TV license officer visit

[labman]

Re: TV license officer visit

Deleted

[enquirer]

Re: TV license officer visit

This is an very good site: http://tv-licensing.blogspot.co.uk

The public domain FOI site http://www.whatdotheyknow.com is worth a look anyway, and also has a lot of requests directed at the BBC.

[bluebottle]

Re: TV license officer visit

The obvious question to ask in a complaint letter is if they have authority, and if so, from where they derive it.

Absolutely.:nod:

[Hurricane Puffrose]

Re: TV license officer visit

Dear Sir/Madam

I am writing to inform you of the terrible experience I have had at the hands of *insert name if known* of Capita Ltd (your agents).
On *insert date* I had a visit from said person, who accused me of not having a television licence, I was shocked at this, I was under the impression that I had paid for this in full.

Whilst I attempted to explain what was a geunine misunderstanding, and prove my past payments towards the licence, I was treated as though I was a hardened criminal and my good reputation was put to question, causing me emotional distress and to question myself.
I was also cautioned as though I had been placed under arrest, at one point I thought I was under arrest!
I have subsequently been informed your agent (for whom you are 100% vicariously liable) has no right to use such techniques, and any "caution" is in fact null and void.

I have been treated shamefully by this agent, all for a simple misunderstanding that until I was visited, I had no knowledge of.
I have received no letters, calls or emails from yourselves before this person contacted me.

I require a full investigation as to my treatment, and the conduct of your agent, and notice of the outcome. Also, I will require proof of your agents legal right to conduct an interview "Under Caution" and the exact terms of this "Caution", as I find this extremely worrying, and very intimidating. I am of the understanding that a Caution may only be given by someone with PACE authorisation, so will require a copy of Capita's PACE authorisation as well.

I will allow 14 days for the resolution of this matter.

Yours

*Ms Smartgirl*


-------------------------

Please feel free to edit, rip to shreds or bin as you will guys..

p

Edited in BLUE.

[bluebottle]

Re: TV license officer visit

Yes, it cuts both ways - not only is the interviewee safeguarded, the interviewer gets better quality evidence.


Although PACE was aimed principally at the police, other persons who are legally empowered to fulfill an enforcement role are required to use it. See lists in previous posts by Miliitant and myself.

Those who simply investigate or detect crimes but who have no such empowerment (eg store detectives, PI's, security guards), are merely well advised to use it. Thus, the caution is standard practice in the security industry (it was the Judges Rules before PACE came on the scene). Store Detectives, PIs and Security Guards have no more power that the Capita/TVL goons. The regulation of the Security Industry that currently exists is woefully inadequate, as is the training they receive. Also, in my experience, the behaviour of retail security staff is of concern. Ill-disciplined is putting it mildly.

Obviously, when a properly obtained statement is produced in court, it is much more likely to be well received. A security guard producing a statement which is then revealed to have been obtained in a interview setting and whilst the alleged offender was not under caution, would face a very rough ride from the defence. It wouldn't make a lot of difference. They get torn to shreds anyway.


It's intimidation, certainly. It relies for its effect on the fact that most people don't know that any Tom, Dick or Harry can recite the formula. My view is that any householder who is intimidated by the TVL/Capita goons throwing cautions at them would be at liberty to use Section 24A of PACE to detain them for an offence under Section 4/4A, Public Order Act 1986. Whether the current batch of police officers would believe the crap Capita employees come out with that they are "being harassed", a common ploy by Capita/TVL employees, is another matter.

As to whether Capita goons have some sort of empowerment, they don't. That's they have to get off your land when you tell them to (and stay off, if you withdraw the implied right of access). Only if they manage to get a search warrant, do they have any power, and that is fleeting. Absolutely.

The BBC hires Capita to collect the licence fee, and licences the TVL brand name to them (they are obliged to use it, and to make no reference to the BBC, so the BBC can distance itself from their antics). They are a high-pressure sales organisation, and nothing more. What the BBC need to learn is that the likes of Capita will, eventually, cost the taxpayer more in civil damages for trespass and harassment committed against householders. Unfortunately, for reasons known only to the politicians, there are no financial penalties incorporated into the contracts Capita have with the government. It seems the taxpayer indemnifies them for incompetence and misconduct. That has to change - and quickly.

You've told me a lot of stuff I already know, Enquirer. And you've confirmed what I have suspected for a long time about these Capita PLC goons masquerading as TVL Visiting Officers.

[CleverClogs]

Re: TV license officer visit

My view is that any householder who is intimidated by the TVL/Capita goons throwing cautions at them would be at liberty to use Section 24A of PACE to detain them for an offence under Section 4/4A, Public Order Act 1986. Whether the current batch of police officers would believe the crap Capita employees come out with that they are "being harassed", a common ploy by Capita/TVL employees, is another matter.

Whilst section 4 (link) does not seem to be appropriate as it is concerned with the threat of violence, section 4A (link) might be.

There is also section 90 (1) of the Police Act 1996 (link) which should be easier to prove, not likely to be affected by any flim-flam by Crapita about alleged harassment of their goons and which carries the same maximum penalty as the Public Order Act offence.

[bluebottle]

Re: TV license officer visit

Whilst section 4 (link) does not seem to be appropriate as it is concerned with the threat of violence, section 4A (link) might be.

There is also section 90 (1) of the Police Act 1996 (link) which should be easier to prove, not likely to be affected by any flim-flam by Crapita about alleged harassment of their goons and which carries the same maximum penalty as the Public Order Act offence.

I agree with you on Section 4, Public Order Act 1986, which would be better-used against certificated bailiffs. However, Section 4A or Section 5, Public Order Act 1986, even, would be usable against the Capita/TVL goons.

Section 90(1), Police Act 1996 is designed to deal with those who impersonate police officers for the purposes of committing crime. It would not, IMHO, be effective against the Capita/TVL goons as their ID cards carry a TV Licensing logo.

Common Law Breach of the Peace is one that can be used, but only carries a Binding-Over Order on Surety as its penalty.

Claims of "being harassed" is a common tactic used by these goons. However, it is a tactic that is overused and used inappropriately. Sooner or later, the police will wake up to what is going on and one of these goons will end up facing a charge of Making A False Report and/or Wasteful Employment of Police.

[wales01man]

Re: TV license officer visit

Not wishing to upset the applecart and wind things up on this thread 2 facts remain as stated in the first post.
1. the OP says they had no licence
2. the OP let the TVL guy into the flat

all talk of cautiions and threats seem pointless i expect everone suspected of an offence of no TV licence is cautioned as what they say no doubt is evidence that can be used in court the only thing now is surely to prepare a defence and hope for the best.after reading the thread on here from the guy trying to challenge a council on their charges for taking action against council tax debtors and yesterdays day in court where it was as good as proved that councils can do what they want in the court and charge what the likei think this may be the case with Tv licence cases please dont slag me down for this post but the fact as i read it is the OP had no Tv licence at the time i cant see the excuse of forgetting to pay would wear its no defence in most other offences I:E motoring .
I hope the OP does win but would be surprised if they do.

[bluebottle]

Re: TV license officer visit

Not wishing to upset the applecart and wind things up on this thread 2 facts remain as stated in the first post.
1. the OP says they had no licence
2. the OP let the TVL guy into the flat

all talk of cautiions and threats seem pointless i expect everone suspected of an offence of no TV licence is cautioned as what they say no doubt is evidence that can be used in court the only thing now is surely to prepare a defence and hope for the best.after reading the thread on here from the guy trying to challenge a council on their charges for taking action against council tax debtors and yesterdays day in court where it was as good as proved that councils can do what they want in the court and charge what the likei think this may be the case with Tv licence cases please dont slag me down for this post but the fact as i read it is the OP had no Tv licence at the time i cant see the excuse of forgetting to pay would wear its no defence in most other offences I:E motoring .
I hope the OP does win but would be surprised if they do.

Unfortunately, Capita aren't called "The Cock-Up Kings" for nothing. I would not be surprised if they have cocked-up.

The OP says they paid more than they need do on their monthly payments, so a credit balance should exist.

Also, it is becoming apparent that courts are having to hold increasingly more Statutory Declaration hearings in order to address wrongful convictions arising from the crass ineptitude and gross incompetence of Capita and DVLA, usually because they have not informed alleged defendants of hearings. It would appear that, in many cases, on hearing the evidence from the alleged defendant, the court dismisses the case and awards costs against BBC and DVLA. As always, it is the taxpayer who pays for the incompetence, maladministration and malpractice of private companies carrying out public functions. This has to stop - and quickly.

[wales01man]

Re: TV license officer visit

Morning Bluebottle there is the defence if an overpayment has been made i have just read the tv licence website makes interesting reading as i said i hope the OP wins but this thread should serve as a warning to others check your licence is valid the same as you would your car insurance

[bluebottle]

Re: TV license officer visit

I can only refer you back to my comment about Capita being dubbed "The Cock-Up Kings" and the likelihood of them having cocked-up. They are well-known for it.

I did notice a box at the top right-hand corner of the TV Licensing website saying "Ask TV Licensing a question." I was sorely tempted to put in the box and send, "Why are your Visiting Officers such total numpties?"

[smartgirl]

Re: TV license officer visit

I called the TVL people today and found out since I activated my license in January this year when I moved, I have paid £121.00 but my license apparently ran out in July this year?? I thought as I was paying £24.25 a month on their payment plan (supposedly to help people in financial difficulty Lol..) that this would take me a bit it further than July and that if I did fall behind I would still be covered. I was informed that they cancelled it in July purely because I didn't stick with the payment plan. This seems so unfair. I'm so confused about this whole license thing. Does anyone know anything about the payment plan.

[bluebottle]

Re: TV license officer visit

How were you paying the instalments to the Payment Plan? Also, what proof do they have they you did not stick to the Payment Plan? If they cancelled it and didn't tell you, they are, IMHO, on very unsafe ground legally and so are their numpty employees who visited you.

[smartgirl]

Re: TV license officer visit

They would normally send an automated text and I would just reply yes or I would call and make payment over the phone.

[bluebottle]

Re: TV license officer visit

So what happened?