help for a friend with no internet, regarding racism accusation

[mysticphoenix666]

Hi,

I have a friend at work who has been accused of racism.

She was having a conversation with another colleague about when they were at school and inappropriately used the shortened term for a person from pakistan, she never meant no offense by the discussion and it wasn't aimed at the person who has since put in a grievance against her.

The person who has lodged the complaint never actually heard the discussion but was told by another colleague (not sure if it was to cause problems), this person then proceeded to move across the room to shout and swear at my friend in front of all the other staff and say how they was disgusted with her and that they would of expected it from the younger staff but not her. She promptly apologised as she never realised at the time she had said the term, this was ignored and they continued shouting and swearing at her until eventually the manager on duty intervened and made the offended party sit back down.

She has now been suspended pending an investigation due to the complaint, she was not informed it was a grievance meeting until she was in the room, she wasn't given a copy of the procedure or allowed get hers from her desk before she was escorted from the office by the manager in front of all the other staff on duty including the person who put the complaint in.

She has asked me to request some advice on her behalf as to whether she should of been escorted out in that manner and also whether the other party should of been suspended whilst the investigation happens. Also she would like to know of she has any rights in regards to this matter and whether she is allowed to see the other parties statement and witness statements?

Thanks

[FlamingParrot]

Re: help for a friend with no internet, regarding racism accusation

She has now been suspended pending an investigation due to the complaint, she was not informed it was a grievance meeting until she was in the room, she wasn't given a copy of the procedure or allowed get hers from her desk before she was escorted from the office by the manager in front of all the other staff on duty including the person who put the complaint in.

She has asked me to request some advice on her behalf as to whether she should of been escorted out in that manner and also whether the other party should of been suspended whilst the investigation happens.

All this is fairly standard, I went through all that 10 years ago (not for alleged racism, something totally different, but same process). By the other party, do you mean the person who complained? Normally they wouldn't be suspended, the suspension is intended to remove the individual from the work environment to allow them to investigate freely, in this case, presumably to speak with other members of staff with regards to whether she routinely makes similar comments and her general behaviour.

Has a disciplinary been scheduled?

Also she would like to know of she has any rights in regards to this matter and whether she is allowed to see the other parties statement and witness statements?

Thanks

That would depend on how long she's been working for her current employers, if less than two years, they could dismiss quite easily. If she's been there more than two years, they would have to make a solid case to avoid a claim of unfair dismissal.

You may want to take a look at the ACAS site: http://www.acas.org.uk/index.aspx?articleid=3733

New qualifying period for unfair dismissals

From 6 April 2012, the qualifying period for unfair dismissal clams will increase from the current one year to two years, as part of the Government's drive to streamline the employment tribunal process.
These proposals mean that employees who start work on or after 6 April 2012 will, in most cases, have to complete two years' service with their employer before they can make a claim for unfair dismissal. These changes are expected to cut the number of unfair dismissal claims by just over 3,000 claims a year.

In certain circumstances, however, dismissals will automatically be considered to be unfair, and employees will not be required to have two years' service before making a claim. These include dismissals for reasons such as pregnancy or maternity leave, trades union membership, whistleblowing, reporting health and safety risks or assertion of statutory rights. These exceptions are all set out in the Employment Rights Act 1996.

[mysticphoenix666]

Re: help for a friend with no internet, regarding racism accusation

Thank you all for your help so far.

apparently they are going to write to her with a meeting date, she has forwarded her own complaint in response regarding the way the other party confronted her in an aggressive and confrontational manner, i would of thought as this was done then both parties would be suspended.

Neither party have been with the company long they both started at the same time in June.

The reason she asked if they should be suspended is that some of her colleagues have stated that the person that complained are only telling them half a story and leaving out their behavior, which she thinks is going to impair some peoples judgement when it comes to the investigation.

[charitynjw]

Re: help for a friend with no internet, regarding racism accusation

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/culture/c...be-racism.html

http://www.oxforddictionaries.com/de...n/english/Paki

AFAIK, unless the term was used in a disparaging way, or in away which was directly or indirectly discriminate (ie put a person, or group of persons at a disadvantage), it will not be racial discrimination as per the Equality Act 2010.

That said, there may be a specific company policy regarding this, which ought then to be available to employees.

[FlamingParrot]

Re: help for a friend with no internet, regarding racism accusation

AFAIK, unless the term was used in a disparaging way, or in away which was directly or indirectly discriminate (ie put a person, or group of persons at a disadvantage), it will not be racial discrimination as per the Equality Act 2010.

That said, there may be a specific company policy regarding this, which ought then to be available to employees.

Sadly, the person in question has only been with the company a few months, which leaves them with very little in the way of employment rights. :sad:

Thank you all for your help so far.

apparently they are going to write to her with a meeting date, she has forwarded her own complaint in response regarding the way the other party confronted her in an aggressive and confrontational manner, i would of thought as this was done then both parties would be suspended.

Neither party have been with the company long they both started at the same time in June.

[charitynjw]

Re: help for a friend with no internet, regarding racism accusation

Sadly, the person in question has only been with the company a few months, which leaves them with very little in the way of employment rights. :sad:

Hi FP,

I wasn't suggesting going down the 'unfair dismissal' route; as you rightly point out, the qualifying period of employment (2 years) will not be met.
I was just suggesting the possible 'defenses' re the complaint of racism for the forthcoming meeting.

[CleverClogs]

Re: help for a friend with no internet, regarding racism accusation

Sadly, the person in question has only been with the company a few months, which leaves them with very little in the way of employment rights. :sad:

Does the alleged p:censored:i have greater rights?

[FlamingParrot]

Re: help for a friend with no internet, regarding racism accusation

Does the alleged p:censored:i have greater rights?

I reckon they would have, yes. That's usually the case. The 2 year rule doesn't apply where discrimination is concerned.

[mysticphoenix666]

Re: help for a friend with no internet, regarding racism accusation

Thank you for your continued assistance,

I don't think the the other party should have any more rights than my friend as they both started the job at the same time, i have already looked up the definition in the dictionary as i thought she may be able to bring it up in her meeting as she used it in the same way as a shortened version of the word just like you would reference a "brit" or "dane". it was not aimed specifically at the person that complained nor was it said about them, apparently they never heard the initial conversation but were told about it by someone that did.

[charitynjw]

Re: help for a friend with no internet, regarding racism accusation

Unfortunately employers only require 'reasonable suspicion' of wrongdoing to initiate disciplinary proceedings.
However, the keyword is 'reasonable'.

Has the employer dealt with your friend's grievance letter? (They can run grievance & disciplinary procedures concurrently)

[mysticphoenix666]

Re: help for a friend with no internet, regarding racism accusation

Not that she is aware of yet but she didn't hand it in seperately it went down on her statement that she made in the meeting but she has been told they are going to deal with this also.

[charitynjw]

Re: help for a friend with no internet, regarding racism accusation

If it were me, I would submit a written grievance (if not already done - see post #3 - 'forwarding her own complaint'?).

Are there any witnesses to the incident who are prepared to come forward?

[FlamingParrot]

Re: help for a friend with no internet, regarding racism accusation

I don't think the the other party should have any more rights than my friend as they both started the job at the same time, i have already looked up the definition in the dictionary as i thought she may be able to bring it up in her meeting as she used it in the same way as a shortened version of the word just like you would reference a "brit" or "dane". it was not aimed specifically at the person that complained nor was it said about them, apparently they never heard the initial conversation but were told about it by someone that did.

My comment referred to Clever Clogs post which, despite being a bit of a joke in Cloggy's unique style (his humour does grow on you after a while :grin, reflected a fact of life: that people who belong to certain groups (including, but not limited to, ethnic minorities), often have more rights. In other words, it's generally more acceptable to call someone "white trash" (I'm white, by the way, so no offence intended), than to use equivalent terms to refer to people of other ethnic groups. :ohwell: We're not all 'equal' under "Equal Rights"! :whistle:

[charitynjw]

Re: help for a friend with no internet, regarding racism accusation

My comment referred to Clever Clogs post which, despite being a bit of a joke in Cloggy's unique style (his humour does grow on you after a while :grin, reflected a fact of life: that people who belong to certain groups (including, but not limited to, ethnic minorities), often have more rights. In other words, it's generally more acceptable to call someone "white trash" (I'm white, by the way, so no offence intended), than to use equivalent terms to refer to people of other ethnic groups. :ohwell: We're not all 'equal' under "Equal Rights"! :whistle:

Could the playing field be levelled a bit?
Was the colleague (who mp666's friend was talking to) female or male?
Has any action been taken re the male who reacted to hearsay?
(& I do realise about the 2-year rule :tinysmile_twink_t2

[enquirer]

Re: help for a friend with no internet, regarding racism accusation

We're not all 'equal' under "Equal Rights"!

Animal Farm has never been more appropriate.