German Court fine

[ukracer]

Re: German Court fine

This is the first we know of the German driver suing my son. I am guessing/assuming this will be dealt with by the Insurance company who although wriggling out of paying for our car still cover us for third party liability??

Until the German authorities send me anything in English I dont know what they are saying!

I have found out yesterday who the Insurers in the UK are who will be dealing with the claim. Esure (my insurance company) are like a chocolate teapot but what they have told me is they are asking for is the other drivers account of what he alleges happened as no one has seen that yet. WE did have a no win no fee company who was going to take my sons case and his passengers BUT they have said they wont take it if he is found guilty by the German courts. So you can see I am pretty hoping mad about justice just now.

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The German driver's claim should be being handled by the insurers under third party liability section of policy (which is mandatory in Germany)

This is what I am led to understand. And as such have instructed us NOT to accept liability...although we maintain that stance anyway.

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This is a cover letter from your sons 'legal council' in Germany (just saying that she's sending the docs) ... he should contact her asking if his bail money will be returned (there's nothing in the docs I've seen that says either way )

Yes this is getting us angry. No one will answer the questions of is that money going to be returned when/if we pay the fine. Can he pay the fine but dispute liability etc etc etc

I have tried to use Google translate to ask that question but have sent it to the police. We were not aware my son had legal council.. what does that mean exactly.

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Thanks again for all this Kati.

and anyone else replying.

Regards Andy T

[des8]

Re: German Court fine

The difficulty is that the German model is quite different to the UK.
For a start in Germany strict liability attaches to a driver of a vehicle that is involved in a motor accident even if that driver is not at fault. However there is also fault based liability.
And it goes downhill from then on as the criminal and civil actions can become interwined.

You might find a read of this article useful http://fevr.org/wp-content/uploads/2...rd-GERMANY.pdf .

You need to be guided by your insurers (but remember the person you deal with in the UK may well have less knowledge about German Procedures than you).
Your insurers will have a representative in Germany (required by EU directives) who deals with this, and there will be delays incommunicating

[ukracer]

Re: German Court fine

The difficulty is that the German model is quite different to the UK.
For a start in Germany strict liability attaches to a driver of a vehicle that is involved in a motor accident even if that driver is not at fault.

This is what I cant get my head round. Does this mean we have to pay the fine whatever happens and it does not mean we are admitting liability? lol

AND that the other driver will also have received this fine??

[des8]

Re: German Court fine

I'm not sure (Although I dealt with overseas insurance it did not include motor), but think what your son has paid is a fixed on the spot penalty for a strict liability offence.
We do have similar liability rules in the UK eg round health and safety rules.
Whether the fine is recoverable I haven't yet worked out(and possibly never will)
He is not however admitting fault.

[ukracer]

Re: German Court fine

I'm not sure (Although I dealt with overseas insurance it did not include motor), but think what your son has paid is a fixed on the spot penalty for a strict liability offence.
We do have similar liability rules in the UK eg round health and safety rules.
Whether the fine is recoverable I haven't yet worked out(and possibly never will)
He is not however admitting fault.

WE have not paid it yet as we cant find out if it taken from the 1000 he has already paid as a bond , or has to be paid on top of that and get a full refund of the 1000 or no refund at all.

PLus the liability issue .....

Nightmare....I for one will never set foot abroad ever again,.

[ADDLED]

Re: German Court fine

"....I for one will never set foot abroad ever again"

That's exactly what my old Grandad said after his run-in with the Germans in the 1940s.

[Kati]

Re: German Court fine

on an off chance, you could try calling the German Embassy for clarification on the 1000 euros??
http://www.uk.diplo.de/Vertretung/un...tartseite.html

[Kati]

Re: German Court fine

I'm waiting for a 'written' translation of this sheet (which tells you what you can do appeal-wise ) xx

[Kati]

Re: German Court fine

This is a cover letter from your sons 'legal council' in Germany (just saying that she's sending the docs) ... he should contact her asking if his bail money will be returned (there's nothing in the docs I've seen that says either way )

Bit of research done here @ukracer ... Looks like you may be in luck!!
If you contact this lady (your sons' legal council) accepting the 128.5 Euro fine, you should be able to get the rest of the 1000 Euro 'bail' back

[ukracer]

Re: German Court fine

thanks Kati. I have been ill for a day or so. back onto it now.

[ukracer]

Re: German Court fine

Bit of research done here @ukracer ... Looks like you may be in luck!!
If you contact this lady (your sons' legal council) accepting the 128.5 Euro fine, you should be able to get the rest of the 1000 Euro 'bail' back

Hi Kati

sorry for late reply but my wife has been called up for a PIP review as her lifetime award of DLA is being stopped and I really struggle with the stress of it all as she really does not realise how serious it all is and that they are doing anything they can to reduce peoples benefits.

I now have the tablets working again so feel a lot better to face all the other crap that circles me daily.

The lady you mention what is that number to contact her on as I dont see an email but I cant read that number fully.

THanks again.

[Kati]

Re: German Court fine

It's Frau Krayer you need to contact:

[ukracer]

Re: German Court fine

It's Frau Krayer you need to contact:

cheers. will try tommorow..

[Kati]

Re: German Court fine

cheers. will try tommorow..

Fingers crossed for your wife's PIP review xx