Marstons HCEO. Can the take goods without a CCJ

[wrsalt]

This is a bit complicated and I have not got all the details.

The background my friend runs an gym and ended up with a debt from Initial (rentokill) for hygiene services. There was some dispute over the payment and service provided.

Around the middle of June my friend received a letter and then a visit from an agent form Marstons Group. They are claiming that the a High Court Enforcement is in place. All the correspondence in place show no evidence of a CCJ or any fines from a court. As far as my friend is aware he's not received anything from a the Magistrates court or the county court. His wife has informed me that she looked into this and not CCJ was in place and the agent had told her the CCJ would be in place at the end of the this month July the 31st.

Today he received a letter with a list of items they are saying they will take next week. All the items on the list belong to the landlord of the premises as he rents the unit and equipment as a whole from the landlord. (the unit is part of a sports complex where the landlord used to run the gym) A number of the items on list also belong to myself. They are items I loaned to my friend as favour to help him get started, I have receipts and proof of ownership. I actually use these items for my own business at times as I'm personal trainer and hire out boxing rings.

Marstons have only been in the reception area of the gym and have not looked round and made an official inventory of any of the goods.

As far as I'm aware my friend agreed on their initial visit to try and make payments by £100 instalments. There is s receipt for £100 that he and the the Marstons agent both signed. This is from the middle of June. As far as I'm aware he made no other payment to Marstons. His wife around the same time made a direct payment to initial for £40 as when they first heard from Marstons she thought it best to try and deal with Initial direct.

They in a poor financial and are currently in the process of being means tested for another debt.

What I need to know is:

1. how do I help my friend check if he has CCJ against him?

2. If he doesn't have CCJ against him do Marstons have the right to seize goods from the work premises without a CCJ or High Court writ?

3. What is mine and the Landlords legal situation if they take our property with or without a CCJ in place?

4. Who is the best person or agency to speak to find out where we all stand?

5. If Marstons have attempted to issue a walking possession order without a CCJ or writ in place have they acted fraudulently?

Any guidance on what my rights are and my friends will be much appreciated

[wrsalt]

Re: Marstons HCEO. Can the take goods without a CCJ

In addition my friend and his wife have been through a traumatic time yearly this year. His lost her mother and Uncle (who was murdered) within two weeks off each other. She has also been through an emotional court case 2 months ago arising from incidents from her child hood which I'd rather not go into. I did read somewhere that harrasment of people in vulnerable situations was not allowed. Is this correct?

[ploddertom]

Re: Marstons HCEO. Can the take goods without a CCJ

What paperwork has been left from Marstons? Is it a Form 55?

[wrsalt]

Re: Marstons HCEO. Can the take goods without a CCJ

They left a receipt for payment for the £100. As far as I'm aware all the letters and the one talking about seizing items are not a form 55. I've just google form 55 and the ones I've seen didn't have the same information on as the ones I've seen. Not got them to hand so can't be 100% definite.

[ploddertom]

Re: Marstons HCEO. Can the take goods without a CCJ

Marstons have 3 different divisions:
Debt Collectors
Bailiffs
High Court Enforcement Officers
They tend to use the same letter heading for each. Did he actually tell you he was a HCEO or is it being presumed from the letter heading?

[wrsalt]

Re: Marstons HCEO. Can the take goods without a CCJ

Just looked up form 55 a bit more it's definitely not a form 55. It's letter he received in the post detailing that a collection agency will be coming to try and collect a list of items. It also includes the charges they will be trying to charge. £400 for the first hour the £200 for every additional hour they will be there. Their is not detail of the any court or warrant on the letter.

[wrsalt]

Re: Marstons HCEO. Can the take goods without a CCJ

I've not spoken to the agent direct. I assumed he was a bailiff but he's not registered and looking into I realised all the letters referred to the High Court Enforcement

[wrsalt]

Re: Marstons HCEO. Can the take goods without a CCJ

I presuming he's an HCEO officer but he's not on this list http://www.justice.gov.uk/downloads/...t-officers.pdf but it is out of date. I've not seen anything with any court details on and I looked at 5 or 6 different letters today

[ploddertom]

Re: Marstons HCEO. Can the take goods without a CCJ

I have to be honest & say that from what you say & because there does not appear to be reference to any Court details they have attended purely as Debt Collectors. It would be helpful to scan & upload the letters you have - making sure personal details are removed - so we can have a better look.

[bizzybob]

Re: Marstons HCEO. Can the take goods without a CCJ

No CCJ no right to take even a beer mat. If they have no CCJ, or writ of fi fa, are attending as mere debt collectors, and they are claiming to have rights to seize goods they are opening themselves to some trouble.

[wrsalt]

Re: Marstons HCEO. Can the take goods without a CCJ

These are the documents they have sent.

[wrsalt]

Re: Marstons HCEO. Can the take goods without a CCJ

Additional image that won't let me upload for soem reason is a receipt for a payment. As far as I know they didn't show any warrants, writs or certificates when they visited. They created an inventory after they left and didn't leave any other paper work on their visit

[ploddertom]

Re: Marstons HCEO. Can the take goods without a CCJ

OK, they say they have a Writ of Fi Fa, and also have a Walking Possession agreement made in June. Before this can have been granted there must have been a CCJ in place - do you have any knowledge of this? As to the goods seized I seem to remember you saying they were the Landlord's - if so you need to make him aware of this as he must submit a claim to ownership. This must now be treated with some urgency as Enforcement Officers working on behalf of HCEOs have the power to force entry to commercial premises.

[wrsalt]

Re: Marstons HCEO. Can the take goods without a CCJ

I can you find out if they do are a writ of fi fa and are not just trying it on? From what I've read a walking possession agreement should by issued by a form 55 and signed by both parties, is this not correct?

[ploddertom]

Re: Marstons HCEO. Can the take goods without a CCJ

I can you find out if they do are a writ of fi fa and are not just trying it on? From what I've read a walking possession agreement should by issued by a form 55 and signed by both parties, is this not correct?

No

What has happened & the clue is partly in the sum they claim to be owed is that sometime you have had a CCJ awarded against you for some reason or another. This has gone unpaid and they have transferred it to the High Court for enforcement. The HCEO gives no prior warning of this as his best plan of attack is surprise. It appears that he has attended - made a seizure of goods which does not need to be signed by you for it to be valid - by signing it you consent to him leaving the goods in your care pending whatever terms may be agreed. If you go back over some of those other letters there are references to you having agreed to make payments which suggests you know about the debt and therefore also the CCJ.