Issue with JBW Baliff

[bluebottle]

Re: Issue with JBW Baliff

@blue bottlle , below are the amounts
19/03/2011. Amount of charge £180. Court fee £7. total £187. (original PCN £60 if paid within 14 days)
04/06/2011 - Amount of Charge £195. Court fee £7. Total £202 (original PCN £65 if paid within 14 days)
17/02/2012 - Amount of Charge £195. Court fee £7. Total £202 (original PCN £65 if paid within 14 days)
24/02/2012 - Amount of Charge £195. Court fee £7. Total £202 (original PCN £65 if paid within 14 days)
At order for recovery stage fine goes up by another 50% Can they do this?
With regards to JBW, First letter i received mentioned just one fine, second letter mentioned all four fines and so did the 3rd letter they sent.

@Galahad. All four fines were at the Order for recovery stage. TE3/TE9 form received through the post. TE9 forms filled up on line and emailed to the email address printed on the TE3 form which was customerservice.tec@hmcourts-service.gsi.gov.uk. I remember having a conversation with a lady at TEC when I called up after I got bailiff letter, she said that they have been told numerous times to change the email address. Didn't know who she meant at the time and i did not write her name down at the time. Question is how can I prove that Hackney deliberately put the wrong email address on the TE3 form?

Thanks again for the help so far

Could you please enlighten us as to how a PCN fine trebles? The original fines should be no more than £90 and £97.50, respectively, when uplifted by 50%. You need to ask LB of Hackney to quote the legislation they are relying on to treble PCN fines. Or is it JBW doing that? As for the email address, that address is out-of-date.

[thfc01]

Re: Issue with JBW Baliff

Bluebottle I have no idea, I am just reading the charges from the TE3 form. Also the charges appear on their website. http://www.hackney.gov.uk/pcn-stages.htm. So it looks like it is Hackney themselves who treble the charge. I have already written to the parking attendant at Hackney to complain about JBW and they have so far ignored my letter. The email address I quoted was the one printed out on the TE3 form sent to me. At the time I did not know it was wrong.

[bluebottle]

Re: Issue with JBW Baliff

Bluebottle I have no idea, I am just reading the charges from the TE3 form. Also the charges appear on their website. http://www.hackney.gov.uk/pcn-stages.htm. So it looks like it is Hackney themselves who treble the charge. I have already written to the parking attendant at Hackney to complain about JBW and they have so far ignored my letter. The email address I quoted was the one printed out on the TE3 form sent to me. At the time I did not know it was wrong.

I think you may have misread the table. The only additional fee would be the court fee of £7.00. Unless there was legislation allowing it, no local authority would be permitted to increase a fine to three times its original amount. The actual fines, in you cases, would be £97.00 and £104.50, respectively, which includes the 50% uplift on the charge stage and £7.00 court fee. The only other fees that could be added after that would be legitimate bailiff fees Now we're getting somewhere.

So, the fines, including the 50% uplift and court fee, are as follows -

19/03/11 = £97.00
04/06/11 = £104.50
17/02/12 = £104.50
24/02/12 = £104.50
TOTAL = £410.50

What we now need to know is how many letters JBW sent to you regarding these fines and on what dates, please?

[thfc01]

Re: Issue with JBW Baliff

20/06/12 notice of attendance. balance £200.44, Attendance to levy £66.60, total due £267.04
29/06/12 notice of attendance (This is when i called the TEC and done the OOH statement and was advised all four fines on hold) Balance £697.92, attendance to levy £200.89, balance now due £904.81
Around a week later i received a 3rd letter dated 29/06/12 which was Notice of removal. I phoned up and asked why are they still sending me letters when cases have been put on hold and i was told cases were put on hold on Friday afternoon and that the letter was posted Friday morning. Listed on the notice to removal were four amounts with their own reference number next to it. £337.78, £283.52, £283.52 and £215.44. Total amount due £1120.26

Do I need to include the new ones I just started receiving in October as well?

[bluebottle]

Re: Issue with JBW Baliff

20/06/12 notice of attendance. balance £200.44, Attendance to levy £66.60, total due £267.04
29/06/12 notice of attendance (This is when i called the TEC and done the OOH statement and was advised all four fines on hold) Balance £697.92, attendance to levy £200.89, balance now due £904.81
Around a week later i received a 3rd letter dated 29/06/12 which was Notice of removal. I phoned up and asked why are they still sending me letters when cases have been put on hold and i was told cases were put on hold on Friday afternoon and that the letter was posted Friday morning. Listed on the notice to removal were four amounts with their own reference number next to it. £337.78, £283.52, £283.52 and £215.44. Total amount due £1120.26

Do I need to include the new ones I just started receiving in October as well?

The fees certificated bailiff companies enforcing PCNs can legitimately charge are regulated by the Enforcement of Road Traffic Debts (Certificated Bailiffs) Regulations 1993-2003. The other piece of legislation certificated bailiffs have to comply with is the Distress for Rent Rules 1988. Any fees that do not comply with the Enforcement of Road Traffic Debts (Certificated Bailiffs) 1993-2003 are unlawful and unenforceable.

I'm going to send you a PM. This is simply to clarify the dates you received documents and from which I can calculate what fees are legitimately due. I am of the opinion JBW have charged fees that are not in accordance with the law.

[bluebottle]

Re: Issue with JBW Baliff

Okay, folks. It would appear that JBW has potentially overcharged the OP to the tune of at least £558.82. They are now trying to extract a further £355 from the OP, who has sent a Breakdown of Fees letter to JBW and a letter to LB of Hackney. Responses are awaited to both letters. Comments, anyone?

[wiccaqueen]

Re: Issue with JBW Baliff

did JBW have a warrant of execution to enforce these PCN a warrant of execution is only valid for 12 months

19/03/2011. Amount of charge £180. Court fee £7. total £187. (original PCN £60 if paid within 14 days)
04/06/2011 - Amount of Charge £195. Court fee £7. Total £202 (original PCN £65 if paid within 14 days)

http://www.justice.gov.uk/courts/pro...art75#IDAGQ0HC

PART 75 - TRAFFIC ENFORCEMENT
Warrant of execution

75.7

(1) An authority seeking the issue of a warrant of execution must file a request –
(a) certifying the amount remaining due under the order;

(b) specifying the date of service of the order on the respondent; and

(c) certifying that the relevant period has elapsed.


(2) The court will seal the request and return it to the authority.

(3) Within 7 days of the sealing of the request the authority must prepare the warrant in the appropriate form.

(4) No payment under a warrant will be made to the court.

(5) For the purposes of execution a warrant will be valid for 12 months beginning with the date of its issue.

(6) An authority may not renew a warrant issued in accordance with this Part beyond the 12 month validity period but, subject to paragraph (7), an authority may request the reissue of a warrant during the 12 month validity period.

(7) Where the address of the respondent has changed since the issue of the warrant, the authority may request the reissue of the warrant by filing a request –
(a) specifying the new address of the respondent;

(b) providing evidence that the new address for the respondent does relate to the respondent named in the order and against whom enforcement is sought; and

(c) certifying that the amount due under the order remains unpaid.


(8) Where the court is satisfied that the new address of the respondent given in the request for the reissue of the warrant relates to the respondent named in the order, it will seal the request and return it to the authority.

(9) The authority must prepare the reissued warrant in the appropriate form within 7 days of the sealing of the request to reissue.

(10) A reissued warrant will only be valid for the remainder of the 12 month period beginning with the date it was originally issued.

[bluebottle]

Re: Issue with JBW Baliff

did JBW have a warrant of execution to enforce these PCN a warrant of execution is only valid for 12 months

19/03/2011. Amount of charge £180. Court fee £7. total £187. (original PCN £60 if paid within 14 days)
04/06/2011 - Amount of Charge £195. Court fee £7. Total £202 (original PCN £65 if paid within 14 days)

http://www.justice.gov.uk/courts/pro...art75#IDAGQ0HC

PART 75 - TRAFFIC ENFORCEMENT
Warrant of execution

75.7

(1) An authority seeking the issue of a warrant of execution must file a request –
(a) certifying the amount remaining due under the order;

(b) specifying the date of service of the order on the respondent; and

(c) certifying that the relevant period has elapsed.


(2) The court will seal the request and return it to the authority.

(3) Within 7 days of the sealing of the request the authority must prepare the warrant in the appropriate form.

(4) No payment under a warrant will be made to the court.

(5) For the purposes of execution a warrant will be valid for 12 months beginning with the date of its issue.

(6) An authority may not renew a warrant issued in accordance with this Part beyond the 12 month validity period but, subject to paragraph (7), an authority may request the reissue of a warrant during the 12 month validity period.

(7) Where the address of the respondent has changed since the issue of the warrant, the authority may request the reissue of the warrant by filing a request –
(a) specifying the new address of the respondent;

(b) providing evidence that the new address for the respondent does relate to the respondent named in the order and against whom enforcement is sought; and

(c) certifying that the amount due under the order remains unpaid.


(8) Where the court is satisfied that the new address of the respondent given in the request for the reissue of the warrant relates to the respondent named in the order, it will seal the request and return it to the authority.

(9) The authority must prepare the reissued warrant in the appropriate form within 7 days of the sealing of the request to reissue.

(10) A reissued warrant will only be valid for the remainder of the 12 month period beginning with the date it was originally issued.

The charges are excessive and PCN amounts are incorrect WiccaQueen. JBW have seriously ripped-off the OP and are still trying to milk him for money he does not owe. I have been through the matter with the OP and it is clear as day that JBW owe the OP at least £558.82. He has already paid them what is lawfully due.

Next step is to send a formal letter to LB of Hackney requesting details of PCNs and dates, then seeing what JBW have to say for themselves as regard a breakdown of fees. My gut-feeling is that the matter of JBW's charges may end up before a County Court Registrar for formal scrutiny or JBW and their bailiffs may end up before a Judge.

[thfc01]

Re: Issue with JBW Baliff

Blue bottle thanks for taking the time to help me. I really appreciate your help. I sent a letter to the parking attendant at Hackney on 9th October to complain about JBW's conduct and how I felt the fees were excessive and not legal. Also reminded Hackney council that they are liable for any unlawful fees that JBW charge. Letter was sent recorded deliver, I checked online with Royal mail and it was signed for on the 12th October. So far no response from Hackney council
Letter I sent on Friday 26/10/12 to JBW demanding full breakdown of their fees was received and signed for today

[bluebottle]

Re: Issue with JBW Baliff

Blue bottle thanks for taking the time to help me. I really appreciate your help. I sent a letter to the parking attendant at Hackney on 9th October to complain about JBW's conduct and how I felt the fees were excessive and not legal. Also reminded Hackney council that they are liable for any unlawful fees that JBW charge. Letter was sent recorded deliver, I checked online with Royal mail and it was signed for on the 12th October. So far no response from Hackney council
Letter I sent on Friday 26/10/12 to JBW demanding full breakdown of their fees was received and signed for today

Give LB of Hackney until 31/10/12 or 01/11/12 before prodding them and JBW until 12/11/12 before prodding them. In the meantime, do not make any further payments to JBW and if they do turn up demanding money, inform them the matter is disputed and you have discovered they have taken at least £558.82 more than is lawfully due. Ask the bailiff(s) for their full name(s), name(s) of the court that issued their certificate(s) and the issue and expiry dates. Better still, ask to see their certificate(s) and note the details down with a pad and pen in their presence.

[thfc01]

Re: Issue with JBW Baliff

update : No response received from Hackney council
Letter received today from JBW dated 24/10/12 in response to the first letter I sent to them on the 09/10/12. I Don't have a scanner so I will have to type out their response. (name of agent,baliff and reference numbers removed)

Thank you for your recent letter in respect if the above penalty charge. JBW held four out standing PCN's for you, the references are as follows, I have also included the balance at the time of your phone call with .....in the call centre.
ref a) 337.78. Ref b) 285.52. Ref c £283.52. Ref d) £215.44. Total £1120.26
On august 20th 2012 you paid a total of £700.00 and a processing charge of £0.60, this closed cases reference a and reference b. It also took £78.70 from reference c which left a balance on this case of £204.82. The hold was taken off this case on 21st August 2012 via our client and they instructed us to continue enforcement on reference c. Our bailiff <name removed> attended on 28th August 2012 to enforce full payment on this case, at the time of his attendance your were charged a levy fee of £53.54 + £10.71 vat and an ATR fee of £175.00 + £35.00 VAT. On August 28th 2012 case reference C was closed as paid in full, please note at this time case reference D remained on hold at our clients request and therefore explains why the bailiff was unable to obtain this information as when a case is on hold it does not show up on the bailiffs PDA. The case came off hold on 2nd October 2012 at our clients request and our bailiff attended on 5th october and 11th October leaving an outstanding balance pf £355.34. All fees have been applied correctly in accordance with the Enforcement of Road traffic Debts (certified baliffs) regulations 1993. In order for us to discuss a payment proposal please telephone our contact center on 0844 576 3620. We have placed this account on hold for 7 days to accomodate you.








Just to add when my vehicle was clamped it was not at my home address, also the bailiff in question told me all fines were now paid. Please advise what my next step should be

[Hayley08]

Re: Issue with JBW Baliff

I have a bayliff letter from Bristow and sutor demanding money I just don't have I've offered to pay less but they won't except it what do they expect me to do I have 2 young children to look after and rent and other bills to pay any advice would be great

[ploddertom]

Re: Issue with JBW Baliff

I have a bayliff letter from Bristow and sutor demanding money I just don't have I've offered to pay less but they won't except it what do they expect me to do I have 2 young children to look after and rent and other bills to pay any advice would be great

Can I suggest you start your own thread and explain what it is all about http://www.legalbeagles.info/forums/...newthread&f=76

[bluebottle]

Re: Issue with JBW Baliff

update : No response received from Hackney council
Letter received today from JBW dated 24/10/12 in response to the first letter I sent to them on the 09/10/12. I Don't have a scanner so I will have to type out their response. (name of agent,baliff and reference numbers removed)

Thank you for your recent letter in respect if the above penalty charge. JBW held four out standing PCN's for you, the references are as follows, I have also included the balance at the time of your phone call with .....in the call centre.
ref a) 337.78. Ref b) 285.52. Ref c £283.52. Ref d) £215.44. Total £1120.26
On august 20th 2012 you paid a total of £700.00 and a processing charge of £0.60, this closed cases reference a and reference b. It also took £78.70 from reference c which left a balance on this case of £204.82. The hold was taken off this case on 21st August 2012 via our client and they instructed us to continue enforcement on reference c. Our bailiff <name removed> attended on 28th August 2012 to enforce full payment on this case, at the time of his attendance your were charged a levy fee of £53.54 + £10.71 vat and an ATR fee of £175.00 + £35.00 VAT. On August 28th 2012 case reference C was closed as paid in full, please note at this time case reference D remained on hold at our clients request and therefore explains why the bailiff was unable to obtain this information as when a case is on hold it does not show up on the bailiffs PDA. The case came off hold on 2nd October 2012 at our clients request and our bailiff attended on 5th october and 11th October leaving an outstanding balance pf £355.34. All fees have been applied correctly in accordance with the Enforcement of Road traffic Debts (certified baliffs) regulations 1993. In order for us to discuss a payment proposal please telephone our contact center on 0844 576 3620. We have placed this account on hold for 7 days to accomodate you.








Just to add when my vehicle was clamped it was not at my home address, also the bailiff in question told me all fines were now paid. Please advise what my next step should be

Contrary to what JBW claim, their fees are not only excessive, but some of them are illegal. I will ask another LB member for a second opinion, but I feel the answer will be the same as what I have given.

[ploddertom]

Re: Issue with JBW Baliff

update : No response received from Hackney council
Letter received today from JBW dated 24/10/12 in response to the first letter I sent to them on the 09/10/12. I Don't have a scanner so I will have to type out their response. (name of agent,baliff and reference numbers removed)

Thank you for your recent letter in respect if the above penalty charge. JBW held four out standing PCN's for you, the references are as follows, I have also included the balance at the time of your phone call with .....in the call centre.
ref a) 337.78. Ref b) 285.52. Ref c £283.52. Ref d) £215.44. Total £1120.26
On august 20th 2012 you paid a total of £700.00 and a processing charge of £0.60, this closed cases reference a and reference b. It also took £78.70 from reference c which left a balance on this case of £204.82. The hold was taken off this case on 21st August 2012 via our client and they instructed us to continue enforcement on reference c. Our bailiff <name removed> attended on 28th August 2012 to enforce full payment on this case, at the time of his attendance your were charged a levy fee of £53.54 + £10.71 vat and an ATR fee of £175.00 + £35.00 VAT. On August 28th 2012 case reference C was closed as paid in full, please note at this time case reference D remained on hold at our clients request and therefore explains why the bailiff was unable to obtain this information as when a case is on hold it does not show up on the bailiffs PDA. The case came off hold on 2nd October 2012 at our clients request and our bailiff attended on 5th october and 11th October leaving an outstanding balance pf £355.34. All fees have been applied correctly in accordance with the Enforcement of Road traffic Debts (certified baliffs) regulations 1993. In order for us to discuss a payment proposal please telephone our contact center on 0844 576 3620. We have placed this account on hold for 7 days to accomodate you.








Just to add when my vehicle was clamped it was not at my home address, also the bailiff in question told me all fines were now paid. Please advise what my next step should be

I wouldn't class that as a breakdown of their fees as all it does is list a load of figures. If it were me I would want to know what dates they are alleging to have attended and the charge made each time. I have tried working the sums out on the figures given but they do not appear to add up properly.