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Hiya
Am disputing what i belive to be a miss sold loan, have complaint with FOS and that is now on hold due to thier back log.
Lloyds would not uphold my complaint and i replied in depth regarding thier discussting reasons.
I have now been asked to call regarding some of the issues i have highlighted in my reply.
Im in 2 minds as i never... ring LLoyds, they lie on the calls and do not uphold agreements made in voice.
Im concerned i could jepordise the case if i refuse.
Any views on this one.
I will post letters to date below.
Thanks
Thank you for your letter dated 27th July 2007
I write to advise that I am unhappy regarding your response to my complaint and also the length of time in which it has taken to reply.
If I understand your final paragraph. What happens next? I am to reply if I need more help, in the possibility that an agreement maybe reached.
Therefore I have to ask after waiting over 8 weeks why would there be any further help available with in this complaint and why would there be an outstanding possibility of an agreement that is not offered with in your letter. I find the length of time waiting for the response I have received is extremely unfair and so will be forwarding a copy, along with a copy of this reply to the FOS, Who has been aware of my complaint since 21st May 2007.
Your response.
You have placed Mum in a position that will cost her extra in interest to return borrowed funds, and you have also left her in the position with available Overdrafts at £500 and £300 of which would have been used again. This is due to the fact that mums Overdrafts already sustained her basic standard of living, which has now been placed below a basic standard of living due to this £46.
so not only would mum still be using her Overdrafts for her basic standard of living but she would have also need to use her Overdraft facility to repay this loan, therefore I see your statement that you have not changed my mothers finances to be totally inadequate. As you state mum already owed the money and as a responsible lender, I fail to see how mum was allowed to actually get into this debit in the first place. Her income did not warrant such overdrafts and most definitely not a loan.
As I have stated above, a borrowing that should never have been allowed to grow to the extent it did. Mums income was nowhere near the amount of which her overdraft was allowed to grow. Yet at no time did you contact her for a revised assessment when it was obviously getting out of control, but yet still after refinancing her with a loan, you leave both her overdrafts accessible with an additional £900 on both accounts upon request.
You have not effectively done this, what you have done is signed mum up to an agreement where she has to with out fail pay you £46 a month from her pension, were as a £50 reduction a month of her overdrafts would have stopped the Overdrafts at the limits they were. As it is the only thing you have done effectively is cleared the overdrafts ready for mum to reuse to live her basic standard of living and pay you the loan as stated above.
However with the reduction of the £50 a month mum would have had no choice but to approach a debit advisory service or a family member for help, Rather than be given a false sense of security that her income was at a healthy level by being written a loan.
My mums accounts were both severely overdrawn therefore I fail to see how this can be used to show a sign of good conduct; however it is a positive sign that my mums finances were out of control, Therefore I fail to see how you warrant applying a loan to mums accounts. As the overdrawn status is an obvious sign her income was not enough for her out goings.
As I fully believe my mum was never offered an alternative option, along with the fact that mum was not under the full understanding of what she was signing.
I believe my mum signed paper work as it was put in front of her with out the full knowledge of its true meaning, as is the case with the personnel check list, a copy of which I have forwarded to the FOS.
I also believe that she was not given adequate guidance through this loan, and was not given the option to read the terms and conditions, as these would have taken her days to complete. Therefore I have to ask if my mum were only presented with the signature page of the terms and conditions, would she have known to view the terms and conditions and is there anything on this page that advises it is one of many others.
The way in which this sale was completed is highly questionable and a copy of the personnel checklist has been sent to the FOS for their viewing, as I feel this was a misrepresented form and if this is found to be the case then I would have to question what and how mum was presented with in this sale.
5a. You also state that you would not want a customer to sign an agreement unless they were happy with it.
Then I have to ask how would a customer know the sale to be a correct and accurate agreement, if they did not have access to their personnel check list or have the knowledge to understand the process. Which is also why I feel my mum signing an agreement that is uncancellable under the consumer credit act to be unfair and irresponsible?
Could it be that as my mum has understood the lending process in the passed then she is expected to understand it forever? My mum’s situation has changed dramatically since she last applied for a loan from your selves. Especially financially and she is now paying £280 more a month for her rent and up to £30 a month on health needs.
Mum now requires much more support mentally and physically from family and friends, which is why I am complaining regarding what I believe to be a miss sold loan.
Mum has also been acknowledged by the state to be living under the financial threshold for a pensioner and is now in the process of receiving housing benefit and pension credit.
Therefore if the state acknowledges mum as needing financial support, I do not see how you had grounds to lend her money, Irrespective of her debit through her overdrafts, of which I strongly believe should have been stopped and addressed accordingly through debit management.
As I have stated above I am extremely unhappy with your response and will now forward a copy of your letter and my reply to the FOS.
I also wish to reiterate my request for a copy of the income and expenditure sheet as completed with mum in the sale of her loan, this is a required sheet with in any loan, and is kept at branch level. I have now requested this 3 times and see your lack of co operation to supply this form as an obstruction against the gathering of evidence for what we believe to be a very necessary and fair complaint.
Yours sincerely
Am disputing what i belive to be a miss sold loan, have complaint with FOS and that is now on hold due to thier back log.
Lloyds would not uphold my complaint and i replied in depth regarding thier discussting reasons.
I have now been asked to call regarding some of the issues i have highlighted in my reply.
Im in 2 minds as i never... ring LLoyds, they lie on the calls and do not uphold agreements made in voice.
Im concerned i could jepordise the case if i refuse.
Any views on this one.
I will post letters to date below.
Thanks
Thank you for your letter dated 27th July 2007
I write to advise that I am unhappy regarding your response to my complaint and also the length of time in which it has taken to reply.
If I understand your final paragraph. What happens next? I am to reply if I need more help, in the possibility that an agreement maybe reached.
Therefore I have to ask after waiting over 8 weeks why would there be any further help available with in this complaint and why would there be an outstanding possibility of an agreement that is not offered with in your letter. I find the length of time waiting for the response I have received is extremely unfair and so will be forwarding a copy, along with a copy of this reply to the FOS, Who has been aware of my complaint since 21st May 2007.
Your response.
- You state you have not changed my mum’s financial position,
You have placed Mum in a position that will cost her extra in interest to return borrowed funds, and you have also left her in the position with available Overdrafts at £500 and £300 of which would have been used again. This is due to the fact that mums Overdrafts already sustained her basic standard of living, which has now been placed below a basic standard of living due to this £46.
so not only would mum still be using her Overdrafts for her basic standard of living but she would have also need to use her Overdraft facility to repay this loan, therefore I see your statement that you have not changed my mothers finances to be totally inadequate. As you state mum already owed the money and as a responsible lender, I fail to see how mum was allowed to actually get into this debit in the first place. Her income did not warrant such overdrafts and most definitely not a loan.
- You gave mum a structured repayment programme for her borrowing.
As I have stated above, a borrowing that should never have been allowed to grow to the extent it did. Mums income was nowhere near the amount of which her overdraft was allowed to grow. Yet at no time did you contact her for a revised assessment when it was obviously getting out of control, but yet still after refinancing her with a loan, you leave both her overdrafts accessible with an additional £900 on both accounts upon request.
- You state you have effectively allowed mum to reduce her overdraft by £50 a month.
You have not effectively done this, what you have done is signed mum up to an agreement where she has to with out fail pay you £46 a month from her pension, were as a £50 reduction a month of her overdrafts would have stopped the Overdrafts at the limits they were. As it is the only thing you have done effectively is cleared the overdrafts ready for mum to reuse to live her basic standard of living and pay you the loan as stated above.
However with the reduction of the £50 a month mum would have had no choice but to approach a debit advisory service or a family member for help, Rather than be given a false sense of security that her income was at a healthy level by being written a loan.
- You state that the conduct of my mums account is the basis for the lending of this loan.
My mums accounts were both severely overdrawn therefore I fail to see how this can be used to show a sign of good conduct; however it is a positive sign that my mums finances were out of control, Therefore I fail to see how you warrant applying a loan to mums accounts. As the overdrawn status is an obvious sign her income was not enough for her out goings.
- You state mum was happy to sign the terms and conditions.
As I fully believe my mum was never offered an alternative option, along with the fact that mum was not under the full understanding of what she was signing.
I believe my mum signed paper work as it was put in front of her with out the full knowledge of its true meaning, as is the case with the personnel check list, a copy of which I have forwarded to the FOS.
I also believe that she was not given adequate guidance through this loan, and was not given the option to read the terms and conditions, as these would have taken her days to complete. Therefore I have to ask if my mum were only presented with the signature page of the terms and conditions, would she have known to view the terms and conditions and is there anything on this page that advises it is one of many others.
The way in which this sale was completed is highly questionable and a copy of the personnel checklist has been sent to the FOS for their viewing, as I feel this was a misrepresented form and if this is found to be the case then I would have to question what and how mum was presented with in this sale.
5a. You also state that you would not want a customer to sign an agreement unless they were happy with it.
Then I have to ask how would a customer know the sale to be a correct and accurate agreement, if they did not have access to their personnel check list or have the knowledge to understand the process. Which is also why I feel my mum signing an agreement that is uncancellable under the consumer credit act to be unfair and irresponsible?
- You advise my mum has had loans in the passed with no problems and so were happy to agree a new loan.
Could it be that as my mum has understood the lending process in the passed then she is expected to understand it forever? My mum’s situation has changed dramatically since she last applied for a loan from your selves. Especially financially and she is now paying £280 more a month for her rent and up to £30 a month on health needs.
Mum now requires much more support mentally and physically from family and friends, which is why I am complaining regarding what I believe to be a miss sold loan.
Mum has also been acknowledged by the state to be living under the financial threshold for a pensioner and is now in the process of receiving housing benefit and pension credit.
Therefore if the state acknowledges mum as needing financial support, I do not see how you had grounds to lend her money, Irrespective of her debit through her overdrafts, of which I strongly believe should have been stopped and addressed accordingly through debit management.
As I have stated above I am extremely unhappy with your response and will now forward a copy of your letter and my reply to the FOS.
I also wish to reiterate my request for a copy of the income and expenditure sheet as completed with mum in the sale of her loan, this is a required sheet with in any loan, and is kept at branch level. I have now requested this 3 times and see your lack of co operation to supply this form as an obstruction against the gathering of evidence for what we believe to be a very necessary and fair complaint.
Yours sincerely
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