TRANSCRIPTS - CMC July 7th 2008

[EXC]

These are the transcripts of the hearing/CMC of 7-9 July.

The Case Managment conference begins on the Tuesday at page 139.
------------------------------- merged -------------------------------
They should be up shortly.

Should be on now Nick-Jules

[Amethyst]

Re: July 7 Transcripts

Do read these, they make great reading - especially Mr Thanki for lloyds discussing the absence of T&Cs or tangible contract pre nov 2007 - end of 8th July beginning of 9th July.

Justice smith makes some cracking comments


16 MR JUSTICE ANDREW SMITH: But are they in "Everything You

17 Need to Know in One Guide" or that is something you

18 don't need to know



8 MR JUSTICE ANDREW SMITH: You tell me there were buffers in

9 the sense that you were allowed to go so many pounds

10 without being walloped.

[TANZARELLI]

Re: July 7 Transcripts

For anyone wanting to read them in order open the attachments from bottom upwards.

Thanks EXC I have posted a link to here on PAGfor anyone wishing to view these.

Tanz

[Tools]

Re: July 7 Transcripts

For anyone wanting to read them in order open the attachments from bottom upwards.

Thanks EXC I have posted a link to here on PAGfor anyone wishing to view these.

Tanz

My fault there Tanz apologies, I uploaded them in that order.

The name of the attached documents (i.e oft070708) is actually the date, therefore oft070708 is the transcripts for 7th July 2008 etc.............I`m sure you get the gist.

[Amethyst]

Re: July 7 Transcripts

Thank you for that an entertaining and enlightening few hours reading

[Budgie]

Re: July 7 Transcripts

Excellent, just finished reading front to back.

I reckon that it's a clear verdict for us wrt the basic accounts and a 50/50 for the normal current accounts.

[EXC]

Re: July 7 Transcripts

Well done Budgie.

Don't forget that the judgment will only decide whether the terms are CAPABLE of being penalties and if so it would require another test case to decide if indeed they are. In the light of this it maybe that Justice Smith might give us the benefit of the doubt.

[argentarius]

Re: July 7 Transcripts

I couldn't hack it through all three of them. I think Budgie's summary is pretty likely to match the outcome though - I've never understood how the penalty argument could fail on basic accounts where there has always been a prohibition on overdrawing.

[Amethyst]

Re: July 7 Transcripts

It will be interesting to see how the judge handles the lloyds accounts historical terms. He didnt sound overly convinced on the savings account and debit card terms, and myriad of 'everything you need to know' except this bit, this bit and this bit leafets.

I think he's great he really doesn't let them get away with anything. And he's just dead funny. Amused me seeing Crow and Thanki, and others too, softening and batting comments back and forth.

I do think we're sorted on historicals I still can't work out what fix and recompense the FSA / Courts are going to implement tho. If the terms are unfair and disprop penalties then the whole caboodle is unlawful and has to be refunded in full with interest - for everyone, for ever.....??

[ed.]

Re: July 7 Transcripts

After being offline for so long as Ame knows. I have finally tonight read the first day properly.

It's now 3.05am and I'm hoping TSB - close to my heart - are in day 2 but I started reading day 1 at around 11.30pm and it's took me so long to get through it because I've been wetting myself and quoting pieces to the missus, who had enough and fecked off to bed about an hour and half ago telling me to shut up and leave her alone when I came to bed.

Obviously she doesn't want me to memorise the bits she missed and then wake her up and pass it on.........behave people.

Justice Smith for the comedy connection is all I'll say!

Top man. And I hate to 'diss' Brian Doctor, but Crow seems far far quicker and has more balls. If he loses it on day 3 nobody please tell me, let me down gently.

A very happy Ed.

[Celestine]

Re: July 7 Transcripts

He's even funnier when you see him in person. It's no wonder he's risen this high. He is personable, funny and displays none of the arrogance or pompousness that some senior judges posess.

I was genuinely surprised at how entertaining the test case was to watch, mainly because of how Justice Smith smoothly controlled the complex hearing using humour and sharp intelligence.

I've added him to my fantasy dinner party guest list. I'll put him near Billy Connelly and Elizabeth 1st, maybe with Peter Cooke and Dudley Moore. Oooh I feel a new thread topic coming on

[ed.]

Re: July 7 Transcripts

Cel - I so wished I'd have seen some of these in person, but I think I'd have been done for contempt lol

Just finished reading the set, finally we get cloaking involved BUT oh WHY was the issue of TSB not having full written terms - ergo how the hell can they claim service fee with no evidence - jumped on more, let alone HSBC and Abbey in letters to consumers talking about administration costs etc not jumped on.

I was hoping for even a throwaway line of 'why have they paid out so much, if they claim they are legally right' but we haven't even had that.

I love Smith's comments and Crow was good, but I hope upon hope Smith has his wits about him and sees the bigger picture here.

I'm still very happy BUT I still see things missing from people who earn more in an hour than I do a day, maybe a week? It's still not perfect, but the OFT are giving it a good go.

[Tools]

Re: July 7 Transcripts

Just finished reading the set, finally we get cloaking involved BUT oh WHY was the issue of TSB not having full written terms - ergo how the hell can they claim service fee with no evidence - jumped on more, let alone HSBC and Abbey in letters to consumers talking about administration costs etc not jumped on.

If you read very carefully ed. , maybe he left those on the table at home? That bit had me in stitches.

[ed.]

Re: July 7 Transcripts

PMSL yeah very true.

I could do with reading it again to be honest, because I'ev probably missed loads through giggling too much.

[Amethyst]

Re: July 7 Transcripts

lol you big girl xxxxxxx