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Next move - all suggestions welcome

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  • Next move - all suggestions welcome

    Hello everyone - new to this forum but my Barclaycard problem has now celebrated it's first birthday.

    I'll try and keep it short - I don't want folks falling over comatose Beagles!

    Back in August 08 I realised my B/C had gone over it's limit - odd as I'd been paying over the min payment and hadn't used it for over 12 months - turns out to be PPI which I was sure I had cancelled the previous year - thus the saga begins:
    September 08 cancelled PPI again and requested CCA
    October - sent SAR - still being charged PPI so cancelled it again - received a set of T & C'S
    November put card in dispute - no CCA - still being charged PPI so cancelled it AGAIN -paid enough to clear over limit and following months interest. Received letter from B/C denying I'd cancelled PPI, a different set of T & C's and statements for 2003 and 2007-2008
    December - still being charged PPI so cancelled it once more - Placed account in serious dispute and told them December's would be the last payment until they complied with my CCA request. I sent CPR 31.16 request for SAR info and CCA
    January 09 -PPI still being taken cancelled it again - send LBA received yet another set of T & C's
    February gave up on cancelling PPI, requesting statements and CCA from SAR and issued a claim. Received data printouts from B/C for 2 accounts???????
    March - B/Card stopped sending statements maybe they got fed up with me cancelling PPI
    April - Finally received illegible microfiche copy of application form from 2003 and all statements from when account opened in 2003 to October 08.
    May - received letter 1 from B/C saying PPI was Miss-sold offering full refund + 8% interest - refused not enough interest. Letter 2 offering refund of charges +8% - offer refused not enough interest. DN from Mercer's for 2 x min payments as per statements and £70 to bring back to credit limit - asked them What statements? - and told them to go forth and multiply
    June - offer of further charges refund + 8% - refused not enough interest
    September - received letter from First Credit Management 7 - day demand of what appears to be full balance of account. - Told them to go join Mercers

    That's the background taken care of.

    The problem started when I had my card stolen in Feb 07 - I reported this to B/C and at the same time cancelled the PPI. - all logged on B/C's data printouts - seems then that B/C lost the plot.
    They should have sent a new card with a different number as they had done previously when cards were lost/stolen in the post but they didn't, they closed the account and transferred the balance to a new account which was set up using out of date info from the 2003 application form - hence 2 accounts - they then re-instated the PPI.
    From the info I have received it seems that in October 07 the account first went over the credit limit and and was still over when I discovered this in August 08. - Now I can appreciate you all saying what kind of an idiot doesn't look at her card statements for 12 months - well it's the kind of idiot that puts the card in a safe place and thinks I'll fire money at the debt to bring it down and if I don't know how much spare credit I've got I won't be tempted to go out and buy that rather nice but incredibly expensive pair of shoes -
    In December I checked my credit file with Experian to find B/C have been reporting the over limit status since Oct 07.
    I have been writing to B/Card since April 09 when I finally got all my info, asking them for a refund of all the unauthorised PPI payments the over credit limit charges and the contractual interest i.e. full restitution of everything they've taken from me with their unauthorised debits. I requested that they correct the entries on my credit file as the credit limit would never have been exceeded if they had cancelled the PPI on the initial instruction back in 07. I've also pointed out that they don't have a credit agreement for this account, just an illegible application form for the account opened in 2003 and closed by them in 2007- so please can they show me where I have agreed for them to share my Data for this account.
    In October they finally wrote to me confirming my old account had been "blocked" and "a new account number had been issued" - methinks that they think if they say it this way it's OK and the CCA doesn't apply! They reduced their offer of PPI forgetting they have already admitted it's been miss-sold, offered some more charges all +8% interest advising me this will reduce the balance of my account with FCM - eh? what account. They refused to amend my credit file.


    Still with me?

    Where do I go from here? - Ultimately I want them to remove the advers DATA from my credit file.
    Should I continue to chase full restitution for PPI and charges to reduce the balance of an account that has no credit agreement.
    Should I try the ICO FOS and OFT routes which I've left so far as they take so long. I assume I would have to get OFT to agree there is no agreement before ICO agreed that they're processing my DATA unlawfully.
    OR
    Should I go down the Court route ? Can I have a non-existant credit agreement declared unenforceable (S127?) and what are the chances of the court enforcing B/C to remove their information from my credit file?

    When I checked in October 08 B/C have registered 6+ missed payments on my file and there's 1 unrecorded search in May. - Theirs is the only blot on a good credit file - I was refused credit back in March 09 because of it.
    I spoke to a solicitor about this - but when they told me their fees I figured their offices must be in Cloud Cuckooland next door to Barclaycard.

    If you haven't glazed over by now I'd appreciate a few suggestions.

    cheers
    Dizzy

  • #2
    Re: Next move - all suggestions welcome

    Hi Dizzy

    Thanks for keeping that so concise Sounds like you have had a right palava with Barclaycard. I can completely understand not looking at statements to avoid temptation, have done the same myself in the past. I think next time you'd just cut up the card and keep a very close eye on the statements.

    So you have a few issues

    1) the PPI missold - Barclaycard have accepted this and offered to refund the PPI and added 8% PA interest to the premiums to be refunded.

    2) Barclaycards refusal/neglect in not cancelling the PPI when asked numerous occassions ( has this had any detrimental affect in reality on balance/minimum payments etc leading to the marks on credit file ?)

    3) Late payment charges ?

    4) Unenforceable credit agreement



    Regarding your question
    Can I have a non-existant credit agreement declared unenforceable (S127?) and what are the chances of the court enforcing B/C to remove their information from my credit file?


    Whats the balance on the card now - ie is it worth a declaration to wipe remaining balance or does PPI/charges refund cover it ?

    I think the chances of the court forcing BC to remove markers on credit file on grounds of unenforceability is very minimal ref a recent High Court test case on a very similar issue.

    Ame
    xx
    #staysafestayhome

    Any support I provide is offered without liability, if you are unsure please seek professional legal guidance.

    Received a Court Claim? Read >>>>> First Steps

    Comment


    • #3
      Re: Next move - all suggestions welcome

      Hi Amythest thanks for taking time out -

      Okay..............Balance on the card? good question -the only way I've been able to track it is through Experian - LOL! The demand in September by FCM was £2111.00 Since February 09 sharkley have been playing ducks and drakes with the account as the balance went up and down on the Experian file. I couldn't make head nor tail of their charges refund offers and when I asked for a statement they sent back my own excel spreadsheet detailing my claim with compound interest calculations!

      Based on February 09 claim Balance 2165.00 total PPI, charges & compound interest claim was £1307.37 as at 22/02/09 re-calculation as at today = 1531.27 . So no it wouldn't clear the debt completely - either 500 or 800 remaining so it would be worth getting it made unenforceable. But I would have to do another SAR to find out exactly what they've done since last February - (I smell another non-compliance case coming on)

      I have read somewhere about a High Court case - but in that case wasn't the person trying to get removal of a Default Notice on his CRA that had been put on whilst the account was in dispute awaiting a copy of the CCA - and the creditor manged to produce an enforceable agreement and scuppered his case? or is there another one I've missed?

      B/C haven't put a default on my credit file just over limit markers for 18months and missed payment markers since January- they haven't issued a DN for the full amount or advised officially they have terminated the agreement. In fact the only semi-serious attempt they have made is the letter from FCM- I told FCM to remind their "client" it was against DPA to share incorrect data with 3rd parties, and it would be a good idea to check they had conformed with the 1st Principle of the DPA before threatening me with Court proceedings. They must be still chewing that over as I haven't heard from them since.

      I keep throwing Section 85 - new credit token other than first etc.etc - at B/C. It's taken me 12 months to get them to admit they've closed the original account - "blocked" they call it - "issued a new account number" is the other phrase - but let's face it to issue a new account number they have to open a new account - for which, according to section 85 of the CCA 1974(???) they need a new agreement. (-Bursts into a rendition of "there's a hole in my bucket dear Liza"- )

      I don't think for a minute B/C will take me to court on this - if they did it would be simple I could counter claim for the whole kit and caboodle and claim sanctuary under S127 - But how the heck do I start a claim myself? To put all the twaddle about PPI and charges in there would be most confusing - and if I lost I could get lumbered and end up having to pay the full amount + costs!

      There I talked myself into going to court and out of it again -

      Cheers

      Dizzie

      Comment


      • #4
        Re: Next move - all suggestions welcome

        I have read somewhere about a High Court case - but in that case wasn't the person trying to get removal of a Default Notice on his CRA that had been put on whilst the account was in dispute awaiting a copy of the CCA - and the creditor manged to produce an enforceable agreement and scuppered his case? or is there another one I've missed?
        Yep but as you can imagine its being used persusively that CRA reporting isn't enforcement so is okay to carry on attacking the credit files.

        500 or 800 remaining so it would be worth getting it made unenforceable
        not really IMO - it will cost you near that to employ a solicitor and the risk of costs, as you know so I dont think you should go that route.


        So we're back to PPI & unfair charges

        I have been writing to B/Card since April 09 when I finally got all my info, asking them for a refund of all the unauthorised PPI payments the over credit limit charges and the contractual interest i.e. full restitution of everything they've taken from me with their unauthorised debits. I requested that they correct the entries on my credit file as the credit limit would never have been exceeded if they had cancelled the PPI on the initial instruction back in 07. I've also pointed out that they don't have a credit agreement for this account, just an illegible application form for the account opened in 2003 and closed by them in 2007- so please can they show me where I have agreed for them to share my Data for this account.
        I'd carry on with that route tbh, if they hadnt already offered a refund of all PPI, and if it didnt have any other adverse affect on you (eg increasing the minimum payment due making you unable to pay thus getting the marker on your file) then i'd have say use that and FOS to get markers removed.

        So really you are looking at court for proper restitution of the PPI and unfair charges. FOS wont get you much more back than premiums plus stat 8%

        But that doesnt help the credit file, as, when it comes down to it, you missed/late paid on 6 payments? and unless you can convince BC thats down to them and can show it is, and can show its effected you adversley on your credit file, then I dont think that will go very far.

        I also don't think this 'second agreement' argument has much weight behind it.

        So depends really which you value most, the £800 outstanding on the account after the PPI is refunded, or your credit file.

        You could just not pay any more and tell them to come take you to court and defend on all the points you have raised. But that screws ur credit file even further.

        Or repay the £800 and keep hassling/court action for the PPI/charges
        #staysafestayhome

        Any support I provide is offered without liability, if you are unsure please seek professional legal guidance.

        Received a Court Claim? Read >>>>> First Steps

        Comment


        • #5
          Re: Next move - all suggestions welcome

          Thanks again for coming back

          When I started out on this what I wanted was a refund of my PPI & Charges and the interest they had screwed me for. I wanted to transfer the balance left together with my other credit card to a 0% card and pay the whole lot off in 12 months. Retirement being just round the corner I didn't want to have to keep working to fund the CC companies. I was naive enough to think that Barclays would say "sorry our mistake" and put right the wrongs and we could all go our merry way. As it happened the damage was already done and I was refused credit - a real sickener when you consider that I paid B/C every month well over the minimum payment - just not enough to cover the s*dding cancelled PPI.

          I did put together a lengthy letter to B/C in response to their last letter - but have now scrapped it. I guess that my next course of action will be to work from the last statement they sent me - calculate the PPI charges & compound interest to that date! and send them a Without Predjudice offer of 10% (a good place to start and gives me room to negotiate) of the balance in F & F settlement on condition they remove the data from the CRA's and see where that gets me. If they don't accept or come back with a reasonable offer I shall tell them to take me to court - if the "second agreement" tactic doesn't hold water then the illegible application form with the dodgey T & C's should give them food for thought.
          As an aside: The DJ at my non-compliance hearing did point out to B/C's Council that the form was illegible and it's enforceability could be challenged - but he pointed out that the hearing wasn't about challenging enforceability of the agreement it was in respect of the DPA request, that should I wish to challenge the agreement that would be subject of a further hearing. So with that little nugget up my sleeve - and as I'm not really desperate to buy anything else on the never never - I'll make my offer and tell them to bog off if they don't like it

          Thanks for your time Amy - it's been a great help - I've had chance to throw all my options on the table - you've had a good rummage around in them for me and I now have got it all back into perspective.

          All the best

          Dizzie

          Comment


          • #6
            Re: Next move - all suggestions welcome

            Its okay, when you get to these positions there are a lot of options and it helps to ramble through them and even just putting it all down in writing helps get it straight in your head. And you know what you are doing and have got this far just come to that annoying point where nothings happening and do you take action or wait for something to happen.

            I dont have the answers, as you have noticed, but happy to discuss the different options you have.

            As it happened the damage was already done and I was refused credit - a real sickener when you consider that I paid B/C every month well over the minimum payment - just not enough to cover the s*dding cancelled PPI.
            Is excellent and proveable that the PPI was the cause of the credit markers and as they accepted that was missold then they should with a shove correct the markers as they should never have been there.
            #staysafestayhome

            Any support I provide is offered without liability, if you are unsure please seek professional legal guidance.

            Received a Court Claim? Read >>>>> First Steps

            Comment


            • #7
              Re: Next move - all suggestions welcome

              Originally posted by Amethyst View Post
              Is excellent and proveable that the PPI was the cause of the credit markers and as they accepted that was missold then they should with a shove correct the markers as they should never have been there.
              I've been telling them that all along but they won't budge - they say it was up to me "manage my account" so it didn't breach the limit! In other words It didn't matter that you cancelled the PPI - we charged it and you had to pay it to stop us duffing up your credit file - when I realised they hadn't cancelled I wrote in September 08 cancelling again, October, In November they denied I'd cancelled - in writing no less - so I kept on cancelling every month till January when I asked them to provide me with a copy of the revised terms and conditions of the PPI where it said I couldn't cancel what they had by then started to call their "Optional Payment Protection". They ignored every single letter!
              They repeated the "managing your account" statement in their last letter - fraid it set me gnashing my teeth again!

              Cheers

              Dizzie

              Comment


              • #8
                Re: Next move - all suggestions welcome

                Another point to consider, with regards to your credit file, is that if you bought your payments up to date and/or paid off the balance it would show as satisfied., which would then hopefully negate the adverse stuff? This would be betterthan waiting for them to put a DN on your file. Although once that was shown as satisfied it would probably be disregarded anyway. You could also put a notice on your file which should be read by prospective lenders?
                Is no longer here

                Comment


                • #9
                  Re: Next move - all suggestions welcome

                  Hi Wendy

                  More input - thanks - your comments are noted and duly filed
                  cheers
                  dizzie

                  Comment

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