New Court Claim Form Sent to Wrong Address

[warwick65]

Re: New Court Claim Form Sent to Wrong Address

The defence should be filed to the court and can be done online

I believe you should also send a copy to the solicitors but I am told the court also do this

[charitynjw]

Re: New Court Claim Form Sent to Wrong Address

I would be including the fact you sent a CIA request which has not been complied with .....

Blimey, Warwick, are they gunning after Arrow as well??!!

[Andy202]

Re: New Court Claim Form Sent to Wrong Address

I sent CCA and CPR letters. The claimant hasn't responded to the CCA. The solicitor has replied – again to the wrong address even though I put the correct address on my letter – but they're refusing to supply any documents. They state that:


We would point out that the Claim was issued via the County Court Business Centre which is a procedure specifically provided for in the CPR. This procedure only allows a Claimant to insert brief details of the Claim and does not allow for the attachment of any enclosures. Paragraph 5.2A of Practice Direction 7E specifically states "The requirement of paragraph 7.3 of Practice Direction 16 for documents to be attached to the particulars of contract claims does not apply to claims started using an online claim form, unless the particulars of claim are served separately in accordance with paragraph 5.2 of this practice direction.

We would also remind you that CPR 31.14 states: 'A party may inspect a document mentioned in: a) a statement of case; b) a witness statement; c) a witness summary; d) an affidavit.'

You would have been provided with a copy of the contractual Terms and Conditions at the time the account was opened and hence we see no reason why you now require an additional copy.

Furthermore, the other documents you have requested [Deed of Assignment, etc] are not 'mentioned' in the Particulars of Claim and therefore CPR 31.14(1) does not apply.

Although your letter states that you require the requested documents in order to file a Defence / Counterclaim, we would point out that the Particulars of Claim contains sufficient information in order for you to understand what the Claim relates to, namely: a) the date the account was opened; b) the account number; c) the outstanding balance; d) the name of the original creditor; e) the fact that the account has been assigned to the Claimant and when it was assigned.


I fully expect the Claimant won't respond at all, especially since their solicitor has now replied. Any ideas on how I should proceed?

Now, I can partly relate to some of this with my own case, with regards to the particulars of the claim surely weather or not that they have filed the claim online and only have limited space and no way to add attachments to include the particulars of the claim is of little to no defense to not provide the particulars of the claim separately!. As CPR 7.4 is quite clear in that if the particulars of the claim is not served with the claim itself, that they then still have to be served on the defendant by the claimant within a set time. Particulars of claim

7.4
(1) Particulars of claim must –
(a) be contained in or served with the claim form; or
(b) subject to paragraph (2) be served on the defendant by the claimant within 14 days after service of the claim form.

So surely the above also covers for claims issued online and so a defense by a claimant of limited space and inability to attach the particulars of the claim is invalid as they should still send them separate anyway?.

[charitynjw]

Re: New Court Claim Form Sent to Wrong Address

Now, I can partly relate to some of this with my own case, with regards to the particulars of the claim surely weather or not that they have filed the claim online and only have limited space and no way to add attachments to include the particulars of the claim is of little to no defense to not provide the particulars of the claim separately!. As CPR 7.4 is quite clear in that if the particulars of the claim is not served with the claim itself, that they then still have to be served on the defendant by the claimant within a set time. Particulars of claim

7.4
(1) Particulars of claim must –
(a) be contained in or served with the claim form; or
(b) subject to paragraph (2) be served on the defendant by the claimant within 14 days after service of the claim form.

So surely the above also covers for claims issued online and so a defense by a claimant of limited space and inability to attach the particulars of the claim is invalid as they should still send them separate anyway?.

CPR 7E
5.2 Detailed particulars of claim must either be –
(1) included in the online claim form but must be limited in size to not more than 1080 characters (including spaces); or
(2) served and filed by the claimant separately from the claim form in accordance with paragraph 6 but the claimant must – .........(etc)

[Andy202]

Re: New Court Claim Form Sent to Wrong Address

So it could come down to if the claimant or court considers the particulars of claim to have been detailed to a sufficient level in the claim form then?. If disputable they have failed to do so and have not complied with the provision to send particulars of claim separately within the required timescale then?.

[warwick65]

Re: New Court Claim Form Sent to Wrong Address

My thoughts on it, and purely based on what I have seen happen

The courts tend to let the claimants get away with quite a lot however if the defendant follows all the procedures and can prove it, should they win, they might and I mean just might, get costs awarded in their favour although I am told some Judges think you have got away with not paying a debt and therefore you should just be bloody grateful.

Wrong I know, but until the glorious revolution followed by my benign dictatorship , it is what we have to put up with.

[charitynjw]

Re: New Court Claim Form Sent to Wrong Address

[MENTION=101678]monkeybus[/MENTION]

Have you acknowledged the court claim yet?

[monkeybus]

Re: New Court Claim Form Sent to Wrong Address

Yes, I acknowledged the claim online.

MB

[charitynjw]

Re: New Court Claim Form Sent to Wrong Address

At the moment, all the claimant is required to put on the claim particulars in these types of cases is a concise statement of facts and details of interest being claimed.

However, I'm told* that this is about to change soon.


*Told by El Presidente [MENTION=98117]warwick65[/MENTION]

"Viva La Revolución!"

[Andy202]

Re: New Court Claim Form Sent to Wrong Address

My thoughts on it, and purely based on what I have seen happen

The courts tend to let the claimants get away with quite a lot however if the defendant follows all the procedures and can prove it, should they win, they might and I mean just might, get costs awarded in their favour although I am told some Judges think you have got away with not paying a debt and therefore you should just be bloody grateful.

Wrong I know, but until the glorious revolution followed by my benign dictatorship , it is what we have to put up with.

It seems a somewhat warped abuse of the legal process that the more of these types of cases I'm reading about it involves a hell of a lot of non compliance of the correct legal procedures and process by claimants. And in the absence of the defendant realising this and pointing it out to a court or judge who should see this, may well let the claimant get away with it and find in their favour as a result!.

But good luck to monkeybus all the same, I'm certainly going to push the issue of particulars of claim provision in online filed cases in my upcoming hearing this week as part of my defense and see what the judge says with regards to it. As it seems to me claimants are using the often touted defence of not enough space to include the particulars of claim, yet ignore that if there is not enough space that they are supposed to either send them separate with a filed certificate of service or provide them upon a separate request from the defendant under the same timescales.

[charitynjw]

Re: New Court Claim Form Sent to Wrong Address

It seems a somewhat warped abuse of the legal process that the more of these types of cases I'm reading about it involves a hell of a lot of non compliance of the correct legal procedures and process by claimants. And in the absence of the defendant realising this and pointing it out to a court or judge who should see this, may well let the claimant get away with it and find in their favour as a result!.

But good luck to monkeybus all the same, I'm certainly going to push the issue of particulars of claim provision in online filed cases in my upcoming hearing this week as part of my defense and see what the judge says with regards to it. As it seems to me claimants are using the often touted defence of not enough space to include the particulars of claim, yet ignore that if there is not enough space that they are supposed to either send them separate with a filed certificate of service or provide them upon a separate request from the defendant under the same timescales.

This has been addressed somewhat with the introduction of a new Pre-Action Protocol due, I believe, this coming October.

[Andy202]

Re: New Court Claim Form Sent to Wrong Address

And sadly until then it's down to the public who don't realise they are often victims of abuse of the legal process by claimants to either put up with a system courts must realise claimants are abusing or look into the process and argue the matters in court themselves!.

Charitynjw, is there a link or anything clarifying what the new Pre Action Protocol contains yet by any chance?

[MIKE770]

Re: New Court Claim Form Sent to Wrong Address

Final version of debt pre-action protocol released—in force 1 October ...

blogs.lexisnexis.co.uk/.../final-version-of-debt-pre-action-protocol-released-in-force-...

[monkeybus]

Re: New Court Claim Form Sent to Wrong Address

Do I have to wait the full 12 working days from sending the CCA request to file a defence? Or should I just do it now?

[charitynjw]

Re: New Court Claim Form Sent to Wrong Address

You have 33 days from the court claim issue date to file your defence.
You can agree with the Claimant to extend this by a further 28 days; if you do agree, you (Defendant) have to notify the court.
The 12 day window for the CCA request is a separate issue which doesn't influence the court timetable.