Tuttsi V Halifax ( 18 year claim )

[Budgie]

Re: HALIFAX 18 year claim

Some comments in red below !!

I still have not yet sent of this claim and feel it is time I did it. Because of my financial hardship that I am experiencing right now it is a good time to tackle it. Sounds like a good plan.

I think for me will be to do statutory 8% interest and I think unless anyone advised differently that I will send them my evidence of hardship together with the LBA and claim under the present waiver rules. That is the right way to proceed.

Also, do I have to give reasons why I had not claimed sooner! as this is such an old claim and I have pondered so much on how to actualy deal with it.
For the purposes of trying to get it settled from hardship angle then just treat it the same as any would any other claim Tuttsi.

Contractual Compounded interest would have been teriffic £60K plus, but do not think I would be able to stand up to there legal team and quite honestly would just like some of the money back to pay off debts and get us back on track. Your rights are protected with the FSA waiver anyway, but it is pretty obvious that Halifax will not consider settling your claim under financial hardship grounds if you include a compound interest element. I suggest trying to get claim sorted initially using statutory interest approach, if that doesnt work then you can actually consider filing claim in Court using compound interest approach anyway. Remember that if you are trying to get this settled directly with Halifax ( before filing at Court ) then we will have to be careful about wording the interest part of your claim ( normally the statutory interest element wouldn't be added until you actually file at Court ).

xx
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Tuttsi

Re: HALIFAX 18 year claim

I still have not yet sent of this claim and feel it is time I did it. Because of my financial hardship that I am experiencing right now it is a good time to tackle it.

I think for me will be to do statutory 8% interest and I think unless anyone advised differently that I will send them my evidence of hardship together with the LBA and claim under the present waiver rules.

Also, do I have to give reasons why I had not claimed sooner! as this is such an old claim and I have pondered so much on how to actualy deal with it.

Contractual Compounded interest would have been teriffic £60K plus, but do not think I would be able to stand up to there legal team and quite honestly would just like some of the money back to pay off debts and get us back on track.

xx
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Tuttsi

Re: HALIFAX 18 year claim

Hi Maxwall

Although I loved your Sempra argument and your poc was really written extremely well, but the size of the claim really worried me that I would be able to take on this claim of £50K+ Halifax for sure would hire the best legal team. My post 11 I had also asked you a couple of questions which had not been answered and then I cold feet so I decided to only go for 8% simple as I did not feel able to fight this as it was getting very complicated and my thoughts that this claim could be very costly if I were to lose.

But, I have passed on your excellent POC to Hallimac who is also doing a Halifax claim and wanted tyo use the compounded contractual interest - but his claim is very small in comparrision to mine.

I was about to send my LBA off this coming week based on 8% and hey presto you have appeared.....

If you can add anything else to my thread I really would appreciate it.

Thanks again

xxxxx

[Maxwall]

Re: HALIFAX 18 year claim

Hi Tuttsi

How are you getting on. Sorry i have'nt been about, but i had a lot of trouble logging into my account.

Any news?

[crashbandicoot]

Re: HALIFAX 18 year claim

One final point the account was in joint names should the LBA be from both of us ( hubby) or can it just come from me and that goes for the POC as well.

I know more questions...... I want to get it right.

Cheers
DSxx

Hi Tutts, just to let you know I claimed for both my single account and my joint account with Halifax together. As you have equal authorisation over the account, you do not have to mention your OH, but as Cet said, to cover all bases it is worth mentioning his name. I sent all letters from me, but in the subject line I always referred to both names on the account. The Court Claim was the same, in my name only, but the POC made reference to both our names.

I also claimed pre-6yrs, and although I didn't use Cel's POCs, I think they cover the limitations very well. Good luck,

Crash

[TANZARELLI]

Re: HALIFAX 18 year claim

I think Cetelco has given some good sound advice DS. If you are not 100% sure then it is really not worht the risk. We could discuss the arguements for and against CI as well as discussing the relevant caselaw to back up arguements, but if you don't fully understand it and can't argue it then perhaps the wise thing to do is that what you seem to have now decided on.

I take my hat off to you for all your efforts in trying to get your head around what is a very tricky and complex type of claim.

For that I applaud you and duly click them scales for you mate. :-)

Re: HALIFAX 18 year claim

There is no duty on you as the Claimant to refer to the Limitation Act in any way. Even the court does not have a duty to refer to it if the Defendants should fail to raise the matter for any reason including oversight.

If the defendants want to rely upon the Limitation Act then it is they who must raise the issue and plead it when the time comes.

If you include details from Celestine's post in your PoC then I would think that is sufficient and I would not make any particular mention of older charges at LBA stage, merely that you are going to issue a claim for a specified sum is enough and in any case your schedule of charges will include the date of each charge, so they will know soon enough.

Only you know if there is other information that you need at this stage and, as you say above, there is nothing vital, so issue your claim without delay.

The claim can be from either of you or just one of you but if I were being particular, I would make it from "Mr and Mrs" as joint claimants.

Re: HALIFAX 18 year claim

Thanks again Celteco,

I knew in my heart of hearts that I could not deal with a claim of that magnitude.

I have changed the spreadie to 8% simple interest and now it is much more respectable and is now £4.1K.

I had previously written to the Halifax some months ago when I only had statements back to 1997. But following the SAR which the statements only arrived in November the sent statements from the inception of the account at 1990. I have the letter before action by Tools, do I need to mention at this point regarding the Limitations or do I keep this for the POC.

Also, Halifax have not fully stisfied my SAR request which is now well over the 40 days, although I do not think there is anything to vital that I need.

One final point the account was in joint names should the LBA be from both of us ( hubby) or can it just come from me and that goes for the POC as well.

I know more questions...... I want to get it right.

Cheers
DSxx

Re: HALIFAX 18 year claim

The way forward in relation to the pre-six year stuff is to follow Celestine's example in post #13.

Essentially, section 32(1)(b) of the Limitation Act 1980 states that where, “any fact relevant to the plaintiff's right of action has been deliberately concealed from him by the defendant...”, then "the period of limitation shall not begin to run until the plaintiff has discovered the concealment... or could with reasonable diligence have discovered it."

In plain English, this means that in light of the banks' continued attestations that the charges levied to customers' accounts are lawful, a view which goes against that contained in the OFT statement, the above applies in your case.

However, if this does not apply and the banks' were genuinely not aware that these charges are unlawful, then the banks are mistaken - and you should cite section 32(1)(c), which covers actions for relief from the consequences of a mistake.

If it were me making this claim, then I would simply claim statutory interest on the sum of the charges. To claim anything else would, even discounting the sum involved, mean that the legal argument is such that it is doubtful a County Court would hear it and almost certainly it would not be heard on the Small Claims Track.

It might be nice to think that you could sue them for £50,000 and win, but that is, in my view, wishful thinking and the risks far outweigh any benefits. If they chose too, Halifax could tie you up in litigation for years.

Re: HALIFAX 18 year claim

Thank Celteco for your honest advice

Which is the best way forward with the limitations act as all of my claim is over 6 years. Do I quote the Sempra case and just 8% stat interest!!

Please advise me.

DSxx

Re: HALIFAX 18 year claim

I would not entertain a claim for in excess of £50,000 based on contractual interest. This sum alone would take it out of the small claims track and place it squarely in the multi-track where costs awards can be unlimited.

I would suggest you read these posts very carefully before embarking on such a claim, in particular as you have freely admitted that at present you cannot afford to invest the sum required to even file the claim.

Legal Beagles

[thephoenix]

Re: HALIFAX 18 year claim

trust me, I understand. I knew there was a reason why you requested the info you did

good to see you wanting to cover every single base. your right, this is a very large single claim and standing toe to toe with I'm sure several barristers from Halifax is going to be a daunting task. you are brave.

Re: HALIFAX 18 year claim

The cost for to do this claim is £6/700 pounds do not have that sort of money right at this very moment, also, I am not sure if this claim will stay within the County Court or be passed to a higher court. If it goes to a higher court how will I be able to deal with it up against a top legal team of the Halifax.

With the limitations argument I am not sure if what I have is enough and whether there is anything further that can be added. If I have to go to court eventually, I would want to be absolutely sure of my ground. as if I lost the case I could get lumbered with Halifax's costs which could set me back 1000's £££'sss. Basically, I want to make this claim so watertight and not leave any room for them to wriggle out.

I understand your enthusiasm in getting this claim in, and trust me I cannot wait to get going but I just need to be 100 percent, you must understand this.

DSXx

[thephoenix]

Re: HALIFAX 18 year claim

ok, so you have the figures.......£50k ish claim with proof of ALL charges.
You have an argument regards the limitations act

What more do you really need to issue a claim for penalty charges????


1.They have not sent the true signed copy of the original application form.
I'm not sure what you need these for
2. All internal and external correspondence received or sent, including memos, screen notes and transcripts etc.or these
3. If they disclosed any information to third parties with or without my express permission. or these
4. The terms and conditions that were in force at the time my account was opened and any subsequent amendments to those terms and conditions. These were requested under CPR Pre-Action Protocol 4.3(e). I'm sure that any T&C's would not really benefit your claim anyway, plus you could request that the court orders these documents from the defendant under CPR ?????

Re: HALIFAX 18 year claim

Hi PK They sent me only the statements but everything else they have not sent. I know for sure they soldthe debt on to Capquest, Capquest have since returned the debt back, so there must be some manual intervention. I requested the following:-
1.They have not sent the true signed copy of the original application form.
2. All internal and external correspondence received or sent, including memos, screen notes and transcripts etc.
3. If they disclosed any information to third parties with or without my express permission.
4. The terms and conditions that were in force at the time my account was opened and any subsequent amendments to those terms and conditions. These were requested under CPR Pre-Action Protocol 4.3(e).

This request was sent 28/11/07, upon receipt of the bank statements only which were received on the 10/12/07 I sent them a reminder that they had not fully complied. The 40 days has now expired, so I am ready to send a letter of complaint and take it further.

DSxx