Fall at car dealership

[stevetuk]

This morning I brought my vehicle to the car dealership for a service and MOT. The forecourt was left untreated and was an ice rink, but I actually slipped and fell on ice while walking up the sloped main entrance, so it was within the main entranceway. I have a swollen arm, wrist and have pain in my neck, elbow and shoulder. It could have been a lot worse I know!

I reported this to the staff inside. They said they hadn't gritted because they'd been told not to. They said they weren't liable for any accidents. I wasn't asked to complete an accident form, they didn't apologise, and nothing was done at all. I am not seeking compensation, but I want to know my rights and what steps they should have taken. It's gone completely unreported in essence. Any advice?

[echat11]

Hi Steveuk

Welcome to LB

Hope you feel better soon.

If it's part of a multiple site operation (if it's not still complain), write a formal letter of complaint to their Head Office.

Health and Safety is actually 'common sense', everyone at that site is responsible.

They shouldn't need to be told that it's 'slippery', that's just waiting for an accident to 'happen' and trouble.

[Pezza54]

Any business or individual with control over premises has a duty of care towards its visitors under the Occupiers Liability Act 1957

Please read the article "Occupier duties for snow and ice - to grit or not to grit?" at www.mills-reeve.com

IMO you fell on ice on a main entrance ramp that should have been gritted. The staff would have known the ramp (a slope) was hazardous but had done nothing and seemed disinterested in your fall and injury.

You reported your fall to the admin at reception. Make sure you point that out in your letter.

Take photos of bruises and keep diary notes of pain etc. You may have a negligence claim

[Manxman]

Any business or individual with control over premises has a duty of care towards its visitors under the Occupiers Liability Act 1957

Please read the article "Occupier duties for snow and ice - to grit or not to grit?" at www.mills-reeve.com

IMO you fell on ice on a main entrance ramp that should have been gritted. The staff would have known the ramp (a slope) was hazardous but had done nothing and seemed disinterested in your fall and injury.

You reported your fall to the admin at reception. Make sure you point that out in your letter.

Take photos of bruises and keep diary notes of pain etc. You may have a negligence claim

Pezza54 - you might have missed that the OP has made it very clear that he does not want to make a claim for compensation. Indeed he has made it clear on another forum (MSE) that all he wants is, and I quote from MSE, an: "...[a]pology and admission of fault to the degree that they were responsible for the condition of the premises, but most importantly an assurance that procedures will be reviewed and the safety of visitors ensured in future"

Given that he doesn't want to make a claim for compensation, how would you advise him to achieve his aim? It's been suggested that he simply write to the business and ask for an apology on the basis that he undertakes not to use it against the business, but he seems reluctant to follow that advice. (And of course such an apology could be seen as worthless anyway)

It's not clear to posters on MSE that he has any "legal" right to what he wants as it seems unrealistic, but he doesn't seem to like that view.

[Pezza54]

Pezza54 - you might have missed that the OP has made it very clear that he does not want to make a claim for compensation. Indeed he has made it clear on another forum (MSE) that all he wants is, and I quote from MSE, an: "...[a]pology and admission of fault to the degree that they were responsible for the condition of the premises, but most importantly an assurance that procedures will be reviewed and the safety of visitors ensured in future"

Given that he doesn't want to make a claim for compensation, how would you advise him to achieve his aim? It's been suggested that he simply write to the business and ask for an apology on the basis that he undertakes not to use it against the business, but he seems reluctant to follow that advice. (And of course such an apology could be seen as worthless anyway)

It's not clear to posters on MSE that he has any "legal" right to what he wants as it seems unrealistic, but he doesn't seem to like that view.

"Once bitten twice shy"
A court claim or a threat of a court claim if OP does not receive an acceptable apology should make the dealership apologise and grit the ramp to prevent future accidents

[islandgirl]

But would an apology mean they accept liability? If so they may be reluctant to make one...

[Pezza54]

If an apology has to be forced, how sincere is it?

[Manxman]

"Once bitten twice shy"
A court claim or a threat of a court claim if OP does not receive an acceptable apology should make the dealership apologise and grit the ramp to prevent future accidents

But if you assume that the OP is sincere and genuine in (1) not wanting to sue and not wanting compensation, and (2) only wants to know what "rights" they have to an apology and to know what the dealer will do in fufture to improve safety, then wouldn't you be suggesting that they act disingenuously and hypocritically in threatening legal action?

AIUI all the OP wants to know is what rights they have in principle - to which I think the answer is probably none in practice if they don't wish to enforce them.

As far as I can see the only answer consistent with the OP's stated position is just to ask the dealer for an apology and ask how they will deal with ice in future.

That may or may not satisfy the OP, but as islandgirl says the dealer is unlikely to apologise without admitting liability and as you yourself point out, what value and sincerity is there in an apology brought about by threat?

(I think the view on MSE was that the question - as posed - was pointless and a waste of time, but the OP didn't like that...)

[Pezza54]

I take your point but I'm really concerned about this dealer's attitude towards safety
The ramp was built for disabled people especially wheelchair access
A carer pushing an unstable wheelchair does nor have a hand free to grip the handrail
A slip and faull by the carer may result in a more serious accident

[echat11]

The 'thing' is that the employees should act as soon as they become aware (they know it's unsafe, so should of acted), they shouldn't wait to be instructed to make the 'ramp' safe. All businesses should deal with that before they open, if there's been bad weather.

[islandgirl]

But if you assume that the OP is sincere and genuine in (1) not wanting to sue and not wanting compensation, and (2) only wants to know what "rights" they have to an apology and to know what the dealer will do in fufture to improve safety, then wouldn't you be suggesting that they act disingenuously and hypocritically in threatening legal action?

It has been known. That would be my first thought if I were the person being asked for the apology. May well not be the case here but if I stood to be in the frame for a large compensation claim I do not think I would be apologising either - just in case. I would however ensure I gritted next time...

[Pezza54]

My advice in post 3 was not to make a claim but to record and keep a diary of the injuries and pain in case the OP changes their mind about making a claim
Injuries such as swollen wrist, arm and shoulder and neck pain can turn out to be worse than first thought
Hopefully this won't happen to OP, but if it does OP could be faced with physiotherapy costs and loss of income

[islandgirl]

100% which is why I would not admit liability with an apology were I the dealership

[echat11]

https://www.acs.org.uk/news/acs-enco...dverse-weather

[des8]

As an aside I wonder what the dealership's Public Liability Insurers would think of an insured who neither cares for his responsibilities as occupier, nor bothers recording incidents which could lead to a large claim.