Council Tax - Bailiff's Fees and Charges

[Gonzalo]

Hi,

I'd be grateful if someone would give me some advice about Council Tax arrears and the fees and charges that Bailiffs are permitted to charge for the costs they incur while they perform their services in order to recover arrears in Council Tax.

My understanding is that the level of 'fees' Bailiffs are able charge is prescribed by law. It is also my understanding that Council in England have a duty in law to ensure that the Bailiffs they employ to undertake this work observe the rules and regulations? Is this correct?

Are there any remedies available to those of us who have been overcharged by bailiffs, and if so, how do I go about recovering my money and from whom?

I am asking the question because I have recently asked the bailiffs for a statement of account which they duly provided in the form of a letter. The statement shows that I have been charged a sum of £497.52p in total. This sum was made up of four separate items: Five First Letter fees charged at £24.50 per item (£122.50); Four Second Letter fees charged at £18.00 per item (£72.00); Three separate Levy fees (£42.04, £14.24 and £26.74) amounting to £83.02; and two separate attendance fees, one of £125 and one of £90, amounting to £200.

I only recall there being one visit to my property rather than the two separate visits they claim to have made in the letter they send to me. Also, I am not clear about the Levy fees, if they only visited my property one occasion how can the bailiffs justify charging three separate fees? Last, but not least, I doubt that the fees they charge for the sending out letters are fair or reasonable in any circumstances?

On this last point, my feeling is that the level fees and charges that a bailiff is able to charge (legally) should depend on the personal circumstances of the person on whom they're being imposed? What is the legal position on this issue?

Many thanks.

A

[Becky0812]

Re: Council Tax - Bailiff's Fees and Charges

Hi can anybody possibly help me I have 3 council tax debt with Jacobs enforcement agencie I have been paying the 5 pound a week for over a years and payed one of my debts off I revive a letter today to say they have canceled all my payment plans as they now want 27 pound a week I have two children am a single mum I only work 16 hours a week I have child care cost and other priorities debts. I phoned them today and a man called Dave answered who didn't Evan ask me my income or outgoing just demanded I pay them 26 pound a week I said I will keep my standing order going with them so still paying the debts but now there sending bailifs round and I don't have anything for them to take anyway but can some pleSe help me if I am paying the debt and I have proof never missed a payment what can I do. Thank you

[Kati]

Re: Council Tax - Bailiff's Fees and Charges

Formal complaints to both the council and the bailiffs firm maybe??

[Gonzalo]

Re: Council Tax - Bailiff's Fees and Charges

And then what happens?

Suppose I report them to the Information Commissioner's Office as you suggest. I suggest that the council will claim that they were unaware of the bailiffs failure to reply to the SAR and in the event choose to rap their knuckles and everything else will carry on as before?

There must be some consequences for both the bailiffs and the council, surely? Are there no remedies available to the public who my have been ripped off by the Bailiffs. Can the bailiffs licence(s) be revoked and if so, by whom?

[bluebottle]

Re: Council Tax - Bailiff's Fees and Charges

Failure to respond to an SAR is a breach of the Data Protection Act 1998. Report to the Information Commissioner's Office (ICO).

[Gonzalo]

Re: Council Tax - Bailiff's Fees and Charges

Here's an update and an email I received from the bailiff yesterday afternoon.

Thank you for your email. Please be advised that your account has now been passed back to Tunbridge Wells Borough Council for their consideration. Please refer to them directly should you require further information. Thank you

What happens when the Bailiffs fail to reply to SAR requests, not once but twice? What should I do next apart from waiting from the other side's response ?

Thank you.

[Gonzalo]

Re: Council Tax - Bailiff's Fees and Charges

Hi Seduraed,

This is just to confirm that I paid Stanford Green its SAR fee of £10.00 by Credit Transfer on 11th March 2014. I had made clear in my SAR letter which was dated 10th March 2014. There could NOT have been any confusion in their minds about this because it was the second payment I had made to them in March and also because the method of payment was different to one I was using at the time, i.e. by standing order.


I hope this is helpful.

Regards

G

[Gonzalo]

Re: Council Tax - Bailiff's Fees and Charges

I'm sure that I did. I normally pay both parties, i.e. both the council and the Bailiff by direct credit transfer. I don't have a cheque book and so I may have asked a friend to send a cheque on my behalf ..... I'll have to check that to be certain and I will get back to you.

In any event, the council replied at length and the bailiff did not reply to either of my two SAR requests that is ....

[seduraed]

Re: Council Tax - Bailiff's Fees and Charges

when you sent the sar requests did you enclose the statutory £10 fee?

[Gonzalo]

Re: Council Tax - Bailiff's Fees and Charges

Hello,

Sometime has passed since I last posted on this board about my problem with local council and I need to bring you up to date on my situation. Suffice to say to that the matter seems to be to be going backwards at the moment and here is an outline or timeline on the main sequence of events, so far as I understand them.

1.) On 10^th March 2014 I sent two separate SAR requests one each to both the Tunbridge wells Borough Council (TWBC) and to Stanford & Green the Bailiffs. The council replied within the legally defined time scales. However, the bailiffs failed to reply and I assumed that they simply decided to ignore it which for all intents and purposes they clearly had.

2.) On the basis that the Bailiff had ignored SAR request, I decided to cancel the Standing Order for £10 per month that I had set up previously agreed to pay to the bailiff. I did this on 1^st January 2015.

3.) On 16^th March 2015 I was ‘door stepped’ by the Bailiff’s Enforcement Agent who presented me with ‘Attendance Notice to Take Control of Goods’ (Ref: 215743) and demand for settlement of £1072.28 due to my failure to clear my arrears. This Notice had a reference number of 215743.

4.) At my request, the Enforcement Agent went away and later presented me with a breakdown of the sum of £1072.28 shown on the Attendance Notice. The sum shown of £1072.28 was a net figure comprising:
a.) Original due £1187.62
b.) Compliance Fee £42.50
c.) Enforcement Charge £235.00
d.) Less payments Received (£636.85)
Balance Due £1072.28

5.) The amount owing as at 16th March 2015 the balance due was therefore £1072.28 as shown on the Attendance Notice being made up of three separate case numbers, the first two of these have been inherited from my previous address with the Borough.


1.) #240151 2004/05 £416.42
2.) #240152 2005/06 £203.79
3.) #237025 2012/13 £175.93
4. Compliance Fees (£42.50 x 3) £127.50
Sub-Total £923.64
Difference £148.64

I assume difference of £148.64 arises from the cost of the Attendance Notice (Ref 215743) at £110.00 plus the compliance fee of £42.50 amounting to £152.50, give or take some arithmetical errors.

Note that the first two of these reference numbers date back some ten years ago when I lived at another address within the Borough. (Note that I was seriously ill at this time and I was unable to keep up with any of my bills).

5.) On 18^th March, and on being served with the Attendance Notice by the Enforcement Agent on 16th March I wrote to the Stanford and Green asking them to clarify the situation. I also sent them a copy of my original SAR request and asked to provide me with the information I had ask them for and which I understood they were legally required to do. Once again, I received no reply to my SAR request.

Moving on and to bring you up to date.

6.) On 25^th July 2015, I received a Removal Notice Council Tax Arrears letter dated 22^nd July which was sent to me by second class post. There are a several issues or questions I have about this Notice. First, the Removal Notice shows a Total Balance due of £453.43, a figure that is clearly different from the previous figures that I have set out for you above. Secondly, the Notice states that ‘despite previous visits, you have failed to effect settlement of the above account’. Third, I will now call on a Saturday or a Sunday to enforce the Liability Order against you. It goes on to state that in certain circumstances such action can be taken in your absence and where necessary with a removal contractor and locksmith….

I am unclear about my next steps, not least because I have no idea whether this figure of £453.43 comes from? As it states it is the Total Balance Due, is a figure in full and final settlement or just a first of more actions to come. I am not sure about how all this works.

I would be grateful for your advice on the best way for me to proceed.

I should also add that my Council Tax is up to date for the period 2015/16 and paid in full for 2013/14 and 2014/2015.

Many thanks

Gonzalo

[bluebottle]

Re: Council Tax - Bailiff's Fees and Charges

This is my reply bringing contribution to the thread up-to-date as at Bluebottle's post stamped at 23:47 24th February 2014

I may have mislead you slightly. But, certainly unintentionally.

What's been happening is that since April 2013 to date I have been paying both the bailiff and the council separately by standing order. I have been paying the bailiff £125 per month to towards the alleged arrears and £147 per month in Council Tax.

Basically, the Council Tax has been paid in full and directly to the Council over a period of ten months. My bank statements confirm this to be the case and I therefore believe that my Council Tax is up-to-date for the current year, i.e. 2013-2014. Unfortunately, neither the bailiff nor the council (bless them!) believe this to be the case and I have written to them both - and separately - to disabuse them of this idea. Separately, to the bailiffs because they're the entity that holds my account for the 'alleged' arrears for the prior years. These date back over a period of years and back 2008.

So, if I'm not the only person to find myself in this position, what remedies are there available to us in law? Should I approach the Ombudsman or perhaps, the audit Commission for help?

Moving on, I'm thinking this maybe just another form of stealth tax - most of which seem to fall upon people who can least afford to pay it for one reason or another?

Okay. If your Council Tax for the 2013/2014 Financial Year is up-to-date, fine. If you owe the local authority no more until the new Financial Year - In the case of 10-month years, this runs May - March - pay no more until the 2014/2015 Council Tax Bill falls due.

In the case of those years where you are in arrears, could you list the following details, please -

Council Tax Year Amount Due Amount Paid

Then, separately, any lawful bailiff fees due.

From this, it will become clear if you owe anything, have cleared the arrears or are being ripped-off by the bailiffs.

[Gonzalo]

Re: Council Tax - Bailiff's Fees and Charges

Hi Ploddertom,

I wrote to the Bailiff along the lines suggested in post #4 and I gave them fourteen days in which to reply. I also wrote to the council asking them to explain to me why they thought I was in arrears on my council tax for the current year 2013/14 having paid in full, i.e. the charge for Band D which was £1466.05. I also pointed out that I should have been in credit because I qualified for the single persons discount of 25 percent for three months during the year.

Hey Ho!

I am writing for replies to both of my letters one from the Bailiffs and the other from Council.

Thanks again for your help.

G

[ploddertom]

Re: Council Tax - Bailiff's Fees and Charges

Did you obtain the information from the Council as suggested in Post 4? Did you send off for a breakdown of Bailiff Fees?

[bizzybob]

Re: Council Tax - Bailiff's Fees and Charges

"Moving on, I'm thinking this maybe just another form of stealth tax - most of which seem to fall upon people who can least afford to pay it for one reason or another?"

That is the fundamental issue with Council Tax, it takes no account of ability to pay, beyond a fiendishly complicated relief scheme, and can be more than the rent, or mortgage payments

[Gonzalo]

Re: Council Tax - Bailiff's Fees and Charges

This is my reply bringing contribution to the thread up-to-date as at Bluebottle's post stamped at 23:47 24th February 2014

I may have mislead you slightly. But, certainly unintentionally.

What's been happening is that since April 2013 to date I have been paying both the bailiff and the council separately by standing order. I have been paying the bailiff £125 per month to towards the alleged arrears and £147 per month in Council Tax.

Basically, the Council Tax has been paid in full and directly to the Council over a period of ten months. My bank statements confirm this to be the case and I therefore believe that my Council Tax is up-to-date for the current year, i.e. 2013-2014. Unfortunately, neither the bailiff nor the council (bless them!) believe this to be the case and I have written to them both - and separately - to disabuse them of this idea. Separately, to the bailiffs because they're the entity that holds my account for the 'alleged' arrears for the prior years. These date back over a period of years and back 2008.

So, if I'm not the only person to find myself in this position, what remedies are there available to us in law? Should I approach the Ombudsman or perhaps, the audit Commission for help?

Moving on, I'm thinking this maybe just another form of stealth tax - most of which seem to fall upon people who can least afford to pay it for one reason or another?