ARROW GLOBAL LIMITED v GIZMO&LOGAN

**Guest** · 9th July 2016, 13:20:PM

Re: ARROW GLOBAL LIMITED v GIZMO&LOGAN

Originally posted by Gizmo&Logan View Post

Hello all,

Sadly I have the need to ask for some assistance with a recent County Court Claim that landed on my doormat this morning...

I have filed an AOS using the online MCOL service today.

Issue Date:
06/07/2016

Claimant:
ARROW GLOBAL LIMITED
20-22 BEDFORD ROW
LONDON
WC1R 4JS

Address to send documents:
RESTONS SOLICITORS LIMITED
TRINITY CHAMBERS
800 MANDARIN COURT
WA1 1GG

Particulars of Claim:
The claimant claims payment of the overdue balance due from the Defendant under a contract between the defendant and HSBC dated on or about Dec 23 1998 and assigned to the claimant on Mar 28 2014.
Particulars a/c no - XXXXXX/XXXXXXXX
Date 16/02/2016 Item Default Balance Value 293.76
Post Refrl Cr Nil
Total 293.76

I have checked my credit report (through Clear Score) and do not recognise this debt as it is not included on the report.
I have ordered my £2 report from Experian which should arrive in the next week and will check this also.

What I am confused about is the fact that this was from 1998 and only now in 2016 are they calling this in, is that even allowed?
As I have already stated above, I have filed my AOS and wish to fully defend this claim with a view to seeking further confirmation from the claimant that I owe this money.

1998 would be the date when you opened the account, and there is no limitation regarding account opening dates.

What matters is how long ago you last made a payment into this account. From the particulars of claim, it looks like an overdraft on a current account you had with HSBC. If so, do you recall when you last used this account? With overdrafts, the limitation period starts to run when the bank recalls the overdraft rather than the date of last payment. With small amounts like this that often build up purely from bank charges, that may not be for several months or even a year.

If there's nothing on your credit report, it could be because the default was recorded over six years ago. That doesn't necessarily mean the debt is statute barred though. You need to find out a bit more about the history of this account.

Originally posted by Gizmo&Logan View Post

Any assistance about what to do next will be greatly appreciated, also I'm worried now because in 30 days I fly to America and wonder if when I get back I might have missed an opportunity to prevent this being filed against me by default.

Any assistance is truly welcome.

Thanks in advance.

R

You will need to submit a defence before you fly, you have 28 days from date on claim (+5 extra days for service) to file it. If this was a current account, the CCA request would not apply but you could still send the CPR 31.14 request, even when Restons will argue it's going to be a small claim and does not apply.

In the event judgment against you was entered because you didn't file a defence in time, you could still pay it in full within one month to avoid it going on record. It's worth taking this into account with relatively small amounts like this one, because a CCJ can seriously impact many parts of your life and not just obtaining credit in the future.

I'd start looking at whether this debt could be statute barred, that means six years without payment or written acknowledgment, from the time HSBC recalled the overdraft (I'm going on the assumption this was an O/D unless you know otherwise).

**Gizmo&Logan** · 10th July 2016, 08:59:AM

Re: ARROW GLOBAL LIMITED v GIZMO&LOGAN

Hello Spieges,

Thanks for the quick reply, it's so refreshing to know there are volunteers willing to help absolute strangers, my faith in humanity is restored.

I can confirm this account was set up before the age of 18, so there wasn't an O/D facility available to me. I do remember back in 2005/06 opening a new account with HSBC with a view to moving all my Income/Outgoings as I was in dispute with Natwest over some unfair bank charges, but I never actually used it in the end. I do vaguely remember getting a letter from one company saying they couldn't collect a direct debit because it was rejected by the bank (I had switched this D/D over to HSBC, but then moved it back to Natwest after missed payment). Perhaps an oversight on my part for an unpaid direct debit charge? If this was true, then this is from 2006, so still 10 years ago.

I can also confirm I have never paid a bean to this debt, nor acknowledged it's existence. All the problems seem to have risen since getting a new credit card for my holiday, perhaps kicking a hornets nest from the past??

I will submit a CPR 31.14 accordingly, but not sure how to investigate the statue barred aspect (other than it's non existence from my credit report). Is there some form of template letter which I could request any information pertaining to me in respect of this debt?

I do take your point regarding paying off the debt, and would do so if I believed this was something that genuinely belonged to me and if it's being legally recovered and not just a debt collection agency 'winging it' in a hope that I ignore it.

Thank you again for taking the time to review this case, it's very much appreciated as it's one less stress to worry about before I fly to America with the family.

Thanks,

R

**Gizmo&Logan** · 14th July 2016, 16:36:PM

Re: ARROW GLOBAL LIMITED v GIZMO&LOGAN

Hello,

I've just confirmed my letter (CPR 31.14) to Restons has been received and signed for.

I've also done some deeper research on a previous credit report way back from 2008 which shows a default notice for a HSBC debt as 04/2008, but this was for a larger amount, other than that there are no other records on my credit report from old, or indeed nothing on the new report which I have again checked today.

I can also confirm I have not acknowledged nor paid towards the debt being claimed for, and wonder if this is statute barred as it's easily over 6 years!

Do I need to wait for a reply from Restons, or can I simply go straight in with a SB letter?

Thanks,

R

**Gizmo&Logan** · 22nd July 2016, 09:14:AM

Re: ARROW GLOBAL LIMITED v GIZMO&LOGAN

Good Morning 'Legal Beagles',

I've just got off the phone to Restons who have stated the following:

* They are not going to comply with the request I made as the letter wasn't signed
* If I require any details I need to formally request them attaching the appropriate fee
* They also stated the default was issued 7th April 2008 but last payment was made 18th August 2010 for £6.31

So in a nutshell, there is spurious payment for £6.31 of which I have never made so this is completely fabricated and curious how it falls just inside the 6 years before it becomes SB.

What should I use to request all the details from them and which fee is payable?

Also, how am I supposed to prove I haven't made a payment to them?

The stress levels are starting to rise now

Any help will be greatly appreciated.

Thanks

R

**Gizmo&Logan** · 22nd July 2016, 10:31:AM

Re: ARROW GLOBAL LIMITED v GIZMO&LOGAN

Also, for got to mention that they state this is an overdraft.

**Kati** · 22nd July 2016, 10:40:AM

Re: ARROW GLOBAL LIMITED v GIZMO&LOGAN

@nemesis45 @Amethyst [MENTION=87380]Diana M[/MENTION]

**nemesis45** · 22nd July 2016, 10:52:AM

Re: ARROW GLOBAL LIMITED v GIZMO&LOGAN

Originally posted by Gizmo&Logan View Post

Good Morning 'Legal Beagles',

I've just got off the phone to Restons who have stated the following:

* They are not going to comply with the request I made as the letter wasn't signed
* If I require any details I need to formally request them attaching the appropriate fee
* They also stated the default was issued 7th April 2008 but last payment was made 18th August 2010 for £6.31

So in a nutshell, there is spurious payment for £6.31 of which I have never made so this is completely fabricated and curious how it falls just inside the 6 years before it becomes SB.

What should I use to request all the details from them and which fee is payable?

Also, how am I supposed to prove I haven't made a payment to them?

The stress levels are starting to rise now

Any help will be greatly appreciated.

Thanks

R

Hi Restons client has to prove that such a payment was made and made by you or an authorised representative.

Did yo have an account with the original creditor + an overdraft??

nem

**Gizmo&Logan** · 22nd July 2016, 12:59:PM

Re: ARROW GLOBAL LIMITED v GIZMO&LOGAN

Originally posted by nemesis45 View Post

Hi Restons client has to prove that such a payment was made and made by you or an authorised representative.

Did yo have an account with the original creditor + an overdraft??

nem

Hello Nem,
Thanks for the quick reply.

I did have an account with HSBC but no overdraft facility. I have (to my knowledge) never made any payments to HSBC and definitely nothing to Arrow Global.

In terms of discovering this information, I do I compel Arrow/Restons to provide proof that a payment was made? Also, do I need to send a SAR to Restons?

Thanks,
R

**nemesis45** · 22nd July 2016, 13:50:PM

Re: ARROW GLOBAL LIMITED v GIZMO&LOGAN

Originally posted by Gizmo&Logan View Post

Hello Nem,
Thanks for the quick reply.

I did have an account with HSBC but no overdraft facility. I have (to my knowledge) never made any payments to HSBC and definitely nothing to Arrow Global.

In terms of discovering this information, I do I compel Arrow/Restons to provide proof that a payment was made? Also, do I need to send a SAR to Restons?

Thanks,
R

Hello R,
You could send the following to Restons.

FAO The Principal Solicitor
Restons Solicitors.
usual address:

Date:

Ref: CC Claim No. :
Your Client Arrow Global.

Sir/Madam

I refer to a conversation with xxxxxxx of your staff and the claim that a payment of £x .xx was made to the alleged debt on date............................: Please note that I have not made any such payment nor have I authorised any 3rd party to make any payments at any time.

I am sure your are aware that the onus of providing unequivocal proof that any such payment was indeed made falls entirely upon your client, such proof must include : The exact date of payment, the method of payment i.e. debt card/ cheque/ postal order etc., and the name of the person making the alleged payment, please also provide the name of the company to which the alleged payment was made.
I am still awaiting the documents requested via CPR 31.14 I am sure you are aware that this still applies to this claim as it has not been allocated to any track.

For clarification I have not had an account with HSBC that had any form of overdraft facility and I require evidence of the existence any such account.

Therefore I maintain my stance that this alleged debt is statute barred no payment or written acknowledgment have been made by me I'm more than 6 years.

Yours etc.

A SAR will only provide data held by Restons since the account was passed to Restons likely to be very little waste of a tenner imo.

A call to HSBC may bring forth some info it's worth a try.

nem

**Gizmo&Logan** · 22nd July 2016, 14:06:PM

Re: ARROW GLOBAL LIMITED v GIZMO&LOGAN

Originally posted by nemesis45 View Post

Hello R,
You could send the following to Restons.

FAO The Principal Solicitor
Restons Solicitors.
usual address:

Date:

Ref: CC Claim No. :
Your Client Arrow Global.

Sir/Madam

I refer to a conversation with xxxxxxx of your staff and the claim that a payment of £x .xx was made to the alleged debt on date............................: Please note that I have not made any such payment nor have I authorised any 3rd party to make any payments at any time.

I am sure your are aware that the onus of providing unequivocal proof that any such payment was indeed made falls entirely upon your client, such proof must include : The exact date of payment, the method of payment i.e. debt card/ cheque/ postal order etc., and the name of the person making the alleged payment, please also provide the name of the company to which the alleged payment was made.
I am still awaiting the documents requested via CPR 31.14 I am sure you are aware that this still applies to this claim as it has not been allocated to any track.

For clarification I have not had an account with HSBC that had any form of overdraft facility and I require evidence of the existence any such account.

Therefore I maintain my stance that this alleged debt is statute barred no payment or written acknowledgment have been made by me I'm more than 6 years.

Yours etc.

A SAR will only provide data held by Restons since the account was passed to Restons likely to be very little waste of a tenner imo.

A call to HSBC may bring forth some info it's worth a try.

nem

Nem, thank you ever so much! I'll send this letter today.

I did get a response from them stating they want to verify my ID because there was no signature on the CPR 13.14 request. Was I right to omit this?

I have since confirmed that my email address is private and any emails from me would only be from me, so would it suffice if any further contact came via email?

Thanks

**nemesis45** · 22nd July 2016, 14:19:PM

Re: ARROW GLOBAL LIMITED v GIZMO&LOGAN

Originally posted by Gizmo&Logan View Post

Nem, thank you ever so much! I'll send this letter today.

I did get a response from them stating they want to verify my ID because there was no signature on the CPR 13.14 request. Was I right to omit this?

I have since confirmed that my email address is private and any emails from me would only be from me, so would it suffice if any further contact came via email?

Thanks

There is absolutely no reason to withhold signatures and there never has been really, the is no obligation to sign a CCA request but in both cases the Data Controller of the recipient must ensure that there are no breaches of the Data Protection Act 1998 to ensure that all documents go to the person entitled to receive them.
As long as you keep a complete checkable record of all communications (printable) as you may need to produce them in court.

Telephoning is not recommended.

nem

**Gizmo&Logan** · 22nd July 2016, 14:28:PM

Re: ARROW GLOBAL LIMITED v GIZMO&LOGAN

Originally posted by nemesis45 View Post

There is absolutely no reason to withhold signatures and there never has been really, the is no obligation to sign a CCA request but in both cases the Data Controller of the recipient must ensure that there are no breaches of the Data Protection Act 1998 to ensure that all documents go to the person entitled to receive them.
As long as you keep a complete checkable record of all communications (printable) as you may need to produce them in court.

Telephoning is not recommended.

nem

Message received and understood, it's a fair comment and something I'll rectify today.

Thanks again for your help.

R

ARROW GLOBAL LIMITED v GIZMO&LOGAN