Co-op energy vs Johnybegoodtoday - Ł5k - NOT MY DEBT - Not my account number

**R0b** · 18th May 2016, 07:41:AM

Re: Co-op energy vs Johnybegoodtoday - Ł5k - NOT MY DEBT - Not my account number

Helllo Johny,

So this isn't missed I've tagged @nemesis45 and @Amethyst.

Keebles don't appear to have listed the date of when this outstanding balance occurred which is strange and as you say, it could have been purchased by Credit Style Limited.

Some of the documents you could ask for is whether they have any letters that were sent to you in your name, invoices, demands etc which prove the debt was yours. The likelihood of them having that information will be slim to none if they are a debt purchaser as they will not have that information.

I would also send a separate letter at the same time, outlining your current position explaining that you will defend the matter as you believe they have the incorrect person and there are various inconsistencies including, the account number is not yours or recognised, whilst Co-op is your current supplier you have made every payment on time which can be evidenced by a letter from the Co-Op (don't mention how long you have been with them), and prior to the Co-Op you were with another supplier.

As they have failed to provide sufficient information on the particulars of claim you require further information such as the date of when this debt occurred. You also request that they consent to an extension of 28 days to file a defence in order to save costs at a later date to amend the defence. If they fail to consent or provide the required information, then you will be seeking an application for strike out and/or summary judgment as the claim is purely speculative with little information to go by.

In the meantime have you contacted the Co-Op and see if you pass their checks on validation of name and address? Might be worth doing that in the meantime, or even if you can find out when this debt occurred and you can formulate your defence around that.

**nemesis45** · 18th May 2016, 08:01:AM

Re: Co-op energy vs Johnybegoodtoday - Ł5k - NOT MY DEBT - Not my account number

Good morning.
Do you have your gas and electricity bills or is this a paperless account?
Do you have bank statements showing your payments?
It is a pity that the previous communications were ignored it would have been much easier to resolve the problem at that point.

I suggest that:

1. You contact the Coop by phone quoting the account No. specified in the claim ask for an explanation.

2. Write to Keeble Hawson stating that the account specified is not your and enclose proof that your COOP account is paid up to date.

Which court issued the claim?
The debt is not statute barred.
Have you acknowledged service of the claim if not do so asap. State intention to defend in full.

nem

**Amethyst** · 18th May 2016, 08:03:AM

Re: Co-op energy vs Johnybegoodtoday - Ł5k - NOT MY DEBT - Not my account number

I concur with R0b & Nem - contact Co-Op asap and find out what's happened with this, you will likely have to defend the case so after you speak with Co-Op get them to send you it in writing/email.

**johnybegoodtoday** · 25th May 2016, 13:47:PM

Re: Co-op energy vs Johnybegoodtoday - Ł5k - NOT MY DEBT - Not my account number

Hi Guys,

Many thanks for directions so far..... update as follows:

I have acknowledged the claim with the Count Court Business Centre in Northampton – intending to dispute in full – done.

I am about to send this letter to Keebls as advised by @http://legalbeagles.info/forums/member.php?71570-R0b
Hope it is correct?

Dear Sirs,

REF: Co-Operative Energy Ltd v Mr J XXXXX. Claim Number: XXXXX

Please be advised that I will defend the above matter as I believe you have the incorrect person and there are various inconsistencies including:

a) The account number is not mine.
b) The account number is not recognised.
c) Whilst Co-Op is my current supplier I have made every payment on time which can be evidenced by the enclosed bills from the Co-Op and receipts of direct debit payments taken by them.
d) Prior to my account with the Co-Op I was with another supplier.

I will be defending the above matter in full and I have requested documentation under separate cover.

Yours faithfully,

And I have enclosed a copies of a few of my G+E bills showing amounts due and payments made by DD mandate. I am guessing that as they are charging interest from December 2014 that this may be the date it became due, so I have ensured that copies of my bills cover 6 month either side of that period.

Any advice or last min changes before I send it recorded delivery?

Further update to follow….

**johnybegoodtoday** · 25th May 2016, 14:02:PM

Re: Co-op energy vs Johnybegoodtoday - Ł5k - NOT MY DEBT - Not my account number

I have also spoken to Co-Op twice as follows and as suggested by both @nemesis45 and @Amethyst. :

1) As me at my address with my account number (not the one on the claim form) and have been told that everything is ok with my account although I am going to need to increase the amount I pay monthly by DD and they will work this out and let me know how much it will be. – All good

2) As the initial and surname on the claim form and account number of the debt and I come to a brick wall as I “cannot confirm the address of the account that the bill is from”. I have tried giving my address, but that is not good enough for them and they “can’t discuss it with me as I cannot confirm the address of the account holder”

**nemesis45** · 25th May 2016, 14:15:PM

Re: Co-op energy vs Johnybegoodtoday - Ł5k - NOT MY DEBT - Not my account number

Hi,

Looks fine to me Johnny.

nem

**R0b** · 25th May 2016, 14:15:PM

Re: Co-op energy vs Johnybegoodtoday - Ł5k - NOT MY DEBT - Not my account number

Your letter seems fine to me, perhaps adding in that if they intend to pursue this through the courts, you will seek a wasted costs order against them for failing to carry out further investigations despite being given evidence which entirely shows that you are not the person who owes the debt. You may not get it but if you have given them evidence which implies you are not in debt and Co-Op agree confirm this with you, then they are wasting both yours and the courts time.

You say you have spoken to Co-Op is there a possibility of them confirming in writing your account number, that your payments are up to date and that you were never in debt at any point - perhaps do this by email? It will strengthen your claim if you can show in writing that the Co-Op confirms you have no outstanding debt with them.

Might be worth sending a copy of the letter to Credit Style too so that they are also put on notice.

**johnybegoodtoday** · 25th May 2016, 14:29:PM

Re: Co-op energy vs Johnybegoodtoday - Ł5k - NOT MY DEBT - Not my account number

Many thanks chaps - very good of you - I will keep you posted as too where we go and what I send.

**johnybegoodtoday** · 25th May 2016, 18:56:PM

Re: Co-op energy vs Johnybegoodtoday - Ł5k - NOT MY DEBT - Not my account number

Hi Chaps,
I have now sent letters outlining my intention of defence as above with the extra bit suggested by R0b to both Keeble Solicitors and copied to Credit Style Limited putting them on notice. I will be asking Co-Op via email for confirmation of account being OK tomorrow.

I am now just about to send CPR31.14 to Keeble – I will be doing a separate letter afterwards asking specifically for much more info. Please could you just cast an eye over this to ensure I am not making any grave mistakes as they have not really listed any documents bar an account number? Many thanks in anticipation,

Johnybegoodtoday..........

Dear Sirs,

REF: Co-Operative Energy Ltd v Mr J XXXXX. Claim Number: XXXXXXX

Request for documents mentioned in a statement of case under CPR 31.14

On 13/05/2016 I received the Claim Form in this case issued by you out of the County Court Business Centre.

I confirm having returned my acknowledgement of service to the court in which I indicate my intention to contest all of your claim.

Please treat this letter as my request made under CPR 31.14 for the disclosure and the production of a verified and legible copy of the document mentioned in your Particulars of Claim:

1. Account Number MCCOE XXXXXXX.

You will appreciate that in an ordinary case and by reason of the provisions of CPR PD 16 para 7.3, where a claim is based upon a written agreement, a copy of the contract or documents constituting the agreement should be attached to or served with the particulars of claim and the original(s) should be available at the hearing. Further, that any general conditions incorporated in the contract should also be attached.

You should ensure compliance with your CPR 31 duties and ensure that the document(s) I have requested are copied to and received by me within 7 days of receiving this letter. Your CPR 31 duties extend to making a reasonable and proportionate search for the originals of the documents I have requested, the better for you to be able to verify the document's authenticity and to provide me with a legible copy. Further, where I have requested a copy of a document, the original of which is now in the possession of another person, you will have a right to possession of that document if you have mentioned it in your case. You must take immediate steps to recover and preserve it for the purpose of this case.

Where I have mentioned a document and there is in your possession more than one version of that same document owing to a modification, obliteration or other marking or feature, each version will be a separate document and you must provide a copy of each version of it to me. Your obligations extend to making a reasonable and proportionate search for any version(s) to include an obligation to recover and preserve such version(s) which are now in the possession of a third party.

In accordance with CPR 31.15(c) I undertake to be responsible for your reasonable copying costs incurred in complying with this CPR 31.14 request.

If you require more time in which to comply with this request you must tell me in writing. You must tell me before the time for compliance with this request has expired. In telling me you require more time you must tell me what steps you have taken and propose to take in order to comply with this request and also state a date by when you will comply with this request. In addition your statement must be accompanied with a statement that you agree to an extension of the time for me to file my defence. Your extension of time must be not less than 14 days from the date when you say you will have complied with my request and you must state the new date for filing my defence.

If you are unable to comply with this request and believe that you will never be able to comply with this request you must tell me in writing.

You should note that this claim has not yet been allocated to a specific track and the provisions of CPR 27(2) are of no effect. Had your claim not been issued through CCBC the Claimant would have been obliged to attach copies of the documentation upon which it relies to the Particulars of Claim. I, as Defendant, am entitled to see the documents on which the Claimant relies and which you will have to produce at trial. Disclosure at this stage will enable me to fully plead my case and further the Overriding Objective.

Please note that if you should fail to comply with this request, fail to request more time or fail to agree to an extension of time for the filing of my defence, I will make an application to the court for an order that the proceedings be struck out or stayed for non-compliance and a summary costs order as the claim is purely speculative with little information to go by.

I do hope this will not be necessary and look forward to hearing from you.

Yours faithfully.........

Does this cut the mustard chaps and is this ok to send?

**johnybegoodtoday** · 26th May 2016, 13:18:PM

Re: Co-op energy vs Johnybegoodtoday - Ł5k - NOT MY DEBT - Not my account number

Hi Guys, any chance someone could just cast an eye over the above CPR31.14 letter before I send it please? Just so I don't make a tit of myself :-) @nemesis45 and @Amethyst
Many thanks in anticipation,
Johnybegoodtoday.

**R0b** · 26th May 2016, 13:59:PM

Re: Co-op energy vs Johnybegoodtoday - Ł5k - NOT MY DEBT - Not my account number

looks fine to me standard template letter, personally would remove the following:

In accordance with CPR 31.15(c) I undertake to be responsible for your reasonable copying costs incurred in complying with this CPR 31.14 request.

Let them raise the point of copying costs but usually unless there were exceptional circumstances, they shouldn't charge for it because it would already be covered under their legal fees anyway as part of their overheads. If the documents required were something like 1,000 pages then that may be an exceptional circumstance.

**nemesis45** · 26th May 2016, 15:05:PM

Re: Co-op energy vs Johnybegoodtoday - Ł5k - NOT MY DEBT - Not my account number

Originally posted by johnybegoodtoday View Post

Hi Chaps,
I have now sent letters outlining my intention of defence as above with the extra bit suggested by R0b to both Keeble Solicitors and copied to Credit Style Limited putting them on notice. I will be asking Co-Op via email for confirmation of account being OK tomorrow.

I am now just about to send CPR31.14 to Keeble – I will be doing a separate letter afterwards asking specifically for much more info. Please could you just cast an eye over this to ensure I am not making any grave mistakes as they have not really listed any documents bar an account number? Many thanks in anticipation,

Johnybegoodtoday..........

Dear Sirs,

REF: Co-Operative Energy Ltd v Mr J XXXXX. Claim Number: XXXXXXX

Request for documents mentioned in a statement of case under CPR 31.14

On 13/05/2016 I received the Claim Form in this case issued by you out of the County Court Business Centre.

I confirm having returned my acknowledgement of service to the court in which I indicate my intention to contest all of your claim.

Please treat this letter as my request made under CPR 31.14 for the disclosure and the production of a verified and legible copy of the document mentioned in your Particulars of Claim:

1. Account Number MCCOE XXXXXXX.

You will appreciate that in an ordinary case and by reason of the provisions of CPR PD 16 para 7.3, where a claim is based upon a written agreement, a copy of the contract or documents constituting the agreement should be attached to or served with the particulars of claim and the original(s) should be available at the hearing. Further, that any general conditions incorporated in the contract should also be attached.

You should ensure compliance with your CPR 31 duties and ensure that the document(s) I have requested are copied to and received by me within 7 days of receiving this letter. Your CPR 31 duties extend to making a reasonable and proportionate search for the originals of the documents I have requested, the better for you to be able to verify the document's authenticity and to provide me with a legible copy. Further, where I have requested a copy of a document, the original of which is now in the possession of another person, you will have a right to possession of that document if you have mentioned it in your case. You must take immediate steps to recover and preserve it for the purpose of this case.

Where I have mentioned a document and there is in your possession more than one version of that same document owing to a modification, obliteration or other marking or feature, each version will be a separate document and you must provide a copy of each version of it to me. Your obligations extend to making a reasonable and proportionate search for any version(s) to include an obligation to recover and preserve such version(s) which are now in the possession of a third party.

In accordance with CPR 31.15(c) I undertake to be responsible for your reasonable copying costs incurred in complying with this CPR 31.14 request.

If you require more time in which to comply with this request you must tell me in writing. You must tell me before the time for compliance with this request has expired. In telling me you require more time you must tell me what steps you have taken and propose to take in order to comply with this request and also state a date by when you will comply with this request. In addition your statement must be accompanied with a statement that you agree to an extension of the time for me to file my defence. Your extension of time must be not less than 14 days from the date when you say you will have complied with my request and you must state the new date for filing my defence.

If you are unable to comply with this request and believe that you will never be able to comply with this request you must tell me in writing.

You should note that this claim has not yet been allocated to a specific track and the provisions of CPR 27(2) are of no effect. Had your claim not been issued through CCBC the Claimant would have been obliged to attach copies of the documentation upon which it relies to the Particulars of Claim. I, as Defendant, am entitled to see the documents on which the Claimant relies and which you will have to produce at trial. Disclosure at this stage will enable me to fully plead my case and further the Overriding Objective.

Please note that if you should fail to comply with this request, fail to request more time or fail to agree to an extension of time for the filing of my defence, I will make an application to the court for an order that the proceedings be struck out or stayed for non-compliance and a summary costs order as the claim is purely speculative with little information to go by.

I do hope this will not be necessary and look forward to hearing from you.

Yours faithfully.........

Does this cut the mustard chaps and is this ok to send?

My thoughts Johnny is that it not necessary to have all that.

CPR31.14 is a simple request for the documents mention in the POC.

Sir/ Madam.,

Claim No.

Request made under the provision of Civil Procedure Rule 31.14.

I am in receipt of the above mentioned CC Claim and request that you supply me with copies of the following as documents mentioned in the Particulars of Claim being:

1...........................

2.................................

3..............................

You are reminded that CPR 31.14 is relevant until this claim is allocated to a tract.

Your response is required within 7 days from the date hereon.

Yours etc.

use singed for post.

nem

**johnybegoodtoday** · 27th May 2016, 11:07:AM

Re: Co-op energy vs Johnybegoodtoday - Ł5k - NOT MY DEBT - Not my account number

Hi R0b and @nemesis45 and @Amethyst ,
Many thanks so far you have all been a huge help.

One last check if you could be so kind chaps, I want Keeble to fully show their hand so I would like to also send this letter before starting on my defence, but at the same time I do not want to shoot myself in the foot somehow. Please can you have a quick read before I send and any advice would be much appreciated? Note that none of these docs have been mentioned in the POC apart from the account number.

REF: Co-Operative Energy Ltd v Mr J XXXXX
Claim Number: XXXXX
Account Number: MCCOEXXXXX

Further Request for documents and information

As you have failed to provide sufficient information on the particulars of claim I require further information and documents from you. Please be aware that I currently have no information and no documentation in relation to account number MCCOEXXXXX and I have never been in receipt of any other information or documentation other than that contained in the particulars of claim. So that I am able to fully prepare my defence, please supply the below information and documents upon which you rely in relation to account number MCCOEXXXXX within the next 7 days?

The dates of when this debt occurred and when it became due.
Confirmation as to whether this debt is for gas alone, electricity alone or both gas and electricity as you have been ambiguous on the particulars of claim.
Full and good quality copies of the bills for the above account number detailing all amounts being invoiced along with the dates, meter readings and who validated them, meter point registration and administration numbers and meter serial numbers. This will be fundamental to my defence as I believe you have the wrong person at the wrong house.
Full and good quality copies of any letters sent in my name from your client.
Full and good quality copies of any contracts and or agreements sent in my name from your client.
Any other information or documentation on which you are going to be relying upon to prove your case.

Also, as you have failed to provide sufficient information on the particulars of claim for me to prepare a defence, I request that you consent to an extension of 28 days to file a defence in order to save costs at a later date to amend the defence.

If you fail to consent or provide the required information, then I will be seeking an application for strike out and/or summary judgment as the claim is purely speculative with little information to go by.

Bla bla bla, registered mail

Any thoughts? E.g. will this help them more than it will me?
Johnybegoodtoday

**R0b** · 27th May 2016, 12:36:PM

Re: Co-op energy vs Johnybegoodtoday - Ł5k - NOT MY DEBT - Not my account number

This will be fundamental to my defence as I believe you have the wrong person at the wrong house.

Above isn't necessary I think, but the rest is fine

Co-op energy vs Johnybegoodtoday - Ł5k - NOT MY DEBT - Not my account number

Co-op energy vs Johnybegoodtoday - Ł5k - NOT MY DEBT - Not my account number

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