Owing money for someone else's pet - can we be forced to pay?

[ploddertom]

Re: Owing money for someone else's pet - can we be forced to pay?

I wouldn't even bother getting into tit for tat with the DCA - pardon the pun but they are like a Yorkie with false teeth - all bark and no bite.

[labman]

Re: Owing money for someone else's pet - can we be forced to pay?

Very true - what can they do in reality?

[labman]

Re: Owing money for someone else's pet - can we be forced to pay?

I received a pm from the OP with a draft letter regarding this issue and seeking my suggestions. I have amended the letter as marked in red, and separated it into two different ones, one for the DCA and one for the vet. The letters are below:

Letter to Vet:

Dear Mr Vet,

I was surprised recently to receive a letter from a Debt Collection Agency, presumably appointed by your practice, regarding outstanding monies due to you for the operation on Grace, the (insert breed) belonging to Mr and Mrs X.

I would point out that I have no knowledge of any such debt being owed by me to your practice, as the animal in question did not belong to me. I signed no consent form for the surgery on the animal from which this outstanding balance has arisen, nor have I received a single bill or piece of correspondence from you regarding the matter. In addition, I believe that you have previously pursued the owner of the animal for the outstanding balance which indicates that you are aware I am not liable for this debt.

I have written to the Debt Collection Agency direct asking that they either stop collection or prove the allegation that I owe these monies. I have also pointed out to them that they are in breach of Debt Collection Guidelines issued by the Office for Fair Trading by pursuing me for a debt for which I am not liable.

With regards to your conduct in this matter, I cannot understand why you would instruct a Debt Collection Agency to pursue me for a debt which you know is not mine. I am advised this could constitute a criminal offence and I will be making a formal complaint to the RCVS regarding your actions in this matter.

I would ask that you write to me within fourteen (14) days confirming that you have instructed the Debt Collection Agency to stop pursuing me for this debt. Failure to do so will result in the matter being reported to the police for an offence under the Fraud Act 2006 and to the local Trading Standards for investigation.
I await your written confirmation that this matter is now closed and look forward to your reply.

Yours sincerely,


Letter to DCA:

Dear Sir,

Your Ref: Account Number abc123

It has come to my attention that you have appointed CapQuest Debt Recovery Ltd to pursue me for monies outstanding on the above account which you claim is owed by myself.

I would point out that I have no knowledge of any such debt being owed by me to Newport Vets4Pets as the animal in question did not belong to me. I did not sign a consent form for the surgery on the animal from which this outstanding balance has arisen, neither have I received a single bill or piece of correspondence from you regarding the matter. In addition, I believe that you have previously pursued the owner of the animal for the outstanding balance which indicates that you are aware I am not liable for this debt.Did Capquest pursue them, or did the vet pursue them??????

I am familiar with the Office of Fair Trading Debt Collection Guidlines which state it is unfair to send demands for payment to an individual when it is uncertain that they are the debtor in question. I would also point out that the OFT say in their Guidance that it is unfair to pursue third parties for payment when they are not liable.

In not ceasing collection activity whilst investigating a reasonably queried or disputed debt you are using deceptive/and or unfair methods. Furthermore continuing to make unjustified demands for payment for a disputed debt amounts to physical/psychological harassment.

Whilst I appreciate fully this debt does not fall directly under the remit of the OFT, I have no doubt a court would assume a Debt Collection Agency such as yourselves would abide by the same principles while pursuing other alleged debts.

I would ask that no further contact be made concerning the above account unless you can provide evidence as to my liability for the debt in question.
I await your written confirmation that this matter is now closed. Otherwise I will have no option but to make a complaint to Trading Standards and consider informing the OFT of your actions.

I look forward to your reply within 14 days.

Yours sincerely,

I have pm'd the OP to say my reply is on this thread. Obviously any comments on the above are welcomed.

[Liv'n'Dai]

Re: Owing money for someone else's pet - can we be forced to pay?

Thanks for that Labman, it was the vet who pursued the owner. Not that we have any hard evidence of this but we spoke to him on the phone to confirm he had the correct email and phone numbers for her and emailed him with the parents address.

[labman]

Re: Owing money for someone else's pet - can we be forced to pay?

Obviously you'll need to delete that bit then - it was on your original, but I had a feeling it wasn't accurate. lol

[alham]

Re: Owing money for someone else's pet - can we be forced to pay?

Great response, labman. Liv'nDai, Verbal agreements, if any were made but obviously denied by you in any case, will need proving in court. It will be up to the creditor to prove that you underwrote or intended to underwrite the debt.

[Liv'n'Dai]

Re: Owing money for someone else's pet - can we be forced to pay?

Great response, labman. Liv'nDai, Verbal agreements, if any were made but obviously denied by you in any case, will need proving in court. It will be up to the creditor to prove that you underwrote or intended to underwrite the debt.

Yes, a great response and a great help to us.

We are just doing some digging into our calendars from the time around the operation. The first time we had any contact of any sort with the vet was on 29th December 2011 - this was around 8 days after the operation and around 15 days after the first aborted op (complications due to penicillin allergy apparently).

It's hard to have a verbal agreement (or any other sort) with someone you have never met, spoken to or had any other form of correspondence with...

[labman]

Re: Owing money for someone else's pet - can we be forced to pay?

Yep, that would be VERY clever indeed! :beagle:

[alham]

Re: Owing money for someone else's pet - can we be forced to pay?

Channeling... I feel a vet coming through...

[Liv'n'Dai]

Re: Owing money for someone else's pet - can we be forced to pay?

Both letters in the post... Fingers crossed!

[Liv'n'Dai]

Re: Owing money for someone else's pet - can we be forced to pay?

Ok, so tomorrow will be 14 days since we sent letters to the vet and the DCA and haven't heard a peep from either of them... Should we just keep quiet and hope it's blown over or follow up with another letter?

[Liv'n'Dai]

Re: Owing money for someone else's pet - can we be forced to pay?

... we really feel like writing another letter as -

1. We are still so offended by the vet's behaviour and are sorely tempted to follow through with our idea of reporting him to the RCVS
2. We want some confirmation from them that they have officially dropped the matter.

Also, we are worried about the potential negative effect on my partner's credit rating. If there is now a black mark against her name can we appeal this somehow?

Thanks in advance.

[labman]

Re: Owing money for someone else's pet - can we be forced to pay?

By all means report him to the RCVS, that might save other people going through what you have with this buffoon.

I wouldn't worry about having anything in writing - it will soon be obvious whether or not they've dropped it, again pardon the pun, but let sleeping dogs lie.

Has anything been reported to the Credit Reference Agencies - I don't see anything mentioned, and as there was no agreement with you for paying any monies, I can't believe they would even try. If they have, then post up, and I'll get someone who specialises in incorrect defaults to have a look at your thread.

[alham]

Re: Owing money for someone else's pet - can we be forced to pay?

L&D, I understand how you feel, but I would only report the vet to RCVS and forget about it. Your letter was a "put up or shut up" kind of letter, so short of taking you to court the other party is doing exactly what you've asked them to do.

[enquirer]

Re: Owing money for someone else's pet - can we be forced to pay?

You would have been asked to sign authorisation for the op to go ahead, when you dropped the dog off. this will be the contract between yourselves and the vet.

Or was the OP only acting as authorised agent of the owners? The vet actually knew of the arrangement between the owners and the OP and had also discussed the matter with them.