Howard Cohen - Hoist Portfolio

[billyjones99]

I have received, in the past, requests for amounts from Hoist Portfolio, which I have always ignored. Last month I received a county court claim from Howard Cohen acting for Hoist via Northampton C.C. It seems Portfolio have bought debts from Alliance and Leicester and Santander bank. I made a counterclaim for the same amount they were claiming (on the grounds of stress induced by unproven demands for money ) and had the County Court claim made to my local court.
Cohen's have now identified the account to me and have sent me a list of transactions which lead me to believe the debt could be mine. However, I had lost track of this account due to financial and personal upheaval.
I need to know what steps to take to help my counterclaim as they haven't supplied a copy of the original contract and I need to understand how I can be responsible for a debt to a third party .
The original amount outstanding was about £500 - the claim now is for £1744.
I am existing on pension and have no assets.

[FlamingParrot]

Re: Howard Cohen - Hoist Portfolio

Hi and welcome aboard

I have received, in the past, requests for amounts from Hoist Portfolio, which I have always ignored. Last month I received a county court claim from Howard Cohen acting for Hoist via Northampton C.C. It seems Portfolio have bought debts from Alliance and Leicester and Santander bank.

Hoist have been buying most of Santander's defaulted accounts. Santander took over the A&L in 2010, I also had accounts with them which are now run by Santander.

I made a counterclaim for the same amount they were claiming (on the grounds of stress induced by unproven demands for money ) and had the County Court claim made to my local court.

Did you submit a defence to the actual claim? A counterclaim would be appropriate when the creditor also owes you money. Although we'd all like to be able to claim for stress and aggro, I'm not sure whether the courts would agree with that argument. :mmph:

Cohen's have now identified the account to me and have sent me a list of transactions which lead me to believe the debt could be mine. However, I had lost track of this account due to financial and personal upheaval.
I need to know what steps to take to help my counterclaim as they haven't supplied a copy of the original contract and I need to understand how I can be responsible for a debt to a third party .
The original amount outstanding was about £500 - the claim now is for £1744.
I am existing on pension and have no assets.

First of all, it would be useful if you could post up the particulars of claim. It would also be good if you could post up what you said in your defence. :typing:

What's this debt for? A current account overdraft? Did you have an account with the A&L to start with? What makes you say this is a debt to a third party? If you are referring to Hoist, they are debt purchasers who would have bought the account from Santander.

[billyjones99]

Re: Howard Cohen - Hoist Portfolio

Hi F P - Thanks for taking the time to respond.
I counterclaimed merely to annoy them and hope they would decide to settle or go to arbitration. My grounds to counterclaim were based on the fact I had no idea who the claimants were. I quote "I have no knowledge of alleged debt. I have had no dealings with the claimant. I do not recognise the sum claimed or its origin. I dispute the claim in its entirety."
Reasons for making counterclaim - "I am subsisting on benefits. I feel I am being bullied and pestered by an un-caring organisation who have their facts wrong. I have no knowledge of the claimants. Anxiety caused by False claim is highly stressful. I counterclaim £1598.09 by way of compensation."

It must be an account with A + L from 2010 with an overdraft facility - assigned to Santander. This why I did not recognise it.
They have sent me 3 pages of transactions which identify the account to me as mine. I am about to send them a letter from this web-site asking them for more information and copies of original contract. - as per CPR 31.14 request template supplied.
Should I continue this defence and post the letter?
Cheers and many thanks for your help.

[FlamingParrot]

Re: Howard Cohen - Hoist Portfolio

Hi F P - Thanks for taking the time to respond.
I counterclaimed merely to annoy them and hope they would decide to settle or go to arbitration. My grounds to counterclaim were based on the fact I had no idea who the claimants were. I quote "I have no knowledge of alleged debt. I have had no dealings with the claimant. I do not recognise the sum claimed or its origin. I dispute the claim in its entirety."

Was that what you actually wrote as your defence? The problem with that is the claimants can easily apply for strike out and summary judgment on the grounds that your defence does not meet the criteria as per CPR 16.5: https://www.justice.gov.uk/courts/pr...es/part16#16.5

Content of defence

16.5
(1) In his defence, the defendant must state –
(a) which of the allegations in the particulars of claim he denies;
(b) which allegations he is unable to admit or deny, but which he requires the claimant to prove; and
(c) which allegations he admits.
(2) Where the defendant denies an allegation –
(a) he must state his reasons for doing so; and
(b) if he intends to put forward a different version of events from that given by the claimant, he must state his own version.
(3) A defendant who –
(a) fails to deal with an allegation; but
(b) has set out in his defence the nature of his case in relation to the issue to which that allegation is relevant,
shall be taken to require that allegation to be proved.
(4) Where the claim includes a money claim, a defendant shall be taken to require that any allegation relating to the amount of money claimed be proved unless he expressly admits the allegation.
(5) Subject to paragraphs (3) and (4), a defendant who fails to deal with an allegation shall be taken to admit that allegation.
(6) If the defendant disputes the claimant’s statement of value under rule 16.3 he must –
(a) state why he disputes it; and
(b) if he is able, give his own statement of the value of the claim.

[judgemental24]

Re: Howard Cohen - Hoist Portfolio

I hate to say this but if Howard Cohen can show you are linked to this account with computer records etc, and that you have had the benefit of the credit services, you are flogging a dead horse with any counter claim.

You need to concentrate on the facts.

You had an A&L account.
Santandar took over that account when they aquired A&l so they then became the creditor.
Santandar then sold and assigned the account to Hoist

If this is a bank account with overdraft then sending for a copy of the agreement will be a waste of time. Sections of any overdraft are covered by the Consumer Credit Act but again flogging a dead horse with this.

You need to be asking for a copy of any agreement servicing the overdraft any any letter informing you the bank was calling in the overdraft.

As i remember overdrafts have to have an annual review by the bank to comply with legislation as an overdraft as stated, has parts covered under the CCA 1974.

Ask for a copy of these reviews

You can only use the CPR 31.14 request on what is mentioned in the particulars of claim

Can you type them out?? Normally starts "Monies owed"

If you have submitted a defence CPR 31.14 is irrelevant now as that is used to enable you to attain data to submit a valid defence

[FlamingParrot]

Re: Howard Cohen - Hoist Portfolio

Hi F P - Thanks for taking the time to respond.
I counterclaimed merely to annoy them and hope they would decide to settle or go to arbitration.

Reasons for making counterclaim - "I am subsisting on benefits. I feel I am being bullied and pestered by an un-caring organisation who have their facts wrong. I have no knowledge of the claimants. Anxiety caused by False claim is highly stressful. I counterclaim £1598.09 by way of compensation."

I'm afraid none of the above are grounds to counter-claim, that would only apply if you could establish that the claimant actually owes you money. :mmph: Compensation has to be for an actual loss rather than stress. It is a fact that receiving a claim will always cause stress, if that was a valid defence or counter-claim, there would be no point for any creditor to issue a claim in the first place as we'd all be counter-claiming for stress. :ohwell:

Being on benefits is not an argument for a defence or a counter-claim either, however, it is a valid argument to offer a nominal or token repayment amount but in that case you'd have to negotiate directly with the creditor providing an income and expenditure statement, showing that even if they were to obtain judgment against you (and looking at the above, it looks highly likely ), they'd just be wasting their time because you'd only be paying them £1 a month anyway and they'd be incurring further costs in progressing the claim further. That sort of thing. :thumb:

It must be an account with A + L from 2010 with an overdraft facility - assigned to Santander. This why I did not recognise it.
They have sent me 3 pages of transactions which identify the account to me as mine. I am about to send them a letter from this web-site asking them for more information and copies of original contract. - as per CPR 31.14 request template supplied.
Should I continue this defence and post the letter?
Cheers and many thanks for your help.

If you have already submitted a defence, it probably won't do much good, the idea of the letter is to be able to obtain the information BEFORE filing your defence so you can file something better than the above. IMHO attempting to negotiate with them as noted above may be better under the circumstances. If it's an overdraft and you were still using the account in 2010 it won't be statute barred and you are not likely to have many grounds to defend even if you were to apply for permission to amend your defence. :mmph:

[billyjones99]

Re: Howard Cohen - Hoist Portfolio

Hi - Thanks again for your help. I don't really understand the above from - "You need to be asking for..... "Monies owed""
Is there a template for this request? or do I just ask them for "a copy of any agreement servicing the overdraft or any letter informing me the bank was calling in the overdraft"
Cheers

[nemesis45]

Re: Howard Cohen - Hoist Portfolio

I agree there is no basis for a counter claim, it would be an abuse of process because it is irrelevant.
The defence does not seem to have a " reasonable" chance of success.

If this is bank account/overdraft there is no CCA '74 regulated agreement, a letter of " facility " may
exist.

nem

[judgemental24]

Re: Howard Cohen - Hoist Portfolio

Monies owed normally start on the particulars of claim form received from Hoist

I will be blunt again

You were to quick in submitting your defence, you could have had 56 days from date on the claim form if extended under CPR 31.5

THIS IS NOW GOING TO BE VERY DIFFICULT

You are going to have to ask the court if you can ammend your defence. That will probably cost you £155.55 with an N244 application notice with no guarantees

Even with the documentation it is quite easy to prove you had benefit and use of the credit services. If we had more time a holding defence might have been possible

Your best bet to avoid a CCJ will be to contact Howard Cohen and try and negotiate a Tomlin Order before more costs are imposed. That way you will avoid a CCJ

THIS IS JUST MINE, AND ONLY MY OWN OPINION BUT AT THIS CURRENT STAGE, YOU ARE FLOGGING A DEAD HORSE AS THE DAMAGE HAS ALREADY BEEN DONE

I had a Tomlin Order myself an paid it at £5.00 a week by standing order

[FlamingParrot]

Re: Howard Cohen - Hoist Portfolio

My suggestion was also to attempt to negotiate with them. The defence as it stands can be easily subject to strike out due to not having a prospect of success and summary judgment would follow. Amending a defence is only worth doing if you can come up with something that would constitute a valid defence, I'm sorry but I just can't find any arguments here since it's an overdraft thus not subject to ss.77-79 or 127(3) of the CCA, not SBd, so what would the amended defence be? :noidea: