Bailiff

[EDBEATTIE]

Bailiff visited with the police and distress warrant although the fine was paid direct to the court last year.
i said fees are not part of the warrant, they said they are,
warrant had no court stamp/mark and although i asked to see the proper warrant they said they did not have to show it and the police agreed with them,
they then got someone to phone me from the court who confirmed they were giving them power to break in and the police said they would arrest me for breach of the peace if i obstructed them.
I am sure this is all wrong but decided to pay as i could see a situation arising that would have not finished in my favour.
I didn't realise the police worked alongside the bailiff and mistakenly thought that the law could also apply to others as well as me, seems Bailiffs are cleverer than everyone else and can write their own rules, as every bit of research i did, said bailiffs fees are not part of the distress warrant and bailiffs could not break into a property, does anyone know any different that might work in the real world not just on paper

[bluebottle]

Re: Bailiff

Hi and welcome to Legal Beagles.

A few questions -

1. Did you pay the fine, in full, to the court, within the time they allowed?
2. Did you miss any payments at all?
3. If you did miss any payments, did you receive a reminder, followed by a Further Steps Notice?
4. Have you, at any time, received any correspondence from any of the following bailiff companies - Marston Group, Swift, Collectica or Excel?
5. Did the person who allegedly rang from the court give their name and the name of the court they were calling from?
6. Which bailiff company was involved?
7. Which police force was involved?

What you have outlined does not appear to conform to HMCTS procedures.

[EDBEATTIE]

Re: Bailiff

Hi,

Thanks for taking the time to read my post,

I did miss some payments and admittedly only paid after receiving the reminders from the court enforcement authority and subsequently the bailiff demand for £85 costs.

The person said they were the court manager but did not give their name.

My concern is that they continued to visit and execute a warrant following full payment of the court fine when their costs were still £85.
As far as i have been told their fees do not form part of the distress warrant, a warrant i have never seen apart from the one they fabricate.
This appears to be a blatant effort to inflate their costs and a sad state of affairs that they can continue these practices unchecked.
I have been told via another site that this is illegal and fraudulent

[bluebottle]

Re: Bailiff

Hi,

Thanks for taking the time to read my post,

I did miss some payments and admittedly only paid after receiving the reminders from the court enforcement authority and subsequently the bailiff demand for £85 costs.

The person said they were the court manager but did not give their name.

My concern is that they continued to visit and execute a warrant following full payment of the court fine when their costs were still £85.
As far as i have been told their fees do not form part of the distress warrant, a warrant i have never seen apart from the one they fabricate.
This appears to be a blatant effort to inflate their costs and a sad state of affairs that they can continue these practices unchecked.
I have been told via another site that this is illegal and fraudulent

Which website was that?

If the outstanding fine and £85 fee were paid in full to HMCTS when you received the letter from the bailiff company, the Distress Warrant should have been cancelled at that point. Two companies notorious for what you have highlighted are Marstons and Collectica.

If you could answer all the questions I have asked above, it would help me to advise you accordingly. There is a possibility you may need to complain to HMCTS senior management.

[EDBEATTIE]

Re: Bailiff

The demand said you owe £145, then £85 costs
I paid £145 directly to the court but not the £85
It was Marstons
The Police was kent

I checked with another site called dealing with bailiffs

I

[bluebottle]

Re: Bailiff

The demand said you owe £145, then £85 costs
I paid £145 directly to the court but not the £85 Once the letter is sent to you, the £85 is payable as well. Rule 52.8, Criminal Procedures Rules 2011 refer.
It was Marstons No surprise there.
The Police was Kent No surprise there either.

I checked with another site called dealing with bailiffs. That does not surprise me in the least. The advice you were given was legally inaccurate. You have been caused the hassle you suffered because of bad advice.

I

@@@@

[CleverClogs]

Re: Bailiff

I checked with another site called dealing with bailiffs

Are you now going to sue them for the extra £215 you had to pay?

[bizzybob]

Re: Bailiff

Are you now going to sue them for the extra £215 you had to pay?

If it is dizzy entrails, send the bailiffs

[Amethyst]

Re: Bailiff

Just for reference

Rule 52(8) of the Criminal Procedure Rules 2013 (

• http://www.justice.gov.uk/courts/pro...13-part-52.pdf
  
  Part 52 Enforcement of fines and other orders for payment

52.8.—
(5)
The warrant no longer has effect if—
(a)there is paid to the person executing it the sum for which it was issued and any extra sum payable in connection with its execution;
(b) those sums are offered to, but refused by, that person; or
(c)that person—
(i)is shown a receipt given under rule 52.3 for the sum for which the warrant was issued, and
(ii) is paid any extra sum payable in connection with its execution.

------------------------------------


(2) Rules 52.7 to 52.9 apply where the court, or a fines officer, issues a warrant that requires someone to—
(a)take control of goods or money belonging to the defendant;
(b)remove and sell any such goods; and
(c)pay any such money, and any proceeds of such a sale, to the court officer towards payment of a sum to which this Part applies.

[EDBEATTIE]

Re: Bailiff

Thanks,
My point is that once the original £145 fine is paid even if the £85 is payable there is an effort to increase the costs with additional visits, i think the warrants are misused to make the additional charges.
Are the charges specified in the warrant, as, i have never seen a copy of the proper warrant, only a doctored version with the charges added.

[bluebottle]

Re: Bailiff

The charges - £85.00 Administration Fee and £215.00 Enforcement Fee - are applied -

a. On sending the letter advising a fine defaulter a Distress Warrant has been issued, the £85.00 is payable. If the fine and £85.00 are then paid, no further fees are due;
b. If the fine and Administration Fee are not paid and the enforcement agent has to attend, then the £215.00 Enforcement Fee is payable also.

What contracted bailiff companies are not permitted to do is -

i. Charge both fees simultaneously when not justified, i.e. charge for work not done; and
ii. Make unnecessary and/or unjustifiable attendances in order to justify or garner fees.

If you feel genuinely aggrieved, you should complain, in the first instance, to -

Correspondence, Complaints and Litigation Unit
H.M. Courts and Tribunals Service
102 Petty France
London
SW1H 9AJ

I would suggest you ask the owner of the website you alluded to in an earlier post to reimburse you with the £215 you had to pay. And, yes, BB, I think it is Happy Entrails, now you come to mention it.

[TopBoy]

Re: Bailiff

Thanks,
My point is that once the original £145 fine is paid even if the £85 is payable there is an effort to increase the costs with additional visits, i think the warrants are misused to make the additional charges.
Are the charges specified in the warrant, as, i have never seen a copy of the proper warrant, only a doctored version with the charges added.

Unfortunately, as you have stated you received yhe letter with the £85 added, and paid the amount minus the fees, they are entitled to visit for the fee - if they visit they are entitled to charge for the visit. The relevant legislation is posted for your perusal.

The warrant will not have the fee's on - how could it, as the court would have no way of knowing at what stage you would pay, therefore would not know what fees to add.

It seems that the bad advice from "the site that shall not be mentioned" has cost you a couple of hundred quid!

[CleverClogs]

Re: Bailiff

It seems that the bad advice from "the site that shall not be mentioned" has cost you a couple of hundred quid!

What else would one expect from Entrails, other than shït?

[Amethyst]

Re: Bailiff

If the assistance/help was received on an informal basis (as advice/support on here is) then the OP would have no claim, as anything should be backed up with your own research and/or formal advice from a legal professional. Only if it was received in a professional capacity (eg. He paid for specific advice given with guarantees/accepting liability ) would there be any redress. I know feelings can run high about other sites but let's keep the thread free of insults and concentrate on assisting the OP with their issue. Thanks and sorry to sound like a pain in the bum.

[EDBEATTIE]

Re: Bailiff

Hi,
I find that a little confusing,as the bailiff was holding what he said to me and the police was a distress warrant with the £300 added,
Does this mean he altered the warrant (that would be like me giving you a bill for a sum and you altering it ,then passing it to a customer)or, that it wasn't a proper distress warrant, and if not,why is he saying it is.
Surely, it's normal to show at least a copy of the original document upon which a charge is based on prior to collecting the fee's.
Maybe i don't have adequate understanding of these issues as this is not my profession but i think it is a valid question.