Car hire deposit

[des8]

Re: Car hire deposit

Just had a quick look at season's online terms and conditions and can't see any mention of the condition that is in their printed contract. If you booked online you may have a chance on the basis the original contract didn't include that condition

[patelmas01]

Re: Car hire deposit

I have written to Natwest challenging the alleged evidence and filed a complaint with the Ombudsman. I told Natwest about the proposed legal action by the car hire company and stated it would be much fairer for a judge to decide as opposed to them, especially as the evidence of my alleged unlawful driving should be independently verifiable eg Is it issued by the Home Office and do they have calibration certificates. Further I also alleged that their terms are probably unfair as per UCTA and CCA. I again requested a refund of the £2k deposit and to suspend the amount in dispute until decided by the FOS.

Any further advice would be very much appreciated.

[Tools]

Re: Car hire deposit

Did they include a copy of the tracker report? If not request it, along with full details of the make, model, serial number and calibration certificates.

[Inca]

Re: Car hire deposit

Reading the speeding reports supplied I'm not surprised they think you broke the terms of the contract..which to even my untrained eye you blatantly did 105mph in a 50? Speeding in 30mph zones?

I'd be surprised if you got away with this and you can't call them 'scumbags' just because they want their money you agreed to pay IF you broke the terms of the contract.And the fact that it was a 'wedding'treat is purely academic I'm afraid.
Your bank clearly agrees with them.

[teaboy2]

Re: Car hire deposit

Jesus, some of those streets are residential, only about 100 metres long , not far from a school, with parking on one side making it single carriage way, just about. And your doing up to 70-90mphs on those streets and streets in the nearby area. Sorry but if you hire a sports car (Lamborghini LP560 Spider, capable of 0-60 in approximately 3.5 - 4 seconds), and IF you did do those speeds in such areas, then you don't deserve your deposit back.

[des8]

Re: Car hire deposit

NO can't agree with you there Teaboy
IF the speed limit was broken, the law takes its course, we don't operate a vigilante system in this country.
IF the contract was fair, and if it was broken, the hirer has a right to liquidated damages, not some dreamt up penalty charge (or at least that is what we say about parking management companies!)

[calamity jane]

Re: Car hire deposit

The figures in brackets are the km/h equivalent not the speed he was doing.


CJ

[Inca]

Re: Car hire deposit

There's a very faint print out of the logged speeds OP was doing....one def reads 105mph in a 50

I'm not standing in judgement of OP as I was caught speeding by the police and was guilty (97 on a 70)
IF,and it's only an 'IF' at this point..the small print does say what the company says it does..then it's a hard lesson learned.

[calamity jane]

Re: Car hire deposit

Sorry my mistake didn't look at the last document. Tried editing my post but computer said no.


CJ

[CleverClogs]

Re: Car hire deposit

Have looked back through postings and found copy of contract, which does say if the vehicle is driven in an unlawful manner the hirer accepts full responsibility for the total loss of the hirer's security deposit.

I am sure that the hirer might accept that, even though it would significantly exceed any genuine estimate of liquidated damages.

However, the manner of his driving has not been established to be unlawful.

Whether or not there is a loophole in that wording which you can exploit to recover your deposit, I regret I am not qualified to pronounce upon.

One hardly needs to be Nick Freeman (Mr Loophole - link) to see the flaw in that clause - it is not open to the hire company to determine what is or is not lawful. That is the job of a criminal court and not some money-grubbing car hire company.

Indeed, if the company really believes it has cast iron evidence of furious driving, it must surely be their public duty to present that evidence to the police. If they do not, then they become an accessory after the fact and could be charged with perverting the course of justice.

[CleverClogs]

Re: Car hire deposit

Please can you read the following letter from Natwest. Its very distressing and the 'alleged evidence' is the same as that sent to me by the car hire scums.

Ask NatWest to tell you by which criminal court you were convicted, and when.

[Inca]

Re: Car hire deposit

I was gonna mention the police Cloggy but thought I might spouting twaddle...then you mention it and it makes sense.............

[patelmas01]

Re: Car hire deposit

To all posters,

Thanks for your replies.

Those of you that have expressed concern over the 'claimed' speeding should understand that I completely and utterly refute the scumbag car hire company's claims. In fact I have now come across other individuals who have also had their deposits pinched for 'alleged' speeding. That fact is that their evidence has been accepted by Natwest purely because of Natwest Bank's complete inability to ask any meaningful questions unless prompted by me.

I initially managed to get an chargeback only after kicking up an almighty fuss. I must say the FOS's advice was excellent. They told me the type of letter I should write to Natwest and very soon my £2k was back in my account. It's now after SEVEN months that the scumbags have produced what they call 'evidence' which sadly Natwest again succumbed to. What were Scumbag & Co doing during that time? Why did they not reply to any of my requests asking for evidence? I'm sure a Judge would look at this and the time period as particularly galling, notwithstanding the fact that their evidence cannot stand up in a Court of Law, anyhow!

Anyone can make up these tracking records, Scumbag & Co. had my address and I am told the owner lives in the same vicinity. They have given no evidence of the devices they use, the date of install, the manufacturing certofocates, the calibration data blah blah blah. So many cases have been thrown out of Court when local authorities and even the Police have failed to produce satisfactory certification for their monitoring devices, I remember a famous lawyer who represented Premier league footballers who managed to get many of his client's off a speeding charge on this very ground.

In any case I will fight this all the way, even if the FOS ultimately decides not to force Natwest to pay me back under section 75. I will launch a Small Claim in Court to really Scumbag & Co in the dock. After all I don't have much more to lose. They are arbitrarily stealing people's hard earned money and they don't give a damn. When did they have the power to deem something unlawful?

The fact is that Scumbag and Co tried to scare me by threatening legal action knowing they don't have a leg to stand on. They don't have the required calibration certificates because ONLY Government bodies are allowed to have such certified devices installed and monitored. If they are allowed to get away with such scams, what chance have we got if other car hire firms/private companies want to do the same. It would be understandable if I had received a speeding fine or the like to back up their claims, but can anyone put any faith in a private company deciding what is unlawful and what is not? Not me thanks!

I hope that explains my side of the story. Any other comments positive or negative are very much welcome.

I will of course keep you posted on the FOS complaint.

Pat

[Amethyst]

Re: Car hire deposit

Are the locations and times correct on their 'evidence' ?
Are there traffic control cameras, cctv ? or speed traps in any of those areas ?

For instance Ingleby Road, Ilford - could you even get up to 75mph along there ? It's a short road. I have no idea how fast these kind of cars accelerate but think 75mph down there would be quite tricky without being completely insane.

If you map out the points in order, on the 10th, it's a bit of a pointless route, unless you were just burning about the streets showing off the lambo

[CleverClogs]

Re: Car hire deposit

They are arbitrarily stealing people's hard earned money and they don't give a damn.

First Rule of Acquisition (link)

When did they have the power to deem something unlawful?

They don't have that power and have never had such a power.

capita eorum sunt plenis stercorum, as one might say. :nerd: