Help with letting problem please

[meerkatsmimm]

Hi,
newbie here.
like most newbies, i've registered as i need advice - not sure where to ask though.

we (me, husband & mil) have a property we let out short term to cover bills (mortgage, rates, service charges etc) through gumtree mainly.

we had a guest make a booking recently, didn't pay deposit or give card details as security due to bereavement (?!). We arranged to meet at the property at 2pm to allow her access and hand over keys. at 3.15pm we left the property as after trying to contact her there had been no reply and we had to go to another appointment. at 3.35pm someone phoned to say they were there and looking in, so we arranged to go back at 4.30pm.

on our return, she was not there, 3 other people were there though, demanding to be let in. they mentioned another 'crowd' arriving in another car soon and given that the property is only insure for max occupancy of 4 entry was refused and we left the car park/property.

now apparently the 'guests' are professionals - working in press & PR - and are now threatening to 'ruin us' and our reputation etc, going as far as to say they are making it their mission.

my question is - where so we stand legally. in my eyes, they had not confirmed the booking by deposit or security, they did not turn up at the agreed time and made no contact to let us know they were delayed, and the person making the booking in fact did not turn up at the rearranged time either, therefore we had every right to refuse entry, firstly because the person making the booking wasn't there in person to make payment and provide ID, and secondly on the basis that we believed there were going to be more than 4 people occupying the property.

all advice appreciated - tell me where to move this to also

[Hurricane Puffrose]

Re: hi, new and need advice - where to ask?

Hello and welcome firstly
Always nice to "see a new face" so to speak, I am not property expert, but you have come to the right place, as soon as I see an admin i will ask for this thread to be moved to the right place

[bluebottle]

Re: Help with letting problem please

I'm here, Puff. What exactly have these people threatened to do and what are they demanding?

[Sapphire]

Re: Help with letting problem please

Sounds to me like the old trick, rent out a property and use it for illicit purposes, we had exactly the same in a house in the next town to us, the place was used as a cannabis farm. Might not be that though, might just be set up as a nice little place for ladies of the night to operate in.
Personally I'd report it to the coppers, I know it sounds extreme maybe I'm right, or maybe I'm getting cynical, but its worth reporting, just in case.

[meerkatsmimm]

Re: Help with letting problem please

'as a citizen, journalist and PR, I am making it my moral mission to let as many people as I can aware of your disgraceful behaviour, leaving me stranded with no accomodation.'

so for me that sounds like press, facebook, twitter and anyone who will listen. Given that we operate a reputation-led business this could ruin us!

[Sapphire]

Re: Help with letting problem please

Sounds to me like a load of hot air, if that person seriously wanted to rent your place they would have given guarantees, deposits and even more turned up at the appropriate time to collect the keys.

Report them to the coppers.

[meerkatsmimm]

Re: Help with letting problem please

oh, and yes, we have had our fair share of 'ladies of the night' (and ladyboys of the night too) turn up, most get refused entry but some get through without detection....until they check out and you find the aftermath...yuck!
we even acquired a whip once

[bluebottle]

Re: Help with letting problem please

These scrotes are making unwarranted demands and using menaces as a means of enforcing said demands. That is a criminal offence under Section 21, Theft Act 1968. From what you have said, it is evident they have no right in law to make the demands and the menaces are, in my considered judgement, not a proper means of enforcing said demands. Sapphire has given you the best advice and that is to report these scrotes to the police.

[meerkatsmimm]

Re: Help with letting problem please

report being made - thank you for easing my mind. thought i was going to the clinker for refusing someone entry to our property

[meerkatsmimm]

Re: Help with letting problem please

spoke to pc plod and he says perhaps a case of harrassment but not likely to stick...

[bluebottle]

Re: Help with letting problem please

Depends on which piece of legislation he was referring to, i.e. Public Order Act 1986 or Protection from Harassment Act 1997. Trying to prove harassment in the criminal sense is notoriously difficult. However, there is a civil remedy provision under Section 3, Protection from Harassment Act 1997. Provided these scrotes have engaged in their threats on at least two occasions, you can apply to the county court for an ex parte (without notice) injunction to legally restrain the scrotes. I would strongly advise you to ask a legal professional to assist you with this. On the day you apply for the injunction or the next working day, you must submit a claim to the court for any anxiety the scrotes have caused, plus any financial loss you have incurred as a result of their behaviour. Please bear in mind that such an injunction can only be granted to individuals, not companies. I'm attaching a copy of the Protection from Harassment Act 1997 and a PF39CH, which is the court form used to apply for an injunction.

[meerkatsmimm]

Re: Help with letting problem please

Hi Bluebottle,

Thank you for this - should I wait for them to follow through on any threat before applying for this, or is it best to make them aware that I will be applying for this through the county court, including for the loss of the nights revenue, loss of reputation/potential business revenue and legal costs should they decide to try and follow through with it?

By me making them aware that if they follow through with any of their ruinous threats against that this will be the result for them - in the hope of them deciding this is not the best thing to be doing - am I just as bad as them by using menace to get them to desist and could they turn the tables on us with the same thing?

As a family we feel the best thing to do is send an email making them aware we have taken legal advice (from yourselves at this stage ) and that we have spoken to the police to register a complaint. The person who is doing all the shouting at us via email also continues to keep dropping the name of the company she works for (we believe to show what a responsible, trusted and reliable person she is and also to scare us that she may have access to their social media - 60K people on facebook alone) and my husband feels with all of this name dropping, perhaps her employers should be contacted aswell to make them aware of the situation - incase she decides to use their social media links as a platform to try and destroy us.

The Police officer did say though that in his opinion, we were well within our rights to refuse entry on the basis of what we were presented with - he said that with no deposit, had we walked away the first time without returning, we would have been well within our rights. Is there a piece of law that covers this that we could quote? In so much as they failed to make any advance payment to 'secure' the property, so 'legally' we can not be held liable for refusal to allow entry?

Thanks again all, its a great support knowing I can share this.

[meerkatsmimm]

Re: Help with letting problem please

Well I think this is now all resolved.

Thanks to a very decent Police Constable, who read the emails in depth and took it upon himself to phone the person making the threats and she has had a change of heart by all accounts. She was simply 'venting her frustrations' but the officer basically put her straight that the fault lay with her and if her intention was to cause waves for us that we could do the same for her, including making her employers aware of her actions.

Thank you all for your sound and quick advice - you gave my family a great support at a time when it was seriously lacking.

[Sapphire]

Re: Help with letting problem please

Great news xxx

[Nikolai]

Re: Help with letting problem please

Glad to hear it's sorted. For what it's worth I think these people didn't have a leg to stand on, they were merely being obnoxious. You followed correct advice in reporting them.