Welcome finance - wfs advice 2015

[nemesis45]

Re: Welcome finance - wfs advice 2015

i think it was in with the info they sent - its only a 1 pager though - not sure if it's the full agreement or not. looking at things, i think i didn't sign up to ppi... still hoping to go with the affordability/creditworthiness claims and there are a number of charges which i'm going to contest when i transferred over etc - a few hundred pounds but with the interest i've been paying on any unnecessary charges, it adds up!!

It should certainly be more than one page for a secured loan also they must send a signed current statement of the account which could be interesting.

nem

[Struggling26]

Re: Welcome finance - wfs advice 2015

The wonderful world of Welcome accounting.

As you have noticed, welcome agreements and statements are designed so that unless you are a financial auditor, you have no hope of understanding.

Welcome have two sets of interest rates, that being APR and AER

The con is that all welcome agreements are front loaded, a sort of Mortage. That way they hit you with the maximum at the extortionate APR

If you pay the loan off early or have increased your payments the total amount of credit has to be reduced.

I know - i worked out with the first loan i borrowed of £2500, I cleared around £178 of debt over six months despite paying £984....

I think they work it out on the monthly interest reducing each month so I'm paying off more of the balance but I still owe £5300 after 8 years despite the original loan being £17000 over 10 years. I've been paying £271 as a minimum but quite often over last few years I've been paying anywhere from £300-£430 to try and get it paid. Seems a bit of a con they reduce the interest monthly rather than a set rate over the term as if you do try to pay it off earlier you are not benefiting as much. Dread to think how much I've paid, even without their 'hidden extras'.

£32,846.20 (£17,235 loan/charge +£15611.20 credit)

just tallied up i've paid £27,185 so far (eik) and still a balance of £5300 so it's not really reducing the credit by much if I pay sooner...just want to get rid now though!!

[Struggling26]

Re: Welcome finance - wfs advice 2015

it says 'fixed sum loan agreement regulated by the consumer credit act 1974' - a one pager detailing the cost of credit, loan, acceptance fee etc and a signature box - also signed a dd mandate.....

[nemesis45]

Re: Welcome finance - wfs advice 2015

it says 'fixed sum loan agreement regulated by the consumer credit act 1974' - a one pager detailing the cost of credit, loan, acceptance fee etc and a signature box - also signed a dd mandate.....

That's very short on terms and conditions for a secured loan, personally I would be sending a CCA request asap something about
this makes me think there's been some skulduggery here.

nem

[judgemental24]

Re: Welcome finance - wfs advice 2015

Welcome and skulduggery??

That is like:

fish and chips
Chocolate and ice cream

They are inseparable

[Struggling26]

Re: Welcome finance - wfs advice 2015

Ahhh. .....I did send for the cca including a £1 postal order. They sent me a check back with £1 a couple of weeks later??? I assumed they'd sent the info anyway so we're kindly returning the cash....?

[nemesis45]

Re: Welcome finance - wfs advice 2015

Ahhh. .....I did send for the cca including a £1 postal order. They sent me a check back with £1 a couple of weeks later??? I assumed they'd sent the info anyway so we're kindly returning the cash....?

Send another request asap, they cannot refuse and must tell you if they don't have the document.

nem

[Kafka]

Re: Welcome finance - wfs advice 2015

Technically the SAR should reveal the agreement, but that's a request under the Data Protection Act. The CCA request is done through the Consumer Credit Act and therefore has much more significance legally if they don't comply fully or fail to send enforceable documents.

It's worth checking the contents of the SAR carefully and looking particularly at all the original agreement details as well as the statements.

[Berniethebolt]

Re: Welcome finance - wfs advice 2015

Technically the SAR should reveal the agreement, but that's a request under the Data Protection Act. The CCA request is done through the Consumer Credit Act and therefore has much more significance legally if they don't comply fully or fail to send enforceable documents.

It's worth checking the contents of the SAR carefully and looking particularly at all the original agreement details as well as the statements.

I agree with you Kafka however sadly that lot at the ICO are a bit 'Tim nice but dim" and don't quite get how a document with your name address and DOB is personal info

[Struggling26]

Re: Welcome finance - wfs advice 2015

Well I got the final response...

The £168 to cancel my first loan was a penalty charge ...which was nowhere to be seen on the credit agreement and considering it was carried over to the second loan at 15.8% Apr will likely have cost about £750. They said the £2161 it should have cost to terminate the loan after 6 months was just a estimated figure though that's the amount stated on the credit agreement which I signed...

The valuation or lack thereof on the equity in my house apparently had no bearing on their lending (surely that is the idea of a secured loan...having equity to secure against??!!) and any risk was theirs and not mine. Surely selling me a £17000 secured loan not relating to equity is mis-selling? I distinctly remember discussions at the time about the amount allowed and this being based on the equity believed to be in the house... I smell something funny...

They did not retain any paperwork in relation to the valuation of the house.

Neither did they retain information on my credit file for either loan though they SAY that checks would have been carried out they can't prove this or what checks did or didn't show...my bank statement showed payments to 2 debt management companies but welcome said a repayment plan doesn't indicate financial issues?! Ooohhhhh-kkaaayyyy

They did take into account my income and tax credits but not my mortgage, bills, childcare for a 2 year old or any other costs associated with being a single parent on a low income. My bank statement showed times were I only had £100 or even less during times of the month but they lent me a loan which would cost £271 a month...

There main argument is that it's over the 6 year limit which I'm worried about (any advice)...but looking on the fos it says or if longer, 3 years from the time you realised there was something to complain about ...or something like that. Any advice? I'mean kind of going with I've only just realised that there may be issues with welcomes lending practices and paperwork after seeing this online and only this year found out about affordability checks etc...?

- - - Updated - - -

six years from the event the consumer is complaining about (or - if later - three years from when the consumer knew, or could reasonably have known, they had cause to complain).

Fos

Also I'm saying that the loans are still running though the agreement was made 8 years ago so hopefully welcome are still liable to answer my complaints...

[dogtired]

Re: Welcome finance - wfs advice 2015

Did you do a SDAR? Welcome are notorious for incomplete and dodgy paper work. " lost" lots of files some years ago.
Lots of Beagles more knowledgeable than me but I think a "secured" loan is 12 years.
Ours is ongoing , not paid them for over six years and Welcome have admitted it is unenforceable as they cannot find an aggrement that did not stop them trying with two DCA and continuing to send meaningless statements and notices of arrears.
When I wrote to them at the start of this year all I got back was a letter asking us to phone them to establish our identity, as we are still getting the "statements" etc you would think they would know that!
Take care, be strong and know there are lots of people here to help you.

[Berniethebolt]

Re: Welcome finance - wfs advice 2015

I assume that if the Limitations Act is 12 years (which it is for a secured loan) they should have paperwork for 12 years

[FlamingParrot]

Re: Welcome finance - wfs advice 2015

I don't think limitation is the issue here as the OP is still paying the loan and they have received a copy of their agreement, the mention of limitation was to do with being in time to complain about mis-selling and/or irresponsible lending.

[Struggling26]

Re: Welcome finance - wfs advice 2015

Did you do a SDAR? Welcome are notorious for incomplete and dodgy paper work. " lost" lots of files some years ago.
Lots of Beagles more knowledgeable than me but I think a "secured" loan is 12 years.
Ours is ongoing , not paid them for over six years and Welcome have admitted it is unenforceable as they cannot find an aggrement that did not stop them trying with two DCA and continuing to send meaningless statements and notices of arrears.
When I wrote to them at the start of this year all I got back was a letter asking us to phone them to establish our identity, as we are still getting the "statements" etc you would think they would know that!
Take care, be strong and know there are lots of people here to help you.

Yes I got the SDAR but there are a few bits of information they made reference to in their final response as 'this information was not retained' including my credit reports and house valuation documentation to which the loan was against (they have said that the equity in the house was not used when setting the limit yet I fail to believe this when its a secured loan, the nature of which means you are borrowing against equity! - wondering if you can remember whether your secured loan was directly set against your equity or not?? - I'm sure I remember discussing this with them at the time but have no documentation).

I continue to pay as I don't want to see any negative impact to my credit file etc at the mo but I wrote to the FOS last night - just hoping they will look into the complaint as it's over six years.

They sent a one page credit agreement that was signed but someone on here pointed out a credit agreement for a £17,000 secured loan should likely be more in depth - so whether there are other bits of paperwork missing or that was it in full I don't know.

GOOD LUCK TO YOU TOO

[FlamingParrot]

Re: Welcome finance - wfs advice 2015

They sent a one page credit agreement that was signed but someone on here pointed out a credit agreement for a £17,000 secured loan should likely be more in depth - so whether there are other bits of paperwork missing or that was it in full I don't know.

Is there any chance you could post up a redacted copy of the document? :typing: