breach of trust. No idea if you can sue for this.

How to stop him leaving the country: I doubt you can. Even though he has cost you a lot of money he has not commited a crime. You agreed to do this so there is to my mind no reason to stop him. If there is a allegation of fraud from a 3rd party (i.e work etc) the Fraud Squad would stop him.

Tagging @diana @Amethyst @Peridot @des8 re the court side of things.

[des8]

Re: Bills not paid..can i take legal action for this problem ..

Can't add anything to what has been said except it is possible to enforce a judgement abroad, but whether or not it is worth the attempt is another question.
Here's a useful link;
https://www.out-law.com/topics/dispu...gments-abroad/

[vctmfraud]

Re: Bills not paid..can i take legal action for this problem ..

Thank you very much for all replies.

I brief my problems below :

I bought 3 contracts from phone companies such as 2 Phones from EE & 01 Sim contract from Vodaphone in 2016.
As a relative of mine who's a British Citizen, met me and requested to give all these phones to use by him promising he would pay phones contract fees monthly. He needed these contract phones and SIM as he was banned from getting loans,mortgage , contract phones according to him.

I agreed and told him that I will use one sim for free calls and data and other SIMS with PHONES can be used by him so he should pay bills till contract ends in 2018 . He agreed and has been using phones since Sep 2016.

Some months he ddnt pay but money taken from my direct debit account. Since July 2017 bills not paid by him . Many more time I told but now he turned to talk in an aggressive way.

He has been paid bills through my bank. He will deposited to my bank account and from my account its debited. I have proof for this money deposited which clearly shows his name and bank. This is one of a clause in VERBAL AGREEMENT regarding monthly bill payment.

Then I went to a vodaphone store and checked. Because Vfone contract ends this September 2017. I was pretty happy as this contract is going to end. But, when checking I was shocked .. The guy had updated the contract in August and thus got a new Iphone 7 .

He has stolen my security passwords and all my personal details and had talked to Vodaphone company pretending me thus updated contract and obtained new Iphone 7 contract for 24 months in my name. He even changed my address to somewhere else I never lived . Vodaphone Manager said the guy has used all my details and security password thus did all these over the phone.

I reported to Action Fraud and vodafone. Also try to contact police to stop him leaving UK.

He already got an judgment to pay money to a creditor. He neglected claim sent by court. He s such a rough guy.

I hope I have given main points here. Please advise me .

[Kati]

Re: Bills not paid..can i take legal action for this problem ..

[MENTION=19723]Lee Vodafone Company Rep[/MENTION] ... is there anything you can suggest here??

[slainte caragh]

Re: Bills not paid..can i take legal action for this problem ..

@Lee Vodafone Company Rep ... is there anything you can suggest here??

Allow me Kati,

If someone has your passwords and security details Vodafone have to act in good faith that you have given him them. I very much doubt that there is a lot Lee can do because if you have ever given authorisation for him to speak on the account than that authority stays until you say remove it.

if this is the case it is breach of verbal contract not a fraud.

[Kati]

Re: Bills not paid..can i take legal action for this problem ..

Allow me Kati,

If someone has your passwords and security details Vodafone have to act in good faith that you have given him them. I very much doubt that there is a lot Lee can do because if you have ever given authorisation for him to speak on the account than that authority stays until you say remove it.

if this is the case it is breach of verbal contract not a fraud.

I keep on forgetting you did this SC (sorry) xx

[slainte caragh]

Re: Bills not paid..can i take legal action for this problem ..

No probs hun <3

Tbh, I think that if Action fraud check and Vodafone say it was authorised by password this is little they can do. I hate saying this, truely, but I think that the OP has been had, and no judge or jury in the land will stop someone leaving the country for breaking a promise!

[vctmfraud]

Re: Bills not paid..can i take legal action for this problem ..

Thanks for replies..

As a relative I GAVE Only the Vodafone SIM to b used till contracts ends in September 2017.

I NEVER GAVE Password and NEVER EVER AUTHORIZE HIM to update my contact thus to get a New Contract with a New iPhone. He was with me for some months so would have taken without knowing me.

Anyway EE bill I need to cancel and block phones by paying fees. Then going to claim through small claim court. Bank statements clearly shows his deposit towards bill payment.. If not why he deposited money every month till July 2017 ?

This proof is enough I think..
Please give me more advice.. Pl

[slainte caragh]

Re: Bills not paid..can i take legal action for this problem ..

Thanks for replies..


As a relative I GAVE Only the Vodafone SIM to b used till contracts ends in September 2017
In this case no fraud was commited as you freely gave him the SIM care

I NEVER GAVE Password and NEVER EVER AUTHORIZE HIM to update my contact thus to get a New Contract with a New iPhone. He was with me for some months so would have taken without knowing me
How did you receive your bills? Online? Paper form? When you upgrade a phone you are given information both about your new contract and your new bill. The first bill will show the phone and costs. Also he was walking about with a new phone? You have 14 days from the upgrade date to return and cancel if you don't you are in contract. If after all this you allowed him to keep the phones, no fraud was commited.

Anyway EE bill I need to cancel and block phones by paying fees. Then going to claim through small claim court. Bank statements clearly shows his deposit towards bill payment.. If not why he deposited money every month till July 2017 ?

This proof is enough I think..
Please give me more advice.. Pl

My replies are in blue.

Unfortunatly a lot of this is going to be your word against his unless you have a formal, written agreement he was to pay each month. No judge in the country is going to stop someone from leaving the country for having a CCJ (trust me some people I wish they would!) and Action Fraud might also class this as a civil matter as it is a relative and a verbal agreement, NOT fraud.

My honest to God advice is, if you are hell bent on taking this man to court you should, but it is going to cost a lot of money for something that you have no proof of. Regular credits to a bank account are not proof of contract, he could have been paying you rent.. or the gas bill.. or towards shopping. Unless you have it in writing that this man is due to pay X towards a bill of Z you have no case.

[vctmfraud]

Re: Bills not paid..can i take legal action for this problem ..

I'm v confused and worried.. He changed my email address and house address to Somewhere I never lived.
What shoul I do ? Catch him and get money ? I don't know.. How can I get Justice ?

[slainte caragh]

Re: Bills not paid..can i take legal action for this problem ..

I'm v confused and worried.. He changed my email address and house address to Somewhere I never lived.
What shoul I do ? Catch him and get money ? I don't know.. How can I get Justice ?

Ok

1: Do you have proof (written and documented) that he agreed to pay this bill?

2: Do you have proof that he changed the address (call recordings? Written statement?) (@LeeVodafoneRep how does the OP go about this, I know how O2 do it but not your policies). - PLEASE NOTE: If you have waited longer than 6 months to query this there is a good chance the recording is gone.

3: If he had no authorisation or password to access the account, how did he change this? I worked in the mobile phone industry for over 9 years. There is NO WAY that someone can access an account without some form of password or authorisation from the account holder. Some companies ask for place of birth, some date of birth, some will not allow upgrade without speaking to the account holder. What form of authorisation did he use? A mobile company WILL NOT change an email address without account holder's permission.

4: How long did he have the new iphone before he stopped paying? If you allowed this for more than 14 days you are responsible for the account.

5: What reference did he use as mobile payments? Don't supply the exact numbers but did he for example put VODAFONE BILL NEW PHONE or was it just a payment? - Even if he did put VODAFONE BILL PAYMENT this is not an acknowledgement that he is responsible unless you have a written contract.

As I previously said, my gut feeling is that unless your relative has a change of heart, there is precious little you can do. If you have no proof that he agreed to pay this I honestly feel a solicitor will not touch it as it will end up costing you a fortune to have the case thrown out.

If you have taken out a contract for a 3rd party they ARE NOT commiting fraud by not paying it, they are being complete idiots agreed but there is no law against letting someone down unfortunately.