Bailiffs instructed due to previous council tax fees of old and current housemate.

[CPWhan]

Hello,

My housemate and I are in need of some help.

We previously lived in a property with three other people. Letters had been sent to the house we had moved out of with regards to a bill we need to pay. As a result we had no knowledge of what stage it was and and were unable to discuss the account with the council as we had no account number (due to no letters).

There has now been a letter sent to our new address to inform us of enforcement proceedings. This letter is addressed to two people who are not living in this address and a name which is a combination of two names (one who does live here), meaning none of the names on the letter actually live in our current property. I tried to call the council and let them know none of the named people live at this address. I spoke to a friend who explained we shouldn't have opened the letter but unfortunately we did. We have now received a letter today stating the bailiff has visited, so we called him. He also has the wrongs names but unfortunately we confirmed that wrong name on his record partly consists of one of the names is living this address. But the telephone conversation wasn't recorded. The date on the letter states that we need to make the first payment by 4/05/2014 followed by 10 weekly payments which includes their fees and the council tax.

Our friend explained that we don't actually have to pay the Bailiff fees (Bailiffs are Bristow & Sutor) and that we need to deal with the council directly. He explained that there is specific steps to take to get the Bailiffs off our back so that we only need to pay the council tax bill. However he has lost the relevant link. My housemate (who's name it's in) is able to visit the council office tomorrow to discuss this and make a partial payment to the council towards council tax.

Please can you let us know where we stand and what we need to do?

Thanks

[bluebottle]

Re: Bailiffs instructed due to previous council tax fees of old and current housemate

I feel you need to speak to the Information Commissioner's Office (ICO) about this. It sounds like someone has been a bit footloose and fancy-free with people's personal information. There is also the question of whose name(s) are/is on the Liability Order(s) and whether those named are, in fact, legally liable. Ring the ICO's Helpline in the first instance and take it from there.

[CPWhan]

Re: Bailiffs instructed due to previous council tax fees of old and current housemate

Hey,

Sorry forgot to mention...the reason they do have this new address is because I went to talk to them about another account and gave this one as a forwarding address about it. They then used this address to chase us about the 2nd account. So that's how they got the data (of our address at least) do you still think we should call them?

When I spoke to the council about the previous account (in person), I tried to also discuss the one we are now being chased for. However they refused to speak to me as I didn't have the account number and my name isn't on it as I'm a student (but my housemate's name is). I am still looking to sort it out with her (and the others) as we entered the house on the agreement that we would all split the bill as otherwise none of us were able to afford to live there.

Thanks

[bluebottle]

Re: Bailiffs instructed due to previous council tax fees of old and current housemate

Obtaining a Council Tax Liability Order in the name of someone who is not a Liable Person for the purposes of the Council Tax (Administration and Enforcement) Regulations 1992 (as amended) is not only wrongful. it is potentially illegal. Although it does go on, strictly speaking, it should not happen. Do please check to ensure any Liability Orders have been correctly obtained and that Bristow & Sutor are not acting on an invalid order.

[bizzybob]

Re: Bailiffs instructed due to previous council tax fees of old and current housemate

Bristow & Sutor will swear black is white, so a Formal Complant to the council CEO, and elected leader, copied to your MP are in order. Include in it anything the ICO says regarding breaches of Data Protection and the data cleansing of a name into a new combination

[CPWhan]

Re: Bailiffs instructed due to previous council tax fees of old and current housemate

Ok thank you I will let you know how we get on.

[Milo]

Re: Bailiffs instructed due to previous council tax fees of old and current housemate

The 'liable' party is 'those in occupation' of the property. The regulations are also clear in that a council tax demand is deemed valid if addressed to the last known address (unless of course the debtor had provided a new address).

The debt is also a 'joint and several' one and may be addressed to any one of the persons 'in occupation' during the relevant billing period.

[CPWhan]

Re: Bailiffs instructed due to previous council tax fees of old and current housemate

Hello,

I spoke to the ICO but they said that it is not a data protection issue and that we just need to sort it out with the council. Our plan is to go to the council office tomorrow morning with proof of when we moved address and also with letters from bailiffs with incorrect names on to try and settle it with them and pay directly to them. In the mean time, how do we get the bailiffs off our back? A friend explained that we are not to pay any money through the bailiffs as once we have done that then we have entered into something with them.

Thanks again.

[bluebottle]

Re: Bailiffs instructed due to previous council tax fees of old and current housemate

The 'liable' party is 'those in occupation' of the property. The regulations are also clear in that a council tax demand is deemed valid if addressed to the last known address (unless of course the debtor had provided a new address).

The debt is also a 'joint and several' one and may be addressed to any one of the persons 'in occupation' during the relevant billing period.

What you have said is correct, Milo. However, the reality is that with firms like Capita and Liberata involved, not to mention the corruption surrounding the process of obtaining Liability Orders, it does no harm to check and double-check to ensure things have been done correctly. Call me a cynical ex-copper, but I would never accept any document alleged to have issued by a court without first checking things out and establishing the authenticity of a document. I say this after being shown forged court documents in a case I am helping with, though, not on LB.

[CPWhan]

Re: Bailiffs instructed due to previous council tax fees of old and current housemate

Sorry if this seems like a really dim question, but how do you go about checking the Liability Order has been correctly obtained? We have no qualms with paying the council tax bill as we did live in the previous property and have been trying to discuss it with the council. However they would not speak with us as we had no account number as the letters were going to the wrong address. We just want to know how to get the bailiffs to leave us alone. I am also waiting for CAB man to call back with some info.

Thanks for your help.

[bluebottle]

Re: Bailiffs instructed due to previous council tax fees of old and current housemate

If you are speaking to the office staff, you will get them fobbing you off. Ask to speak to the Head of Revenues, who is a senior manager. You should find things will, hopefully, improve.

[CPWhan]

Re: Bailiffs instructed due to previous council tax fees of old and current housemate

Thank you

[Guest]

Re: Bailiffs instructed due to previous council tax fees of old and current housemate

Milo has explained in post #7 about who is liable.

In addition, in order to be liable, your name must have been on the CT bill. Councils generally get as many names on the bill as poss as this enables them to chase more than 1 person in order to recover the whole debt.

I think the only way you may be able to stop action at this stage is to write a formal complaint to your council, outlining your issues. It is complex because they only appear to have half a persons name. This person should be the one who writes. He/she should ask that recovery action is suspended whilst this issue is unravelled.

Unfortunately, it is doubtful that the council will take the debt back as they have followed legislation correctly. All they need do is contact you at your last known address.