That referendum ...

[leclerc]

Re: That referendum ...

I think it means that if you don't want that method then you will have to accept tariffs because clearly there are trade deals between other countries and the EU that does not include free movement(Switzerland has recently put limits on migration which the EU are not happy about)

Re: That referendum ...

So it seems they are basically saying that if we want to be a part of the single market we will have all of the obligations and non of the rights.
Win win for them, lose get screwed for us.

I truly hope hope that the morons Ho thought they could out manoeuvre the rest of the eu get strung up by either their bits or their shaggy blond hair.

[leclerc]

Re: That referendum ...

Statement from meeting of the 27 other members of the EU

[EXC]

Re: That referendum ...

My understanding is that Scotland and Northern Ireland have no legal basis, as it stands to have a referendum on the EU nor a legal basis to break away. Sovereignty on those matters resides in Westminster.

EDIT: just got into this thread so apologies for off topic post.....

No need for apologies, your post is one of the few on-topic posts on the page.

Re: That referendum ...

Fresh fields

I am no expert on the American healthcare system but I am told there is Medicare and Medicaid . One is the one that provides insurance based services, the other is the safety net. The care provided in the safety net is incredibly inferior in scope and detail to the best insurance based care. This clearly provides for huge inequalities between rich and poor.

National insurance was intended to be just that in the uk, an insurance that working people paid to cover health, pensions etc and also unemployment benefit, these different benefits came along at different times. At its inception the government envisaged the NHS would improve the health of the nation and hence costs reduce. They also envisaged full employment . Neither of these things happened. I could go on but it's kinda off topic although maybe not if the Tories get their way.

I will ill try to bring the sun back with me, we have thunderstorms forecast for Friday.

[leclerc]

Re: That referendum ...

@leclerc

realistically i dont think, Ireland and Scotland can not go anyware, they dont have the economy to cover there debts. What would Scotland do if we moved all uk forces and services jobs. It may be just smoke and mirrors atm to secure a better deal before a re-vote. but, if not, its perhaps the best time for us to separate.. Its how fance ( or the french people ) react against us that could tip it into a full blown argument.

I bet a number of EU states are SH~ting it over Russia, if the EU unravels.

My understanding is that Scotland and Northern Ireland have no legal basis, as it stands to have a referendum on the EU nor a legal basis to break away. Sovereignty on those matters resides in Westminster.

EDIT: just got into this thread so apologies for off topic post.....

Re: That referendum ...

Hard to tell but I just cannot see things getting better overall. There is a bit of a lull/pick up at the moment because many people are picking up what they think of as bargains. I wouldn’t risk buying myself even if I could afford to gamble.
My MIL:vixen: owns shares that did not drop and actually climbed so….If she eats the Mushrooms over the weekend expect a mighty crash next week as I do ‘a little bit of business’.

The financial sector, hedge funds, etc. make money out of short term speculation and can benefit from falls as much as gains. It's called going short. There are also "structured products" which are more bets than investment, where their value is determined by the value of a certain index, the departure from certain values, etc. In other words, their value is not dependent on the value of underlying investments. They can increase in value when shares tumble if that's how they were set up. I remember producing factsheets for a lot of them. Only high net worth individuals and "sophisticated investors" could invest in them and they were based in the Channel Islands. The wealthy invest in a variety of products to hedge their bets, hence the term "hedge funds". That way they can weather the storms that blow the rest of us away.

I do do find that politically I should be against the EU because it is managed capitalism however, given a choice the UK is more like America with new right liberal capitalism, that means welfare, and I include the health service and pensions, is only a safety net and everyone should be providing their own insurance. It is a concept I think is criminal.

Compulsive health insurance is something you would expect in a dictatorship, not a "free country." I don't think health insurance was compulsory in pre-Obama times, it was established as part of "Obamacare", which turned out to be a bit like the referendum: many people thought the whole plan was something completely different, with the US becoming more like the UK and Canada, with a health service for everyone.

Paws is spot on, until recently homosexuality was classified as a mental disorder, apparently the world health organisation only changed it in 1990 . It was only with the publication of DSM(III) Diagnostic and statistical manuel published in 1980 that homosexuality was not classified by that publication as a mental disorder.

That's outrageous, homosexuality is also present in animals: http://www.gaystarnews.com/article/s...14/#gs.EXipD_I

Long ramble I know... I blame the sun.
As for the rest I blame The Sun :-)

The Sun is alive and well but the sun decided to do its own Brexit prior to the referendum, just to be on the right side of the EU.

I did start the other thread because this thread was going on a tangent... it's not helpful either.

Not helpful? This is a discussion thread, not an advice thread. We're not helping anyone in particular on here.

[Openlaw15]

Re: That referendum ...

Hopefully that'll be restricted to the other thread though.

I did start the other thread because this thread was going on a tangent... it's not helpful either.

Re: That referendum ...

Sorry been out all day enjoying nice European weather and hospitality.

I usually find that when people say they are bored by an argument it is because they aren't winning it. However, as Openlaw seems to have a degree in law I tend to defer to him on legal matters, I would be interested to know what other subjects has he studied and at what level. As amethyst says, these forums should not be places to try and score points by treating it as an assignment

I do do find that politically I should be against the EU because it is managed capitalism however, given a choice the UK is more like America with new right liberal capitalism, that means welfare, and I include the health service and pensions, is only a safety net and everyone should be providing their own insurance. It is a concept I think is criminal.

Paws is spot on, until recently homosexuality was classified as a mental disorder, apparently the world health organisation only changed it in 1990 . It was only with the publication of DSM(III) Diagnostic and statistical manuel published in 1980 that homosexuality was not classified by that publication as a mental disorder.

There are are of course many different definitions of homosexuality and as far as I know it is much more than just emotional attachment , let's face it we can all have deep emotional attachments to people of the same sex, doesn't make those people gay.

Compulsory voting, well I am all for it although there needs to be a void option as well. It works reasonably well in Australia although it has been reported that the normal punishment is a relatively modest fine , if at all. I believe there is voting fraud across all sections although depending on where you live depends what you hear. I am not sure compulsory voting would actually cure that as you could still apply and register postal votes.

When I see how Europeans generally behave I am ashamed to be British, they are generally polite and well behaved with strong values , this is particularly apparent in the former eastern bloc. Yes of course I know there is rampant corruption in places such as Serbia but I would rather walk alone at night in Warsaw, Riga, Vilnius , or many other cities than I would in Manchester, Leeds, Birmingham or London. Don't misunderstand, I believe in a United Kingdom but I also believe in Europe. I want us to be strong in a strong Europe than potentially just England and Wales on the sidelines.

Depending on what happens I foresee a brain drain, with academics and businesses relocating to Europe. I already know one professor, another senior teaching fellow at a major UK university who are considering relocating. Remember that academics do not just teach, they bring millions in investment to the UK.

Long ramble I know... I blame the sun.
As for the rest I blame The Sun :-)

[PAWS]

Re: That referendum ...

They will be if they work!

[enaid]

Re: That referendum ...

.If she eats the Mushrooms over the weekend expect a mighty crash next week

Are they magic

[PAWS]

Re: That referendum ...

What will FT gain tomorrow think it has risen or fallen more than 5% before

Hard to tell but I just cannot see things getting better overall. There is a bit of a lull/pick up at the moment because many people are picking up what they think of as bargains. I wouldn’t risk buying myself even if I could afford to gamble.
My MIL:vixen: owns shares that did not drop and actually climbed so….If she eats the Mushrooms over the weekend expect a mighty crash next week as I do ‘a little bit of business’.

[wales01man]

Re: That referendum ...

What will FT gain tomorrow think it has risen or fallen more than 5% before

[EXC]

Re: That referendum ...

After the fall in the FT on Friday its up over 3% today does that tell us something?

Yep that it's still about 5% lower than what it was before the referendum.

[PAWS]

Re: That referendum ...

At the moment everyone is just guessing what may happen with trade and migration until we leave and new rules are created nothing is set in stone. After the fall in the FT on Friday its up over 3% today does that tell us something?

Been watching that -still a bit worried and can't see it last and the pound is pretty weak. Crossing fingers and other bits!