Bailiffs collect services PCN

[CleverClogs]

Re: Bailiffs collect services PCN

form n1 completed
form te9/te7 completed
council letter written
letter to bailiffs emailed and posted
small courts track implemented

Whence did you get the letters you've sent?

When did you issue the claim - the form N1? Did you send a Letter Before Action before making the claim?

How can you have "implemented" the small claims track, unless the defendant has acknowledged the claim and entered a defence?

[Fair-Parking]

Re: Bailiffs collect services PCN

I have followed this threaad with both interest and a little dismay since it first appeared on another forum back on 21st January. Anybody approaching two independant forums should be aware that they are likely to receive different sets of advice from each one.

Usually advice is well meaning but it can also be misleading and harmful and I am concerned that it appears that legal proceedings have been commenced and that those legal proceedings relate to the amount of bailiff fees. The most obvious flaw in this enforcement is the lack of warrant which means that both bailiff fees and the amount owing on the PCN itself are unenforceable. In short battle has been commenced in the wrong arena and over the wrong issues. They may also have been commenced against the wrong party.

Not only do legal proceedings add to the stress levels that are clear in both forums, but they can also lead to substantial costs being awarded against the claimant if the claim proves to be unsuccessful.

I note too that chargeback has been sought which may be successful but regrettably these claims are rejected more often than not. Nor does any success rid a person of further balliff action. And please! Refrain from any thoughts of Form 4 complaints. They are not there to argue bailiff fees and also carry the risk of substantial legal costs

I can also deduce from the amounts being pursued by the bailiff (£120 + £60 + £5 rather than £130 + £65 + £7) that this is a very old PCN and subsequent Charge Certificate and thus any warrant which may have been authorised by the Traffic Enforcement Centre (TEC) could have expired long ago.

My initial advice is for the OP to cancel all legal proceedings and to contact the local authority concerned and ascertain when the TEC authorised the warrant.

[bizzybob]

Re: Bailiffs collect services PCN

DrWise, you would be very wise to follow Fair-Parking's advice on this one.

[bluebottle]

Re: Bailiffs collect services PCN

I have followed this threaad with both interest and a little dismay since it first appeared on another forum back on 21st January. Anybody approaching two independant forums should be aware that they are likely to receive different sets of advice from each one.

Usually advice is well meaning but it can also be misleading and harmful and I am concerned that it appears that legal proceedings have been commenced and that those legal proceedings relate to the amount of bailiff fees. The most obvious flaw in this enforcement is the lack of warrant which means that both bailiff fees and the amount owing on the PCN itself are unenforceable. In short battle has been commenced in the wrong arena and over the wrong issues. They may also have been commenced against the wrong party.

Not only do legal proceedings add to the stress levels that are clear in both forums, but they can also lead to substantial costs being awarded against the claimant if the claim proves to be unsuccessful.

I note too that chargeback has been sought which may be successful but regrettably these claims are rejected more often than not. Nor does any success rid a person of further balliff action. And please! Refrain from any thoughts of Form 4 complaints. They are not there to argue bailiff fees and also carry the risk of substantial legal costs

I can also deduce from the amounts being pursued by the bailiff (£120 + £60 + £5 rather than £130 + £65 + £7) that this is a very old PCN and subsequent Charge Certificate and thus any warrant which may have been authorised by the Traffic Enforcement Centre (TEC) could have expired long ago.

My initial advice is for the OP to cancel all legal proceedings and to contact the local authority concerned and ascertain when the TEC authorised the warrant.

Absolutely. Form 4 complaints are for behaviour so serious that it brings into question the fitness of the bailiff to hold a bailiff certificate. This includes and is not restricted to assaults on debtors that are not in self-defence, fraud, making demands the bailiff has no right in law to make and using threats to enforce the demands, misrepresentation of powers, Criminal Damage and Threatening to Cause Criminal Damage.

[Sir Vere Brayne d'Emmidge]

Re: Bailiffs collect services PCN

fees that can be charged

• Original PCN = £120

• If paid within 14 days - £60

• If applicable - Charge Certificate - increases the full PCN by 50% - add £60 total PCN is now £180

• Court Fee - add £5 - Execution Warrant amount now payable - £185

• Bailiffs statutory letter fee £11.20 + VAT total £13.44 (assuming you received one). Total now payable at letter stage is £198.44

Just a little amendment: The TEC fee is now £7

Bailiff turning up to clamp car: £55.50 + VAT @ 20% £ 11.10 = £ 66.60

Plus (Depending on Local Authority) the Attendance to remove can be applied on the first visit which can be as high as £ 175.00 + VAT = £210.00

Possible maximum total on the first visit £ 477.04

[bizzybob]

Re: Bailiffs collect services PCN

£477, cripes, a brand new Dacia Sandero would not fetch enough at auction to clear that after a couple of extra visits a levy and ATR fees, as it would go for peanuts at auction without keys and V5

[CleverClogs]

Re: Bailiffs collect services PCN

Plus (Depending on Local Authority) the Attendance to remove can be applied on the first visit which can be as high as £ 175.00 + VAT = £210.00

As the first visit should merely be an invitation to pay and as the bailiff can (prior to the visit) have little or no knowledge of whether the debtor has goods worth seizing, just how can such a fee be lawfully applied on the first visit?

[Sir Vere Brayne d'Emmidge]

Re: Bailiffs collect services PCN

As the first visit should merely be an invitation to pay and as the bailiff can (prior to the visit) have little or no knowledge of whether the debtor has goods worth seizing, just how can such a fee be lawfully applied on the first visit?

As I said before, depending on the authority that applied for the Warrant of Execution, from memory a bailiff could apply an ATR on the first visit for Westminster City Council but not for Transport for London, that's just an example, but do not forget that the defaulter would have received a letter from the baliff stating that there is an oustanding PCN for £ XX.XX plus statutory letter fee of £ 13.44 and given between 7 to 14 days to pay.

Defaulters ignore this letter at their own peril!