Court claim - rent arrears

[dan_1207]

Re: Court claim - rent arrears

**Note to forum: request for amendment to interest and acceptance of agreed Tomlin Order sent to other side**

[n20998]

Re: Court claim - rent arrears

As Dan mentioned I sent the offer. I've been asked to provide proof of the items on the income and expenditure, including debts. What's my position/play here?

[dan_1207]

Re: Court claim - rent arrears

Morning (just about).

Given that the court would in any event ask for I&E in the event you're making an offer below that which they have claimed, I would suggest your reply is kept to the same level of detail as that which is asked for in the court paperwork. That's more than enough information for them.

It's simply to check that what you're offering is realistic and to see whether they are justified in declining it, so be a precise as possible.

(I have seen your PM and have noted the I&E details, just be as specific as possible and explain your circumstances to them. Again, keep it without prejudice for now because I'm considering tactics to use in the event they say no.)

[n20998]

Re: Court claim - rent arrears

Posting particulars as I can't PM to Dan. *Attachments removed*

[dan_1207]

Re: Court claim - rent arrears

That's great, thanks.

I've drafted a Defence for you and will finish off the Tomlin Order in the event they do not come back to us in time. As regards the Particulars:

1. It states you admit to the Rent being due and that you admitted in writing to that sum as being due. As such, I won't deal with those points on the basis that you have accepted liability.

2. I will argue that the interest has been improperly pleaded and should be reduced by the Court in the event it gets that far.

As mentioned in PM, we have until 2 April 2015 until your Defence should be filed (assuming the terms of the Tomlin Order cannot be agreed and filed by that time). The Claim is, in the most part, properly pleaded and on the basis of your admission so they will be entitled to costs. By the looks of things, their solicitor hasn't claimed anything more than fixed costs which is good for us.

Did the solicitor write to you before they issued a claim warning you that proceedings would be issued? They're usually referred to as a letter before claim or letter before action, but might not necessarily have those words within the body of the letter. I will include a point about them not being entitled to anything more than fixed costs just in case they try pulling a fast one.

[n20998]

Re: Court claim - rent arrears

They wrote to me towards the end of November with a letter before action. As mentioned previously on the thread, following that I made an arrangement to pay but failed to make the payments. I hadn't heard anything else from them until receiving the claim form (I had a few texts with the claimant). The agreement did state that if I didn't make payment they might start proceedings without further contact.

[dan_1207]

Re: Court claim - rent arrears

Defence attached.

You need to make three changes.

1/ Add the claim number to the top right hand section of page 1;

2/ Add the relevant clause under which interest is dealt with in your tenancy agreement on page 1; and,

3/ Check what rate the interest is calculated against on page 2.

If you need any help, PM me, but this ought to do it.

You'll receive further information from the Court once you have submitted your defence, and the matter will be transferred to your local county court for allocation. We will talk about that if/when we get to that stage.

[n20998]

Re: Court claim - rent arrears

Hi all,

I tried to contact Dan for some advice on how to proceed with the current situation with this. I notice he hasn't been on the forum for a few weeks (maybe on holiday or something) so I hope it's ok to bring this thread back up and hopefully get some more advice (the advice I received a few months ago was great, thanks). The case went to court in early May and I received the CCJ. Below is the message I sent to Dan about what's currently happening...


Unfortunately, I failed to make the first payment due on the CCJ and have not made a payment since. If I can just mention what has happened...

• The first judgement came from the court, which was a Judgement by Acceptance for £100 per month. I thought this was wrong so queried it with the court, who agreed it was wrong, so they would have it set aside and issue a new judgement.
• A second judgement came from the court, this time a Judgement by Acceptance demanding the full amount paid by 12th June (!!!!). I queried this again with the court, who agreed it was wrong, so they would have it set aside and issue a new judgement.
• The claimant's solicitor sent me a letter demanding the full amount paid by 12th June. I replied saying this was obviously wrong and the court would issue a new judgement. I asked if they would be issuing a new letter as this was obviously wrong. No response.
• A third judgement came from the court, a Judgement by Determination, for £100 per month.
• I was unable to make the first payment - a couple of days before it was due I emailed the claimants solicitor explaining and saying I could pay 2 months in July if I had written acceptance no further action would be taken. No response.
• I emailed back in early July asking again if they were going to be happy with this. No response.
• A few days before the July claimant I forwarded the emails to the claimant asking if he was ok with this. No response.

What should I do about this? Should I just start making the payments? I don't want to do that and have them start further action. What is it they can do now?

[FlamingParrot]

Re: Court claim - rent arrears

Unfortunately, I failed to make the first payment due on the CCJ and have not made a payment since. If I can just mention what has happened...

• The first judgement came from the court, which was a Judgement by Acceptance for £100 per month. I thought this was wrong so queried it with the court, who agreed it was wrong, so they would have it set aside and issue a new judgement
• A second judgement came from the court, this time a Judgement by Acceptance demanding the full amount paid by 12th June (!!!!). I queried this again with the court, who agreed it was wrong, so they would have it set aside and issue a new judgement.
• The claimant's solicitor sent me a letter demanding the full amount paid by 12th June. I replied saying this was obviously wrong and the court would issue a new judgement. I asked if they would be issuing a new letter as this was obviously wrong. No response.
• A third judgement came from the court, a Judgement by Determination, for £100 per month..

Can I just ask why you thought the first judgment was wrong? The court had ordered you to pay £100, the same amount as in the third and last order. What was wrong the first time? :confused2:

• I was unable to make the first payment - a couple of days before it was due I emailed the claimants solicitor explaining and saying I could pay 2 months in July if I had written acceptance no further action would be taken. No response.
• I emailed back in early July asking again if they were going to be happy with this. No response.
• A few days before the July claimant I forwarded the emails to the claimant asking if he was ok with this. No response.

If you are not able to make payments of £100 per month you should consider applying for a variation of the order, that's not the same as a new judgment, just a change in the amount you pay every month. To do that you need an N245 where you'll have to provide full financial information to back up your offer. It's no good to have court order for £100/month if you can't afford it from the start.

What should I do about this? Should I just start making the payments? I don't want to do that and have them start further action. What is it they can do now?

As you have an order from the court, you should either make the payments ordered if you are able, or apply to vary them as noted above if you are not able to make them. You need to comply with the terms of a court order to avoid enforcement action. Depending on your circumstances, the judgment creditor can obtain an attachment of earnings order to get your employer to deduct money from your wages (only if you are employed not self-employed); they can also apply for a warrant of control to send bailiffs round to seize goods :scared: and even issue a statutory demand (provided the debt is over the threshold, currently £750).

[n20998]

Re: Court claim - rent arrears

Hi FP, thanks for the quick reply.

I thought the first order was wrong as I had asked for the amount to be £50 per month. It stated it was a Judgement by Acceptance, which it was not, it should have been a Judgement by Determination.

I think I can pay the £100 per month. I guess my main question is, if I pay the amount to catch up with the payments, without having any written agreement from them that they agree to this (which I can't get as they are ignoring me), can they take any of the action that you've described?

Also, if they've started any action already, what will be the first I know of it? Will I get a letter, or will the bailiffs turn up at the door!

Thanks again

[FlamingParrot]

Re: Court claim - rent arrears

Hi FP, thanks for the quick reply.

I thought the first order was wrong as I had asked for the amount to be £50 per month. It stated it was a Judgement by Acceptance, which it was not, it should have been a Judgement by Determination.

Did you return the admission form with an offer of £50? Acceptance means the creditor accepted your offer.

I think I can pay the £100 per month. I guess my main question is, if I pay the amount to catch up with the payments, without having any written agreement from them that they agree to this (which I can't get as they are ignoring me), can they take any of the action that you've described?

If you are making the £100 payments every month you are complying with the court order so no, they can't take further action.

Also, if they've started any action already, what will be the first I know of it? Will I get a letter, or will the bailiffs turn up at the door!

Thanks again

It's unlikely they would have already applied for a warrant. If that was the case, you would get an enforcement notice which should give you at least seven clear days before any visit. 'Clear' days do not include Sundays or BHs. :thumb:

[n20998]

Re: Court claim - rent arrears

Thanks again. The first order stated I had to pay £100 and it was a Judgement by Acceptance. This was wrong as I'd asked for it to be £50, but they asked for it to be £100 and the judge agreed, so it should have been a Judgement by Determination (I think I've got that right). I phoned to check and ask why it wasn't £50 per month, they explained and said it was wrong and a new Judgement would be sent out.

So, in my position do you think it's best if I make the payment to catch up (£200) then keep making the normal payments of £100 per month by the date on the order. Then they can't do anything?

[FlamingParrot]

Re: Court claim - rent arrears

Thanks again. The first order stated I had to pay £100 and it was a Judgement by Acceptance. This was wrong as I'd asked for it to be £50, but they asked for it to be £100 and the judge agreed, so it should have been a Judgement by Determination (I think I've got that right). I phoned to check and ask why it wasn't £50 per month, they explained and said it was wrong and a new Judgement would be sent out.

Sounds like the claimant rejected your offer so the judgment would have been by Determination as you say. The new judgment would have been forthwith which was a lot worse. At least they got it back to square one third time. :mmph:

So, in my position do you think it's best if I make the payment to catch up (£200) then keep making the normal payments of £100 per month by the date on the order. Then they can't do anything?

Yes, if you can afford them payments, then they can't do anything. Enforcement action can only be taken when you are in default of a court order. Do bear in mind that you could apply to vary the payments in the future if you need to, as long as your financials back up your offer. :thumb:

[n20998]

Re: Court claim - rent arrears

Thanks that's been really helpful

[n20998]

Re: Court claim - rent arrears

Urgent help please I think I need to send the form in tomorrow.

Hi, so I didn't end up making these payments. The claimant and the claimant's representive ignored my request to confirm they'd take no further action and the payments of £100 would be very difficult.

I didn't hear anything until last Monday the claimant's representive phoned me to say they were wanting to confirm details as they were trying to get bailiffs to come and get me to fill in a statement of means (!!!). Turns out they've applied for an attachment of earnings order but used my old address. This is despite me advising them of the change by email and since then them using the new address correctly. I contacted the court and they sent me a N56. I haven't received anything else - not sure if I should have got a notice or guidance to help filling in the form.

So I'm going to fill in the form and ask for a suspended order. Main reason is it may affect my employment. Should I mention that they ignored my request which is the reason I didn't make payments and that they used the wrong address which is the reason the process has been delayed?

Many thanks