Taking Court Action Against Vodafone - Remove Default Notice

[Amethyst]

Re: Taking Court Action Against Vodafone - Remove Default Notice

You're not on your own Abbie by the looks of it and seems it's only vodafone being arses.

https://twitter.com/jmvmills/status/601665808889184257

@VodafoneUK why does Vodafone send debt agents after victims of "Operation Rosewood" phone scam, when other operators offer help & support.

You've got a crime ref haven't you - can you contact the police and ask if there's any progress ? ( I have sod all idea how these things work, except that they take forever )

It doesn't sound like it is the right operation though for your case ??
http://thebadgeronline.com/2014/11/p...gets-students/
https://www.choose.co.uk/news/mobile...-students.html
http://www.thegryphon.co.uk/2014/10/...m-phone-fraud/

[AbbieA]

Re: Taking Court Action Against Vodafone - Remove Default Notice

They mean the account, the previous sentence confirms the account no. The full letter is posted on this thread.

[AbbieA]

Re: Taking Court Action Against Vodafone - Remove Default Notice

Yeah I imagine its the same scammers with a similar scam, especially as the first article mentions Sheffield which is where I went Uni. I wonder how many other people are in the same boat as me? Would also be interesting to see how other mobile phone companies have handled this.

[R0b]

Re: Taking Court Action Against Vodafone - Remove Default Notice

Abbie,

If you want the ICO to do anything, you can make what is known as a section 42 assessment. This is a legal right under the Data Protection Act in which the ICO must investigate whether it is more or less likely that Vodafone is complying with the law.

You would need to specify that the letter is being sent in accordance with section 42 of the DPA and you wish the ICO to consider your circumstances.

Whilst Vodafone have not admitted directly that your account has been potentially a fraudulent one, you should use every piece of evidence and or argument to pick apart anything contained in your notes from your SAR request and also anything else you feel is inconsistent. For example:

1. You can refer to the banks letter about verifying that the direct debit mandate was a fraudulent signature.
2. That Vodafone were well aware of this type of scam happening since around 2014 (as per the action fraud website) and the facts surrounding this account matches the scam that took place.
3. You have repeatedly asked for evidence of the contract which was signed supposed by you but they have not provided anything to date.
4. You've never had a Vodafone account prior to this one being set up. If you already had an a contract with another mobile provider that could be used as further evidence that you did not open it as it was not needed.
5. Your Vodafone account shows notes that there was high spend in one day of over £100 in Portugal on the said dates however, you were not in Portugal at that time. Any evidence would help with this.
6. Add any other evidence or explanation you feel is relevant.

You might also want to refer to the ICO's own guidance at page 16 'unresolved disputes' (click here) which discusses unresolved disputes and that in this case, they should not have applied the default or at least removed it until a proper investigation has been carried out. Taken all of the above into account, my view is that it is more likely than not that Vodafone should not have recorded the default and/or removed it upon being made aware of the circumstances surrounding your case. Their letter from the legal team in my opinion indirectly suggests that they are aware of the mobile phone scam and that you are potentially one of those victims, otherwise they would not have referred to the Met Police's investigation.

The ICO has an obligation to investigate and make a finding based on the evidence submitted and after hearing both sides.

[AbbieA]

Re: Taking Court Action Against Vodafone - Remove Default Notice

Morning Rob, thanks for your help!

I have drafted this in response to the last email I received from the ICO:


Dear *******
I am formally requesting that you investigate Case Reference Number ******* in accordance with section 42 of the Data Protection Act 1998. I am doing this on the basis that I have further information that warrants the ICO considering circumstances left out from the initial correspondence.

Whilst Vodafone have not admitted directly that my account has been potentially a fraudulent one, I feel I have gathered enough evidence to show that the default should not have been applied to my credit score and should have been removed when Vodafone were made aware of the situation in 2015, pending a proper investigation being carried out. I am basing this on the following points:

1. The Police conducted an investigation and determined that this account was set up fraudulently. For this I have a crime reference number that has been supplied to Vodafone.
2. My bank conducted their own investigation verifying that the direct debit mandate contained a fraudulent signature and have informed Vodafone of this.
3. Vodafone were well aware of this type of scam happening since around 2014 (as per the action fraud website) and the facts surrounding this account matches the scam that took place.
4. Vodafone have been unable to supply any evidence of the contract despite persistent requests.
5. Vodafone have also failed to supply me with proof of default in the form of a default notice, statement of account and notice of assignment despite persistent requests.
6. Vodafone have now admitted that the account is linked to an ongoing fraud investigation, but have only done this in response to an email I sent to the company CEO Nick Jeffery.
7. I've never had a Vodafone account prior to this one being set up. I can prove I already had a contract with another mobile provider.
8. The Vodafone account notes I obtained show that there was high spend in one day of over £100 in Portugal on the said dates however, I was not in Portugal at that time.
9. There are several inconsistencies in the Vodafone account notes provided. Despite 4 fraud investigations concluding that no fraud was found and siting ‘normal usage on the account, normal calls to UK landlines and mobiles’ the account notes clearly show that this account was referred to Vodafones internal fraud team several times due to high usage in Europe and calls overseas.

Taking all of the above into account, it is my view that it is more likely than not that Vodafone should not have recorded the default and/or removed it upon being made aware of the circumstances surrounding this case. Their letter from the legal team indirectly suggests that they are aware of the mobile phone scam and that I am potentially one of those victims, otherwise they would not have referred to the Met Police's investigation.

The ICO has an obligation to investigate and make a finding based on the evidence submitted and after hearing both sides.

[R0b]

Re: Taking Court Action Against Vodafone - Remove Default Notice

Hi Abbie,

I think you would need to set out more background information than that so the ICO has sufficient information to go to Vodafone. I would suggest you break it up into sections as suggested below but you don't have to if you just want to send what you've drafted above though I except the ICO to come back asking for further information which could delay things a bit further - your choice however.

The Issue
- This is what you want the ICO to consider i.e. whether it is likely or not that Vodafone are in breach of Principal 4 of the DPA 1998.

Background
- provide some background to the reason why the assessment is needed. You don't need to go into every bit of detail but explain what has happened and also any key facts the ICO should be aware of. This is where you also apply your evidence and inconsistencies against what vodafone has said.

Evidence enclosed
You should highlight the evidence that you are enclosing with the letter (or email) so that they know what your relying on as part of the assessment. In addition to the above points I made, you should also include nay relevant notes from your SAR request and also the correspondence from Vodafone's legal team and also the bank.

Conclusion
- add a conclusion is you wish but isn't necessary.

Add a few lines as the end by saying something like, please could you confirm receipt of this email / letter and let me know how long you expect the investigation to take. I look forward to hearing from you.

Sincerely,

name

[Vodafone Company Rep]

Re: Taking Court Action Against Vodafone - Remove Default Notice

The complaint is not resolved.

Lee, I replied to your email on Friday and your email this morning. Still not been given a timescale as to when you will have looked in to this account?

Hi Abbie,

I replied to your last email yesterday.

As soon as I have an update, I'll let you know.

Kind regards,

Lee

Vodafone Social Media

[slainte caragh]

Re: Taking Court Action Against Vodafone - Remove Default Notice

Guys Lee isn't being diliberately cloak and dagger.

He simply cannot tell us anything under Data Protection, Abbie on the other hand can if she so wishes! This includes saying if the complaint is resolved as that is account sensitive information.

Abbie, I have known Lee long enough to know he is beavering away in the background working his lil socks off for you. He might take a while to get back but this is because this might be higher than he is, so he needs to get authority to deal with it and deal with the higher levels, if he can help you he will.

Even though we worked for rivals companies I respect his intergrity and work immensely, Lee is one of the good guys.

[wales01man]

Re: Taking Court Action Against Vodafone - Remove Default Notice

Guys Lee isn't being diliberately cloak and dagger.

He simply cannot tell us anything under Data Protection, Abbie on the other hand can if she so wishes! This includes saying if the complaint is resolved as that is account sensitive information.

Abbie, I have known Lee long enough to know he is beavering away in the background working his lil socks off for you. He might take a while to get back but this is because this might be higher than he is, so he needs to get authority to deal with it and deal with the higher levels, if he can help you he will.

Even though we worked for rivals companies I respect his intergrity and work immensely, Lee is one of the good guys.

Nobody expects him to tell all but why has the OP been kept waiting so long

[warwick65]

Re: Taking Court Action Against Vodafone - Remove Default Notice

Could it be that Lee is overworked and underpaid as are the people he needs to contact to get an answer

Lee is just an employee and has to work with what he is given. I can personally vouch that he sorted a problem out for me elsewhere, and I was so happy I asked him to marry me :-)

[slainte caragh]

Re: Taking Court Action Against Vodafone - Remove Default Notice

again, he can't say.

I have to be careful how much information I give out, and you know I love ya Wales, but it can take days.. even weeks for an agent to get updates and information, and poor Lee is starting from scratch bless him! If this is part of a police investigation it might take a good week to get authorisation to contact the relevant department, Lee won't mind me saying that Fraud departments are a lot higher than regular agents and sometimes they can ba arsey about who they speak to!

If you were the OP and I was dealing with this, I wouldn't even be able to say on the forum what your first name was as that is account specific information, Lee could not only lose his job but end up in the nick if he does... and no one wants that!

His hands are tied by the DPA love, I mean it!

[warwick65]

Re: Taking Court Action Against Vodafone - Remove Default Notice

BTW he declined - he has better taste

[slainte caragh]

Re: Taking Court Action Against Vodafone - Remove Default Notice

Could it be that Lee is overworked and underpaid as are the people he needs to contact to get an answer

Lee is just an employee and has to work with what he is given. I can personally vouch that he sorted a problem out for me elsewhere, and I was so happy I asked him to marry me :-)

this too

I know how frustrating it is from both sides, both the customer and the agent. He would love to say "You know what? A wizard did it!" but if he gives the slightest hint on a public forum of what he is doing, he is actually breaching an act of Parliament and could end up with 12 years in prison, losing his job and an unlimited fine.

Please believe me when I say Lee is one of the best at Vodafone (yes I remember you helping me out on and old one Lee, I still owe you a cuppa mate!). If he can't help he will find someone who can and I know it kills him to say this is past me. I have to hand it over... cos I was exactly the same.

[AbbieA]

Re: Taking Court Action Against Vodafone - Remove Default Notice

Hi Rob,

Thanks again for your advice, I have redrafted the letter to the ICO as follows:

Dear *****

I am formally requesting that you investigate Case Reference Number ******* in accordance with section 42 of the Data Protection Act 1998. I am doing this on the basis that I have further information that warrants the ICO considering circumstances left out from the initial correspondence.

The Issue

I would like the ICO to consider whether or not Vodafone are in breach of Principle 4 of the Data Protection Act 1998. Whilst Vodafone have not admitted directly that the account is a fraudulent one, I feel I have gathered enough evidence to show that the default should not have been applied to my credit score and should have been removed when Vodafone were made aware of the situation in 2015, pending a proper investigation being carried out.

Background
The issue revolves around a fraudulent account set up in my name using my bank details in July 2014. I assert that Vodafone have been negligent in allowing a contract to be opened with insufficient documentation and have incorrectly applied a debt and default notices to my name/credit score. I further assert that the fraud investigation carried out by Vodafone has been insufficient and that they have ignored/overlooked the findings of both the ActionFraud and Natwest fraud investigations.

I am basing this on the following points, all of which can be backed up with evidence:

1. The Police conducted an investigation and determined that this account was set up fraudulently. For this I have a crime reference number that has been supplied to Vodafone.
2. My bank conducted their own investigation verifying that the direct debit mandate contained a fraudulent signature and have informed Vodafone of this.
3. Vodafone have been aware of this type of fraud happening since 2014 (as per the action fraud website) and the facts surrounding this account matches the fraud that took place.
4. Vodafone have been unable to supply any evidence of the contract despite persistent requests.
5. Vodafone have also failed to supply me with proof of default in the form of a default notice, statement of account and notice of assignment despite persistent requests.
6. Vodafone have now admitted that the account is linked to an ongoing fraud investigation, but have only done this in response to an email I sent to the company CEO Nick Jeffery.
7. I've never had a Vodafone account prior to this one being set up. I can prove I already had a contract with another mobile provider.
8. The Vodafone account notes I obtained show that the phone was used in Portugal and Spain but on the said dates I was in the UK.
9. There are several inconsistencies in the Vodafone account notes provided. Despite 4 fraud investigations concluding that no fraud was found and siting ‘normal usage on the account, normal calls to UK landlines and mobiles’ the account notes clearly show that this account was referred to Vodafone’s internal fraud team several times due to high usage in Europe and calls overseas.

Taking all of the above into account, it is my view that it is more likely than not that Vodafone should not have recorded the default and/or removed it upon being made aware of the circumstances surrounding this case. Their letter from the legal team in my opinion indirectly suggests that they are aware of the mobile phone scam and that I am potentially one of those victims, otherwise they would not have referred to the Met Police's investigation.

Evidence Enclosed

I intend to base my claim on the following documents:

Vodafone 689728830 Crystal Account Notes
Vodafone 689728830 Siebel Account Notes
Letter from Vodafone Legal Team dated 03/04/17 Reference: 1-456427175962

Please could you confirm receipt of this email and let me know how long you expect the investigation to take. I look forward to hearing from you.

Sincerely,

Abbie

[AbbieA]

Re: Taking Court Action Against Vodafone - Remove Default Notice

And with regards to Lee, I appreciate that he is just doing his job and he is correct not to disclose any information on here. I do not expect him to resolve this situation, and have not asked him to, as it is an issue for the UK Legal Team to resolve. I have asked Lee to provide an update, if he can, as I have had no correspondence from Vodafone since the letter dated 03/04/17 (posted above). He may be able to do this, or he may be able to put me in contact with someone who can. We will see.