Crown court Appeal+Litigant in person.

[hayclan]

Hi people, Need your expert knowledge please. I am appealing a conviction in the Crown Court and something interesting happened yesterday, I said that the Local Authority hadn't bought their action against me in the time allowed by law (besides all their other lies) and the appeal was halted in actual fact it didn't start anyway there is apparently a 'Certificate' that must be signed before action can be taken for alleged offences and there is a 3mth time limit to bring charges etc. Does anyone know what that Certificate is called please? and any other info concerning that Certificate. I would appreciate any info on this matter. Just to put your minds at rest I am innocent of the charges and can prove it.
Many thanks.

[des8]

Re: Crown court Appeal+Litigant in person.

If this post refers to your conviction in magistrates court for HB/CTB fraud, a prosecution for a summary offence may be commenced within he period of 3 months from the date on which evidence sufficient in the opinion of the appropriate authority to justify a prosecution for the offence comes to the authority’s knowledge or within a period of 12 months from the commission of the offence whichever period last expires. Sub-section (3) adds that a certificate of the appropriate authority as to the date on which such evidence ……came to the authority’s knowledge shall be conclusive evidence of that date.


The reference is to Section 116 Sub section (3) of the Social Securtity Administration Act 1992

[hayclan]

Re: Crown court Appeal+Litigant in person.

Thank you des8. It was the fact that proccedings hadn't been brought within the 3mth period that my Appeal couldn't be heard last Friday (8th) and a preliminary hearing was set for 21days later. What stops a Local Authority from just issuing another certificate please?
Thank you.

[des8]

Re: Crown court Appeal+Litigant in person.

The certificate warrants the date on which the LA obtained the evidence.
I suppose in theory there is nothing to stop them issuing a false certificate, but as it purports to be signed by the secretary of state, I would not like to be the guy found in court to be falsifying such a certificate.
Do you know when they obtained the "evidence" they are relying on? and more importantly can you prove that date?

[des8]

Re: Crown court Appeal+Litigant in person.

Deleted

[hayclan]

Re: Crown court Appeal+Litigant in person.

Hi des8, Thank you. Yes I know the date because their Barrister was beside me in front of the Judge very irritated and embarrassed and said 'I know of a certificate dated Jan 2013 but have just been told that their is another certificate dated Feb 2014 signed by the same Authorised Officer' he then said he would have to reasearch the Law to see which one is valid & mentioned 'Jacobs' it as all very odd.

[des8]

Re: Crown court Appeal+Litigant in person.

So they do have a problem.
Do you have a copy of the transcript of that hearing which includes that statement? It could prove very useful.

[hayclan]

Re: Crown court Appeal+Litigant in person.

No I don't but it was said in front of me and 4 members of my family but I do get your point.

[stevemLS]

Re: Crown court Appeal+Litigant in person.

So they do have a problem.
Do you have a copy of the transcript of that hearing which includes that statement? It could prove very useful.

As far as I know transcripts are not routinely made and if a party wants one, they have to pay for it.

[des8]

Re: Crown court Appeal+Litigant in person.

I (mis)understood (?) that Crown Court proceedings were recorded (shorthand notes, tapes etc) by Court Transcribing firms contracted by the MOJ ( copyright remains with the Crown)
You are entitled to apply to the reporting firm for a transcript (for which the reporting firm makes a commercial charge) provided you have obtained permission from the court concerned. The Crown gives blanket permission for copying and distribution of transcripts for any legitimate criminal justice function and/or for access to personal data.
If you wish to obtain a copy of a court case where you were the defendant, you should speak to the court concerned for details of how to go about this. Each court will be linked to a company that is responsible for transcribing at that court.

[stevemLS]

Re: Crown court Appeal+Litigant in person.

Yes, des, I think that is absolutely the case (I tend not to stray into the criminal courts if at all possible!) - a recording will have been made and it is usual to request a transcript at the end of the hearing concerned.

Part 5.5 of the Criminal Procedure Rules seems to cover it http://www.justice.gov.uk/courts/pro...13-part-05.pdf

I can't find any statutory fees, but one service provider in the south charges either £1.43 or £1.54 per folio (72 words) depending on whether it is proceedings or a judgment which is being transcribed.

[hayclan]

Re: Crown court Appeal+Litigant in person.

Thank you both. I receive £71.00pw to live on and I know I cannot afford to pay for anything like that. I thought my Solicitor (legal aid) was in the process of obtaing data crucial to my defence but found out too late that he hadn't bothered so as a LIP for my appeal I asked the Courts permission to get this data and when I went to collect it I had to pay £26.00 (didn't know at the time there would be a charge) then to discover it wasn't the correct data, I did complain and was given the correct data but the payment did prove detrimental to me. Their Barrister spoke at length about the 2 Certificates so it would prove too costly but I do appreciate your comments. Would you know of any charity or Gov Body that would assist/refund any real expenses for a LIP? I do understand the principal but find it unfair that only solicitors can get funded for poor people yet not the people for themselves especially when your Solicitor fails in his duty.

[stevemLS]

Re: Crown court Appeal+Litigant in person.

Afraid I don't know of anyone who would help with this.

As far as I know, this is not a court fee as such so you would not be able to get fee remission on the basis of low income - others may know better?

[des8]

Re: Crown court Appeal+Litigant in person.

CPR part 52 : ( http://www.justice.gov.uk/courts/pro...l/rules/part52)
This actually refers to obtaining transcripts from lower courts, but IMO it would be worth trying to apply it to the transcripts you require
Transcripts at public expense

52.5A
(1) Subject to paragraph (2), the lower court or the appeal court may direct, on the application of a party to the proceedings, that an official transcript of the judgment of the lower court, or of any part of the evidence or the proceedings in the lower court, be obtained at public expense for the purposes of an appeal.
(2) Before making a direction under paragraph (1), the court must be satisfied that—
(a) the applicant qualifies for fee remission or is otherwise in such poor financial circumstances that the cost of obtaining a transcript would be an excessive burden; and
(b) it is necessary in the interests of justice for such a transcript to be obtained.

[stevemLS]

Re: Crown court Appeal+Litigant in person.

[MENTION=39710]des8[/MENTION] - those are the Civil Procedure Rules but this is a criminal matter so surely the Criminal Procedure Rules, which I mentioned, apply.

The Criminal Rules appear not to have an equivalent provision for transcripts at public expense.