Argos Card CCA

[IcanIwill]

Hello all new to this site but not new to trying to get out of a mess

I requested a CCA from Argos Card Services for my store card and this is what i have recieved from them






I have previously had 2 accounts cleared in past 12 months as no valid CCA so where do you think i stand with this one??

Thanks in advance

I will...I can

[labman]

Re: Argos Card CCA

Send them this:

Dear Sir/Madam,

Your Ref: xxxxxxx

This is a formal request under the Consumer Protection From Unfair Trading Regulations (CPUTR) 2008.

I require your organisation to provide written confirmation that states clearly whether you currently hold an original signed Consumer Credit Agreement, or whether you do not hold an original signed Consumer Credit Agreement pertaining to myself.

For the avoidance of doubt, an original signed Consumer Credit Agreement is just that; not an application for credit and not a reconstructed or microfiched document from other sources.

Please note that until such times as a legally enforceable, original Consumer Credit Agreement can be produced and a copy sent to me by return, then this letter is not an acknowledgement of debt.

Please also note that failure to provide a direct answer to this request will be brought before the court, should you decide to defy the content of this letter and instruct solicitors to pursue enforcement action regardless.

Yours faithfully,

[IcanIwill]

Re: Argos Card CCA

thanks for your reply i have just sent the above letter recorded delivery lets see what they come back with

[Angry Cat]

Re: Argos Card CCA

Argos, clearly do not understand fully the legislation!

Yes, they can provide a reconstituted credit agreement., in relation to section 78 Of the Act. But NOT without providing the inception Terms & Conditions as well as the Terms as varied.

reg 3 of the consumer credit cancellation notices & copies of documents regulations 1983 states that signatures and names may be omitted.

However;

In respect of regulation 7 which states;

7(1) Where an agreement has been varied in accordance with section 82(1) of the Act, every copy of the executed agreement given to a debtor, hirer or surety under any provision of the Act other than section 85(1) shall include either -

a) an easily legible copy of the latest notice of variation given in accordance with section 82(1) of the Act relating to each discrete term of the agreement which has been varied;

or

b) an easily legible statement of the terms of the agreement as varied in accordance with section 82(1) of the Act.

We are of the opinion that reg 7 refers to a copy of the executed agreement and that sub sections a) or b) are in addition to this and not any alternative to sending the "actual executed agreement".

from Carey V HSBC Bank plc [2009] EWHC 3417 (QB) (23 December 2009):

"108. Accordingly, I conclude that Reg. 7 requires a copy of the executed agreement in its original form as well as a statement of the terms as they are at the time of the request."

"SUMMARY OF FINDINGS:

234.

(4). If an agreement has been varied by the creditor under a unilateral power of variation, the creditor must still provide a copy of the original agreement, as well as the varied terms."

[IcanIwill]

Re: Argos Card CCA

Hey Angry Cat thanks for your reply..Did you manage to open the PDF attachment?

They have said they have enclosed a copy of the agreement and a statment of terms

Does this cover what you said it required and the Rec Agreement is very strange some of the info is so small i cannot read and some of the APR details and figures and ilegible

Thanks in advance

[Banksters]

Re: Argos Card CCA

They can provide you with a reconstituted agreement as per s/77 s/78 which is a request from you in order to satisfy a cca request , but in court they must still produce the original if it's to be enforced if i'm not mistaken.

If they had one they would send it I say. The 'Casey' case in my eyes works against these fools and in the consumers flavour more then we think. Could be well of tho :@)

[Angry Cat]

Re: Argos Card CCA

As stated previously:
Argos, clearly do not understand the legislation fully.
Or, they are trying to mislead you; a consumer.

Argos, must provide the original terms, the inception terms that formed part of the original executed credit agreement. As well as the Terms as varied.

Argos, clearly have not complied fully, thus they remain in default of your legal reguest made under section 78 of the CCA.

[pt2537]

Re: Argos Card CCA

BBC News - How credit card lenders can trip up when chasing debts

The cases on the right hand side all centered on s78 issues.

The creditor must provide the original terms of the agreement and either the current terms or a copy of each variation notice

its hardly difficult

had a barcalycard agreement declared irredeemably unenforceable by Recorder Campbell in Birmingham County Court the other day, awaiting the judgments from this and from another case i had in worthing, the worthing case is a helpful judgment on section 78 in full detail and also on termination

[pt2537]

Re: Argos Card CCA

Send them this:

Dear Sir/Madam,

Your Ref: xxxxxxx

This is a formal request under the Consumer Protection From Unfair Trading Regulations (CPUTR) 2008.

I require your organisation to provide written confirmation that states clearly whether you currently hold an original signed Consumer Credit Agreement, or whether you do not hold an original signed Consumer Credit Agreement pertaining to myself.

For the avoidance of doubt, an original signed Consumer Credit Agreement is just that; not an application for credit and not a reconstructed or microfiched document from other sources.

Please note that until such times as a legally enforceable, original Consumer Credit Agreement can be produced and a copy sent to me by return, then this letter is not an acknowledgement of debt.

Please also note that failure to provide a direct answer to this request will be brought before the court, should you decide to defy the content of this letter and instruct solicitors to pursue enforcement action regardless.

Yours faithfully,

that is irrelevant to a degree, as if the creditor does not hold the signed agreement, that will not bar him from enforcing, HHJ Langan QC alluded to this and this was approved in Carey also.

It is incumbent on the debtor to make a positive assertion that the agreement was either not signed by the debtor or that the agreement did not contain the prescribed terms before the creditor will need to bring the original to the table (HFO v Patel, Appeal Court 2009)(HFO v Wegmuller 2012)

The burden shifts from Creditor to prove prima facie there was an agreement which can be done by providing statements or other data, once that burden is discharged then it shifts to the debtor to make an allegation as to the agreement defects

HTH