Rongo

[Rongo]

I have ongoing civil claim which I applied for as Negligence and damages.

Defendant applied to have case struck out and costs, I was representing myself (LiP). The Judge said there was a case to answer, but awarded them costs against me.

For various reason at time of this I had nowhere to live and asked other side to allow time for me to prepare. Papers had gone missing. Anyway they ignored me. I appealed and have been told I have to pay the costs. I said but my case is still negligence, but tort in deceit. He said because Judge had told me to alter my claim, as couldn't get damaged for negligence.

There is no different evidence I just applied for damages instead of difference between value! Which I believed was correct to apply for damages. I got it wrong. I have discovered in meantime that the Defendant hid the fact he had covered up original negligence following us writing and asking him the questions"there appears to be a sewer" and "what was gate in corner of property for". He asked about "gate" but not sewer. He also, I now know, wrote within 3 days of us asking him to check if was a sewer and he asked Vendor for Requisitions on Title in Duplicate, and TR1 to proceed towards completion from. Only two copies of Official Title Documents ever requested from Land Registry and that was by Vendors solicitor prior to us receiving our Contract letter from our Solicitor. The Letter asking for "requisitions on title in duplicate" was made 7 weeks after our Solicitor had obtained the Searches from Searchflow, using what I now know was wrong Title Plan obtained with an Ordnance Survey Licence Number. Which the Defendant has now put me to strict proof as to where document came from. I have pointed out the Licence number to them.

Can I ask them was it their Number and if not whose/where did it come from? Or just wait to get to court and ask.

They have been uncooperative in giving details. I Have been told to apply to amend my claim. No change in facts, only extra evidence is the recent confirmation by Land Registry that Vendors applied for Official Title Copies on 6th April 2006, and this was only 6 days prior to our Contract letter from Our Solicitor. Land Registry only had this one application from anyone relating to prior to our completion/registration. I also learnt recently after complaint to firm that the Vendors were paying off the mortgage themselves at same time and that their Solicitor had sent ours an "office copy" which he would hand over the Official on completion but this TP1 confirming repaying of mortgage by Vendors was not completed until end of September 2006 we completed in July 2006, and this failure I have learned meant our Title was not registered officially until October 2006.

We were told none of this prior to completion nor after we received the "Completed" file. So even if we had realised we were trapped! It is not normal for your own Solicitor not to obtain Official Title Plan Documents at the beginning in order to obtain Correct Searches. He stated in his Contract letter that "he personally would be handling our Purchase. He enclosed a document required by us to confirm that we would notify of anything which could affect the Lenders agreeing to providing the mortgage. That's why we asked our Solicitor to check if there was a sewer when someone said they thought there was one.

By time paid costs will be homeless again in New Year.

I now have to urgently apply to amend my statement of claim. How do I do this. Plus have to apply for Case Management hearing how is this done?

would be grateful for pointers as to how to do this.

[Amethyst]

Re: Rongo

Did the Judge give an Order for you to amend your claim or has he told you to apply to amend ?

Here's the practice direction on amendment https://www.justice.gov.uk/courts/pr...rt17/pd_part17 and the rules are https://www.justice.gov.uk/courts/pr...l/rules/part17

If you have to apply then it's form N244 and an application fee of £255 or £100. Copy to the defendant. You need to include your amended statement of case - if you're amending odd bits then you should strike through old wording and underline new/replacement wording.

Can I ask them was it their Number and if not whose/where did it come from?

You can do that via Part 18 request for information -

Part 18 - Further Information
Practice Direction 18

Other than that have you taken any legal advice before bringing the claim ?
Do you know what you need to be amending the statement of case to ?
How much approx is the claim for?

[Rongo]

Re: Rongo

I did but no one picked up the facts that the Title was actually registered using a different plan to the one he got searches with.

This even after we had asked him to check if was a sewer and he said there wasn't!

To any experienced Conveyancing Solicitor the Search with water board stated where question was asked " is there a sewer within 30 meters it didn't say "No" it said "see plan" I know now, but didn't then, what that means as we didn't study it. We trusted him..

As said we signed Document for Lender stating we would declare anything that could affect the Value. Which we asked him to check. He said on phone, none according to searches which is what he wrote against our sewer question (the only hand written note by him proving what he told my husband is true!, this on second day during phone conversation.

Phone notes on same day of our Sewer question and next day, show that despite him stating "he didn't know how the matter was dealt with at the time, after we had asked in writing, he did know. He stuck to this when I complained in 2015 almost 10 years later. That he had checked file and no sewer according to search, despite having copy of wrong original "Plan" he used to apply for Searches, which was not used to register title with and a copy of the Correct Title Plan he obtained 7 weeks after searches having been done with wrong plan and the Plan he Registered at Land Registry.

He also in reply to my 2015 complaint added the words "for your consideration" having stated that in original confirmation letter that all searches ok and happy to report no sewer crossed property! (dated 22/05/2006) stated "We have pleasure in enclosing herewith copy of the water mains and sewer records for your information. He added (and consideration) to this sentence in 2015. Which by saying he had written ( for you information and consideration) altered the context. We did not understand the Searches. He did not explain them.

First sight of Official Land registry title plan November 2006. Completion date July 24/2006. That was his job to read and interpret them. We had to employ a Conveyancing Solicitor as condition of getting Bank Loan. We were not "Developers" who could understand. As I have said I don't take my car for a service and strip it back to see if the job has been done. We even asked him to ask Vendors to stop people parking who were not using pub, as a friend had had a problem with people claiming rights.

He asked that Question, but not one about "sewer". He asked lots of them but not sewer!

have discovered that the Document he has put me to "strict proof" is a discontinued Ordnance Survey Licence Number. The Vendors Solicitor went bust in 2012, having struggled for some time! This document should I know now, never have been used. It is impossible for any person of ordinary intelligence to believe this was accidental as it was not normal not to obtain Official Title Plan to obtain searches with. Nor to agree to Vendor paying off their mortgage whilst we were trying to buy!

I believe I can show the 4 elements starting with "knowingly or recklessly, he then denied the facts that he knew and which led us to sign the Contract and we suffered loss. My husband died in 2011 after short illness, my Mother had also died, and my Brother. All within 9 months. I put property on market immediately but had not one Viewing in approx 4 years. Small plots where you could build 2/3 houses around the area went quickly. Not this because I now know local builders knew about sewer.

I then decided to develop it myself, not aware of sewer. Applied 2014 for planning to make pub a house. To stop anyone complaining about loss of amenity. Which is what people within pub trade often faced when though pub not used by locals, they would object. Obtained it. Then applied to demolish and build 3 detached. Without sewer would have built first and sold to finance rest.

Objections by locals because they were worried about the "Flood Defence" sewer. Delay it long enough to make my situation worse. I had used most of my inheritance to pay outgoings and keep afloat. Had to put up for Auction to stop going bust. Borrowed £4000.00 to keep afloat. Down to last £1000.00 when moved out on 17th December 2015. Couldn't afford to buy a house. as sold for less than paid.

How can anyone say was merely "negligence". Which is basically a "mistake", accidental. He ignored all normal Conveyancing procedure. Long established even then and I maintain, because he could have been struck off then because he had broken SRA client responsibility rules and put the Vendor, their Solicitor and his own needs first. Instead he covered up what he did to avoid any consequences.

It all seems glaringly obvious with hindsight, but we trusted him!

[Amethyst]

Re: Rongo

Okay so the conveyancer/solicitor didn't find that there was a flood defence sewer on the property when you purchased it, because of negligence ( applying to LR on the wrong details?) and you only found out when you tried to obtain permission to build houses on the land ?


Did you make formal complaints to the conveyancer / legal ombudsman etc before resorting to court action ? If so what happened ?

[Rongo]

Re: Rongo

I complained in December 2015 and received acknowledgement of my complaint from a solicitor who no longer works at the Firm. She replied on solicitors' behalf and his reply was that he had retrieved file and checked it and that as before search showed no sewer running through the property and that therefore they were not liable. No Solicitor could have missed the Difference in Title Plan Registered and Plan used to get Searches from Search flow, at any time as Search made on "Building" only not the whole property. When I wrote in 2015 I did not know that new law came in where Solicitors have to inform clients as soon as possible if they complain about something where to get advice I.e Ombudsman. I discovered in 2017 that he should have told me. I spoke to Trading Standards officer and he said that the Tone of his letter would imply to an ordinary person that it was end of "first stage" and that he should have told me who to contact in that letter in 6January 2016. I understand they received a visit or letter from Trading Standards about notifying Customers of address to contact for info. So I did not contact Ombudsman. I did after I had begun proceedings which of course too late. SRA said I didn't have enough info for them to act!

I have just received response from Ordnance Survey, I sent photo copy of the application to Searchflow which has Ordnance Survey licence No. Which they say was registered to English Heritage!! Which is no longer in use! I understand that anyone involved with injustice can become blind to actual "facts" but correct me if I'm wrong, they knew when they applied for searches. Thank you for your interest. Much appreciated.