Apple refusing to give access to my deceased fathers appleid

[tootingted]

Firstly I a noob to this form so not sure if this the right section to post this.

Hi, my father passed away in May last year. Initially we were able to use his Apple iPad without any issues but as time went by various updates were required and we could not install them without his appleid and password. We tried resetting this by having a reset code sent to his nominated email account however this email provider, we discovered had shut down, therefore that proved impossible. The next step was to use Apple's second factor authorisation which consisted of three memorable names (street where you grew up, first car, best childhood friend, first school) in my Dad's case. Try as we might we could not get these right even after asking around other elderly relatives. It got to a point where we exceeded the attempts and the account was locked. I have spoken to Apple and they insist that I must provide a general court order (N24?) to instruct them to reset the password and/or remove the lock on the account so that I may retrieve the Information backed up on their servers and restore the ipad.

Looking around on the internet there seems to be several incidences of this where people have had to go through the same process. I guess what I am after is how I should construct the wording on the document to be as specific as possible from the perspective of the court eg. I Mr. DJH as nominated executor and beneficiary of the Late Mr. JWH (deceased) would require that Apple Inc take what steps as necessary to reset the password or supply new passwords as to enable access to data stored within Apple Inc. data storage infrastructure pertaining to the deceased and enable such data to be used to restore access and data from ipad (insert serial number).

This is thought would be a reasonable amount of information for the court but I really need to get a second opinion from someone to prevent being held up by some technicality.

Please with all due repsect to all the Techies who may read this forum I am not interested in jailbreaking the ipad or hacking it in some way I just want to restore it to how it was before my Dad died and be able to apply updates, install and remove apps and access the data that is still on it that has sentimental value.

Many thanks

[2222]

Obviously, not many people have practical experience of this, but I have certainly heard of other people in your position.

I suggest:

a) What you wrote in the paragraph beginning "Hi, my father ..." sounds like most of what you need to explain to the court. It's quite clear. That needs to be followed by what you want the court to instruct Apple to do.

b) Ideally, you need to know what Apple want the court order to say, so they can release the account. Have you asked them whether they have any specimen wording?

c) Otherwise, I suggest that you ask the court to order Apple Inc. to unlock and release the account to <name>.

d) In any case, run the draft wording past Apple.

e) Sorry, but I have no idea what authority you need to quote to the court. If you ever get to speak to a judge, you can explain that Apple are perfectly happy to unlock the device, and they just need an order to do so.

[paulajayne]

A google search provides several way to do a reset without passcode. Are you trying to get access to Fathers online data or just want to reset the IPad?

[tootingted]

A google search provides several way to do a reset without passcode. Are you trying to get access to Fathers online data or just want to reset the IPad?

Performing a reset is pretty straightforward I know, it's actually preserving the data I am interested in.

Thanks for your interest.

[paulajayne]

Have you tried this:-

[tootingted]

Obviously, not many people have practical experience of this, but I have certainly heard of other people in your position.

I suggest:

a) What you wrote in the paragraph beginning "Hi, my father ..." sounds like most of what you need to explain to the court. It's quite clear. That needs to be followed by what you want the court to instruct Apple to do.

b) Ideally, you need to know what Apple want the court order to say, so they can release the account. Have you asked them whether they have any specimen wording?

c) Otherwise, I suggest that you ask the court to order Apple Inc. to unlock and release the account to <name>.

d) In any case, run the draft wording past Apple.

e) Sorry, but I have no idea what authority you need to quote to the court. If you ever get to speak to a judge, you can explain that Apple are perfectly happy to unlock the device, and they just need an order to do so.

Any ideas on the cost of submitting an application of this nature to a court, couldn't find any specific reference on the DOJ website?

[tootingted]

Have you tried this:-

Unfortunately that method still requires that you have the appleid password which is the crux of the problem.

[2222]

Any ideas on the cost of submitting an application of this nature to a court, couldn't find any specific reference on the DOJ website?

I'm not at all sure. If you download EX50 and look on page 6, you'll see a figure of £308 mentioned. Perhaps someone else could confirm that, please?

This has obviously been a problem for other people. Googling "apple unlock phone after death" produces loads of hits. It may be worth trawling through in case someone else has found a solution. It's not so much a matter of unlocking the phone as getting Apple to act.

[tootingted]

I'm not at all sure. If you download EX50 and look on page 6, you'll see a figure of £308 mentioned. Perhaps someone else could confirm that, please?

This has obviously been a problem for other people. Googling "apple unlock phone after death" produces loads of hits. It may be worth trawling through in case someone else has found a solution. It's not so much a matter of unlocking the phone as getting Apple to act.

I have spoken to Apple, it seems that a court order is the only way round this and Apple tell me that they will happily comply once I get the court order. £308 is quite steep I'd love to know if anyone could confirm this.

[tootingted]

Stop Press! Update from Apple, here is what they tell me I need to put on the Court Order Application. I just need to know the appropriate form to use for the court if anyone can help, someone mentioned a form N24, ring bells with anyone?

A court order which must specify that:

(1) The decedent was the user of all accounts associated with the Apple ID.
(2) The requestor is the legal personal representative of the decedent.
(3) As legal personal representative, the requestor is the "agent" of the decedent, and their authorization constitutes "lawful consent" as those terms are used in the Electronic Communications Privacy Act.
(4) Apple is ordered by the court to assist in the recovery of decedent's personal data from their accounts, which may contain third party personally identifiable information or data, from their accounts.

[Amethyst]

I'm sorry it's not something I've come across before.

I believe you need form N244 and apply with consent. ( which costs £100 ). You will require a letter from Apple consenting, and a draft of the order required.

https://www.gov.uk/government/public...ication-notice is the N244.

The N24 is the sheet you'd use to write the Draft Order on to go with the application ( though you can just do it on plain paper )

The court may require a part 8 claim though which is a fee of £308, as you know, so one would hope the N244 would suffice, but I'm not sure how you do that without having a claim in progress.

I might ring the court and ask them. It seems slightly bonkers of Apple to basically agree to give you the info but say they require a court order, and word said court order for you. Why not just give you the info.

Tagging pt2537 to see if he knows how you just ask court to issue an order without having a claim.

[ostell]

Surely a will, a death certificate and ID of an Executor is more than sufficient to show right of access, or is this just Apple being their normal stubborn selves? Or is this partly brought about by different rules in the USA and Apple seem to think US rules the world?

[tootingted]

Surely a will, a death certificate and ID of an Executor is more than sufficient to show right of access, or is this just Apple being their normal stubborn selves? Or is this partly brought about by different rules in the USA and Apple seem to think US rules the world?

No, Apple have been quite clear on this. I have spoken to them at length, they require I obtain a court order instructing them to assist in the recovery of data associated with the decedents AppleID. I am preparing the relevant documents at the moment and will post details of the hoops you need to jump through to get this done once I get mine submitted. This will then help others out in a similar situation.

[2222]

Yes, I think that will be really helpful for someone, Ted.

[tootingted]

No, Apple have been quite clear on this. I have spoken to them at length, they require I obtain a court order instructing them to assist in the recovery of data associated with the decedents AppleID. I am preparing the relevant documents at the moment and will post details of the hoops you need to jump through to get this done once I get mine submitted. This will then help others out in a similar situation.

OK, the story so far.

Apple were quite helpful and informed me that under UK law I could request that they comply and unlock and give me access to my late Father's AppleID associated accounts, however I would need to obtain a court order. So I made the following steps.

Prepared an application for a Court order (form n244)
Prepared a draft Court order (form n24

With the help of Apple I drafted the Order of Judgement, using specific wording they 'suggested' to me.

(1) The decedent was the user of all accounts associated with the Apple ID.
(2) The requester is the legal personal representative of the decedent.
(3) As legal personal representative, the requester is the "agent" of the decedent, and their authorisation constitutes "lawful consent" as those terms are used in the Electronic Communications Privacy Act.
(4) Apple is ordered by the court to assist in the recovery of decedent's personal data from their accounts, which may contain third party personally identifiable information or data, from their accounts.

I eventually came up with the following draft judgement to be transcribed to the DFO form n24.

__________________________________________________ __________________________________________________ IT IS ORDERED THAT


Mr. John Bloggs as executor of the estate and beneficiary of the late Mr. James Bloggs, and acting as his legal personal representative is the agent of the decedent and their authorisation constitutes “lawful consent” under the terms used in the Electronic Communications Privacy Act.

Apple Distribution International unlock all Apple devices held or owned by the decedent for the purposes of recovery of the decedent's personal data from he's accounts, which may contain third party personally identifiable information or data, from hisaccounts, in particular all accounts associated with the decedent's Apple ID john@bloggs.freeserve.co.uk.
__________________________________________________ _______________________

I took this N24 form, the N244 application, a copy of my Dad's will and death certificate, all in triplicate, and two copies of my ID to the County Court. As I entered the building I was electronically security scanned, usual practice these days so i was not concerned, however I had a miniature penknife on my keyring, it was noticed, probably because it was the most interesting thing the couple of scruffy security guards had encountered that day . I asked to be able to leave the building and put it in my car, but they told me they would have to call the police if i did. So i ended up filling more forms for them to be able to confiscate it and then return it to me by post.

I am not at the end of my tether yet with all this hassle to "reset a password", but it is all getting quite amusing how this obfuscation has infringed on our lives as a result of ill-educated bureaucrats and litigation obsessed companies.

I spent the best part of thirty years dealing with all levels company administration and this one to coin a phrase 'take's the biscuit'.