Default Applied Unduly Late

[L1882]

Evening All

Hope I've picked the correct forum here - my apologies if not.

I'm looking for advice and guidance on the date a default was added and whether you can challenge this on the basis of an undue delay between the account going delinquent and the addition of a default. I had 2 accounts with HBOS. I got into financial troubles in 2009 and both accounts were not paid from around September 2009. One account was defaulted in January 2010 but it appears the other one was not recorded as defaulted until May 2013. Obviously this could have a significant detrimental impact on my credit record.

So in brief my question is are there any routes I can use to challenge this default date, it should really have been done at the same time as the other account or do I simply have to take it on the chin?

[nemesis45]

Re: Default Applied Unduly Late

Hi,
Clarification Please.
1. What type of account are these?
2. Can you be sure of the last payment date on the account defaulted in Jan.2010.
3. Were any payments at all made to the to the account defaulted in 2013 e.g. a one off payment?

Different type of account are treated in varying ways.

nem

[L1882]

Re: Default Applied Unduly Late

Hi Nem - thanks for the response.

In answer to your questions:

1. Good question. One was a loan from HSPF the other I'm less usre on. When I got the loan they also sent me a card but I don't think it was a credit card - so I'm not 100%
2. I can be sure, I've had a SAR from them and neither account was paid after September 2009.
3. See above - no payments made at all.

This is why I can't understand why one was defaulted and one wasn't! I am now going through the statements with a view to reclaiming all the fees they added so might use that route and demand a refund plus interest plus the default being removed but I think they'd have an argument that the fees didn't cause the default which is why I am pondering whether I can argue it has been applied unduly late.

[Debt Camel]

Re: Default Applied Unduly Late

It does matter what sort of account it is. It doesn't seem likely to have been a secured account, but it could have been an overdraft on a current account, where the rules for default dates are different. See the quote from the ICO here http://debtcamel.co.uk/debt-default-date/ - that article also says how to get an error with the default date corrected.

[littlebert8]

Re: Default Applied Unduly Late

HSPF I think stands for Home Shopping Personal Finance - a joint venture with HBOS. It will probably be a fixed term loan, but they often sold these loans with an additional revolving credit account - for which you would have been issued a visa debit card and possibly a cheque book, but its not a current account. This may have been called a "preference account" and operates like a credit card.

[MIKE770]

Re: Default Applied Unduly Late

ICO response to this area:-

Thanks for getting in touch.

A default notice is usually sent when you’ve missed or paid less than the full amount for 3 to 6 months. The notice should give you at least two weeks to try and catch up with any missed payments. If you aren’t able to make the payments, the account will default. When the account defaults, the business can take further action by passing the debt to a collection agency.
As a general guide, a default may be recorded when you’re 3 months in arrears, and normally by the time you are 6 months in arrears. However, there are some exceptions to this which may result in default being recorded at a later stage – such as secured or long term loans e.g. mortgages.

[L1882]

Re: Default Applied Unduly Late

Thanks for the responses guys. Littlebert is spot on, that is exactly what it was and based upon the link from Debt Camel and Mike770's quote then I feel I can confidently argue the default was applied far to late.

I will now use the suggested text on the link to the debt holder and see if I can't get this default date amended - in fact it maybe that both dates are in fact late!

[L1882]

Re: Default Applied Unduly Late

Right I have double checked and the last payment was end of July 2009. By my reckoning the default should have been recorded by January 2010 - which would match the other account.

I have drafted a letter asking for the date to be corrected - is anybody able/willing to give it a once over before I send it?

[nemesis45]

Re: Default Applied Unduly Late

For the " late " defaulted account, a Formal Complaint to the Data Controller at the creditors head office.
The complaint being simply that the late placement of the default places you at a disadvantage because
of the extended " life" of the account, and you formally request that all CRA entries are amended to show
the true date when the default occurred.
It's up to you to give evidence of what you consider the date should be.

nem

[L1882]

Re: Default Applied Unduly Late

Right I have constructed a letter and sent it to the debt owner, using the statements as reference for my evidence on the correct date. I shall advise how they respond if/when they do.

[L1882]

Re: Default Applied Unduly Late

Hi All

Sorry it's been a while since I updated this - I've had so much on.

So first a brief timeline. I had 2 issues with this creditor, the lateness of the default fee and also the fact that they were not recording payments made against the account on my credit file and that they had increased the balance of one account by over £500 with no justification or explanation. I wrote to them separately over both matters. On the lateness of recording payments they apologised and promised to have the records updated by XX date. They didn't feel I deserved compensation but sent me £20 anyway. I took the view if they corrected the accounts I'd be happy so did nothing and waited. Lo and behold they did update the accounts with payments made but DID NOT correct the mystery addition. On the other matter they have never even acknowledged it.

So I've sent them an LBA for both matters (and BTW since they updated the accounts no new payments have been recorded) and they have not responded. I'm now looking for a little help to draft some simple POC.

My contention is that under Information Commissioners Office “Principles for the Reporting of Arrears, Arrangements and Defaults at Credit Reference Agencies” they have failed to ensure my record is "must be fair, accurate, consistent, complete and up to date" for the failure to accurately record payments and show the true balance and additionally for the default date issuereferring to principle 4 "If you fall into arrears on your account, or you do not keep to the revised terms of an arrangement, a default may be recorded to show that the relationship has broken down says that this will normally occur by the time you are 6 months in arrears."

So as they have not responded to my LBA I would now like to issue online to demand (as I did in my LBA):

1. A correction of the account balances removing the unexplained £XXX.XX that was added to the account.
2. Correction of the default date on the account with the reference XXXXXXXin accordance with the principles mentioned above and in my letter of complaint.
3. Compensation as decided by the court for the distress and potential damage your mismanagement of these accounts has caused me - including your failure to carry out in full your own rectification plan.

Can anybody advise me how I can lay this out in the correct way for the POC?

[nemesis45]

Re: Default Applied Unduly Late

Hi All

Sorry it's been a while since I updated this - I've had so much on.

So first a brief timeline. I had 2 issues with this creditor, the lateness of the default fee and also the fact that they were not recording payments made against the account on my credit file and that they had increased the balance of one account by over £500 with no justification or explanation. I wrote to them separately over both matters. On the lateness of recording payments they apologised and promised to have the records updated by XX date. They didn't feel I deserved compensation but sent me £20 anyway. I took the view if they corrected the accounts I'd be happy so did nothing and waited. Lo and behold they did update the accounts with payments made but DID NOT correct the mystery addition. On the other matter they have never even acknowledged it.

So I've sent them an LBA for both matters (and BTW since they updated the accounts no new payments have been recorded) and they have not responded. I'm now looking for a little help to draft some simple POC.

My contention is that under Information Commissioners Office “Principles for the Reporting of Arrears, Arrangements and Defaults at Credit Reference Agencies” they have failed to ensure my record is "must be fair, accurate, consistent, complete and up to date" for the failure to accurately record payments and show the true balance and additionally for the default date issuereferring to principle 4 "If you fall into arrears on your account, or you do not keep to the revised terms of an arrangement, a default may be recorded to show that the relationship has broken down says that this will normally occur by the time you are 6 months in arrears."

So as they have not responded to my LBA I would now like to issue online to demand (as I did in my LBA):

1. A correction of the account balances removing the unexplained £XXX.XX that was added to the account.
2. Correction of the default date on the account with the reference XXXXXXXin accordance with the principles mentioned above and in my letter of complaint.
3. Compensation as decided by the court for the distress and potential damage your mismanagement of these accounts has caused me - including your failure to carry out in full your own rectification plan.

Can anybody advise me how I can lay this out in the correct way for the POC?

Hello,

With any claim arising from alleged errors in reporting to Credit Reference Files one must be able to prove actual financial loss.

The default date matter the key word in the ICO guidance is " Should" happen in 6 months Not Must. happen much here will depend just how late the default was placed and again if this resulted in a provable loss.

At what level were seeking compensation court cost have risen considerably and compensation may not be much more.

Without working this out taking all into consideration I would not issue a claim.

nem

[L1882]

Re: Default Applied Unduly Late

Thanks Nem and I take your point however I'm not actually bothered for any compensation but I do need the balance correcting and also payments showing and as they so far have been unwilling/unable to deal with it I don't really see that I have any other route to go down to force them to do what they must do - even if I have to pay the court fees. The default was entered around 4 years after the account technically defaulted. I can live with that but I can't live with the fact that the balance not only fails to show payments made but also shows an increase that never occurred.

If there is another route besides court, bearing in mind I have tried repeatedly to work with the company. I guess I could stop making payments until they address the issue, that may cause them to take some action.

[stevemLS]

Re: Default Applied Unduly Late

As far as I know a claim of this nature cannot be issued online (that is limited to money claims), yours is a claim for rectification under s14 DPA 1998.

[L1882]

Re: Default Applied Unduly Late

Ok so I could claim but need to do it the old fashioned way? I'm now thinking my best chance of a resolution is to raise it as a compliant with the FOS and stop paying - the later part being the one that will almost certainly make them act whilst the former may at least inconvenience them and cost them!