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Please help!! Honest family, dishonest bailiffs. Rossendales

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  • Please help!! Honest family, dishonest bailiffs. Rossendales

    Hi can someone please help? I'm sorry if it seems complicated.
    We owed West Berkshire Council £702.00. My partner was in talks with West Berkshire Council to settle the outstanding balance in instalments. We were informed that this was ok and that somebody would be in contact with us from the council regarding income and expenditure forms, my partner then filled in a form which stated our weekly wages and was awaiting a reply, which was never received. Since this, she has been in contact with West Berkshire Council regarding setting up a payment plan.

    We were then visited out of the blue by a bailiff (Mr Barlow). He handed my partner a letter and she explained that there was a mistake with West Berks Council and hopefully the debt would be taken back due to the lack of communication from West Berks Council. Mr Barlow was very pleasant and suggested with the situation that we should continue paying West Berkshire Council and this should resolve the situation and the bailiffs charges would cease. She then spoke with Mr Barlow via telephone again to say she had paid £100.00 to West Berks council directly and should she carry on doing this? He said “to carry on payment as we were to West Berks Council and complain to West Berkshire Council about the lack of correspondance and to stop the bailiffs.”

    My partner then spoke to West Berks Council again on Thursday 27th June with the advice from the bailiff to carry on paying the council, however they were unwilling to take the fee back and advised to sort out a payment plan with Rossendales. The girl advised with advice from her manager that the £100 would be accredited to Rossendales and reduced from the debt.

    On the same day my partner spoke with Rossendales contact centre about the situation and was informed that the debt had been passed onto another bailiff and she was given a telephone number to contact this bailiff (Mr Duffy). She was not told that there would be charges added on and the reasons why another bailiff was placed in charge. The same day she contacted Mr Duffy regarding payment and he stated that he “did not have the files, he would pick them up tomorrow and to be in contact the following week.”

    Wednesday 3rd July - We had a knock on the door from Mr Duffy again out of the blue, with no correspondance. I heard my partner getting upset and came down the stairs to find out what was going on, my partner was chatting to Mr Duffy about their phone conversation the week previously and that she did not realise he was coming to the house, they had came to an arrangement that they would speak the following week over the phone, not to attend the house to collect. He stated that he had put a levy on my vehicles and that he would be taking them away unless payment of £972.00 was paid in full within 24hours. £270.00 on top of the original fee owed. He also informed us that a letter had been sent to us saying a van was on its way. I stated that WE HAVE NEVER RECEIVED THIS LETTER, Mr Duffy then said that it must have mysteriously vanished in the post. My partner then started to get more distressed as we have definitely never received this letter. I asked if it was sent recorded delivery, to which the reply was no. My partner also explained what Mr Barlow had said about paying West Berks Council and he said this was not the case and we had been misinformed. He then told us we should have received the letter for which we were charged, which again we explained we had not received it. We have only ever received one letter from Mr Barlow which he handed my partner on his ONE visit. Mr Duffy then told us that in his records Mr Barlow had visited us twice, which IS NOT the case, he had only visited us once and only ever handed us one letter, AND WE HAD NOT RECEIVED ANYTHING THROUGH THE DOOR, but of course we have been charged for this fictitious visit and fictitious letter. Mr Duffy then left the premises and explained that we needed to pay in full or he would take my vehicles. (Which by the way are hire purchase vehicles and used for business purposes).

    My partner was extremely distressed and contacted West Berkshire Council immediately who said there is nothing they can do even though she had previously tried to make arrangements to pay. My partner thought that we were getting on top of her debts and there are records to prove the conversations she had about organising a payment plan.

    We were so distressed I called the bailiff and said I would try to pay them in a couple of weeks and he said I have 2 weeks to pay or he will remove my vehicles. He also advised me that the way Mr Barlow had advised me of just paying off West Berkshire Council and forgetting about the bailiffs was wrong and that I should make a complaint and ask for a reply within 14 days. I have also spoke to West Berks Council and they have also told me pay the bailiffs and to file an email complaint to both the bailiffs and themselves. Myself and my partner are arguing and are extremely stressed as we cannot afford to pay the bailiff within this time frame. We were never unwilling to pay the debt, we tried to make arrangements with West Berks council and they took so long to reply it has resulted in this.

    We are an honest family and are willing to pay West Berkshire Council £200.00 a month to clear the debt. We have 2 children and I feel this is a reasonable amount to pay back. We have taken all the correct steps and were arranging a payment plan. I cannot stress how much grief this has put us through. Why should we pay and then complain???? I do not want to pay these con men, I have no problem settling my debt with the council.

    I also questioned the charges the bailiff had added on for just 2 visits an extra £270.00.....There are charges for 3 visits and we have never received this so called letter about a van being on its way, I cant remember the wording he used.

    I have downloaded a cease and desist letter, will this work?

    PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE HELP!!
    Tags: None

  • #2
    Re: Please help!! Honest family, dishonest bailiffs. Rossendales

    Hi mrcraigboo, & welcome to Legal Beagles.

    Don't panic, put the kettle on, & I'll be back in a minute with some info. :tinysmile_grin_t:

    Btw, is this a Council Tax issue?

    (ps - 2 sugars, please )
    CAVEAT LECTOR

    This is only my opinion - "Opinions are made to be changed --or how is truth to be got at?" (Byron)

    You and I do not see things as they are. We see things as we are.
    Cohen, Herb


    There is danger when a man throws his tongue into high gear before he
    gets his brain a-going.
    Phelps, C. C.


    "They couldn't hit an elephant at this distance!"
    The last words of John Sedgwick

    Comment


    • #3
      Re: Please help!! Honest family, dishonest bailiffs. Rossendales

      Ok, I'm back

      They can't levy on HP-covered vehicles. (Show them the agreement)
      They can't seize household goods without a valid Walking Possession Order (Levy).
      To obtain this, they must first gain 'peaceable entry' into your house, which requires your signature.
      No levy = no removal van = no charge for same.
      So do not let him in (they sometimes lie - "can I use your loo, have a drink of water", etc etc)
      They can only charge for 2 visits - £24.50 + £18 = £42.50 (even if they call 100 times)
      The council can take the debt back - here's the legislation to prove it (your situation is known as 'distress')
      http://www.legislation.gov.uk/uksi/1...rticle/70/made
      It's just - shall I say - more financially rewarding to them if the bailiff does it.
      Go back to the council offices, ask them to take it back, & if they say no, demand that they sign a letter to that effect. (take a pre-written one with you).
      Finally, I bet Duffer says "you've been on the forums", :nod: - if he does, ask him if the info is correct. & record the conversation.
      Last edited by charitynjw; 4th July 2013, 02:27:AM.
      CAVEAT LECTOR

      This is only my opinion - "Opinions are made to be changed --or how is truth to be got at?" (Byron)

      You and I do not see things as they are. We see things as we are.
      Cohen, Herb


      There is danger when a man throws his tongue into high gear before he
      gets his brain a-going.
      Phelps, C. C.


      "They couldn't hit an elephant at this distance!"
      The last words of John Sedgwick

      Comment


      • #4
        Re: Please help!! Honest family, dishonest bailiffs. Rossendales

        Originally posted by charitynjw View Post
        They can't levy on HP-covered vehicles. (Show them the agreement)
        They can't seize household goods without a valid Walking Possession Order (Levy).
        Nor can they seize and remove either of the children to sell in Arabia as a slave.

        Comment


        • #5
          Re: Please help!! Honest family, dishonest bailiffs. Rossendales

          Originally posted by mrcraigboo View Post
          My partner then spoke to West Berks Council again on Thursday 27th June with the advice from the bailiff to carry on paying the council, however they were unwilling to take the fee back and advised to sort out a payment plan with Rossendales. The girl advised with advice from her manager that the £100 would be accredited to Rossendales and reduced from the debt.
          It is a pity that her remarks had not been recorded or put in writing, as that is clearly blatant maladministration.

          Wednesday 3rd July - We had a knock on the door from Mr Duffy again out of the blue, with no correspondance. I heard my partner getting upset and came down the stairs to find out what was going on, my partner was chatting to Mr Duffy about their phone conversation the week previously and that she did not realise he was coming to the house, they had came to an arrangement that they would speak the following week over the phone, not to attend the house to collect. He stated that he had put a levy on my vehicles and that he would be taking them away unless payment of £972.00 was paid in full within 24hours. £270.00 on top of the original debt owed.
          On a debt of £726.50 (£702 + £24.50 first visit fee) the correct levy fee would be (£24.50 + £16 + £5.67) = £46.17.

          It would appear that you are being overcharged.

          He also informed us that a letter had been sent to us saying a van was on its way. I stated that WE HAVE NEVER RECEIVED THIS LETTER, Mr Duffy then said that it must have mysteriously vanished in the post. My partner then started to get more distressed as we have definitely never received this letter. I asked if it was sent recorded delivery, to which the reply was no. My partner also explained what Mr Barlow had said about paying West Berks Council and he said this was not the case and we had been misinformed. He then told us we should have received the letter for which we were charged,
          Oh, really?

          There is no regulation that permits a bailiff or bailiff company to charge anything for sending a letter regarding council tax.

          My partner was extremely distressed and contacted West Berkshire Council immediately who said there is nothing they can do
          That is not even approximately correct.

          We are an honest family and are willing to pay West Berkshire Council £200.00 a month to clear the debt. We have 2 children and I feel this is a reasonable amount to pay back. We have taken all the correct steps and were arranging a payment plan. I cannot stress how much grief this has put us through. Why should we pay and then complain???? I do not want to pay these con men, I have no problem settling my debt with the council.
          Get on to your local, elected councillors and make those snotty-nosed snollygosters do something useful for a change. Tell them (and the leader of the council and the leader of the opposition) how the bailiffs are effectively cheating the council of revenue, apparently aided and abetted by the council's own staff!

          I have downloaded a cease and desist letter, will this work?
          No.

          Comment


          • #6
            Re: Please help!! Honest family, dishonest bailiffs. Rossendales

            I assume you received all the relevant notifications from the Council about the Liability Order + the one that advised if not paid within 14 days they would instruct Bailiffs. Unfortunately the Bailiff does not have to give you notice of his attendance. Have you checked the amounts being charged are correct? You need to speak to someone at the Council and ask the following questions:
            1 - how many Liability Orders they have against you
            2 - the dates they were obtained
            3 - the addresses they were for
            4 - the period of time each covers
            5 - how much each one was for
            6 - how much is still outstanding
            7 - the dates they were passed on for enforcement
            8 - the dates & amounts of any payments

            You should also send off for breakdown of the fees they are charging - use Letter 1 from http://www.legalbeagles.info/forums/...Useful-Letters . I would normally suggest you send intially by email enquiries@rossendales.com but believe their website has been taken down since being amalgamated with Marstons. You should certainly put a letter in the post though.

            Comment


            • #7
              Re: Please help!! Honest family, dishonest bailiffs. Rossendales

              A few other things Mr Duffy needs to be reminded about and are additional to what Charity and Ploddertom have advised -

              1. He cannot levy on or seize vehicles used in connection with your employment, business or vocation, regardless of any claims he may make to the contrary;
              2. He cannot charge fees in advance as he is committing an offence of Fraud by False Misrepresentation by doing so;
              3. He has to leave AT LEAST five days from the date of levy before he can lawfully remove goods as he must give you an opportunity to pay;

              As for West Berkshire Council, they need reminding that the law does not permit them to refuse a payment and I agree with Clever Clogs that it amounts to maladministration. Mention the damning report involving Rossendales and Blaby Council by the Local Government Ombudsman (LGO) to West Berkshire Council. All councils know about this report, so West Berkshire Council, in particular, should bear in mind the slamming Blaby Council received and cannot deny its existence.
              Life is a journey on which we all travel, sometimes together, but never alone.

              Comment


              • #8
                Re: Please help!! Honest family, dishonest bailiffs. Rossendales

                Originally posted by bluebottle View Post
                As for West Berkshire Council, they need reminding that the law does not permit them to refuse a payment and I agree with Clever Clogs that it amounts to maladministration.
                The apparent maladministration was when they accepted a payment of £100 and paid it to Rossendales!

                Comment


                • #9
                  Re: Please help!! Honest family, dishonest bailiffs. Rossendales

                  Thank you everyone for your information. It has eased a little stress
                  It is a council tax issue.
                  So where do I go next? Shall I still write my letter of complaint but also phone West Berks Council (shall I record the call?), and mention the legislation and that I am willing to pay them, shall I also mention the maladministration?
                  Shall I just start making payments to West Berks Council? Myself and my partner have never signed anything, The first visit they charged us £92.40 on a Notice of Bailiffs attendance, then we didn't have another visit even though they are claiming we did and we didnt receive the letter they claimed they sent. Yesterday we received a bailiff removal with a walking possesion agreement which we have not signed and contains 2 hpi vehicles that are used for business purposes. We have been charged an extra £48.00 levy fee and £150.00 attention fee from the original £92.40.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Re: Please help!! Honest family, dishonest bailiffs. Rossendales

                    Originally posted by CleverClogs View Post
                    The apparent maladministration was when they accepted a payment of £100 and paid it to Rossendales!
                    I totally agree with you, Cloggy. It may also amount to complicity with any unlawful or illegal conduct on the part of Rossendales and their out-of-control bailiffs. Lgos need reminding, repeatedly, that they should not, under any circumstances, do anything which amounts to aiding, abetting in or being an accessory to an indictable offence. They also need to be reminded that they are very vulnerable to proceedings for misfeasance or misconduct in public office.
                    Life is a journey on which we all travel, sometimes together, but never alone.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Re: Please help!! Honest family, dishonest bailiffs. Rossendales

                      Originally posted by mrcraigboo View Post
                      Thank you everyone for your information. It has eased a little stress
                      It is a council tax issue.
                      So where do I go next? Shall I still write my letter of complaint but also phone West Berks Council (shall I record the call?), and mention the legislation and that I am willing to pay them, shall I also mention the maladministration?
                      Shall I just start making payments to West Berks Council? Myself and my partner have never signed anything, The first visit they charged us £92.40 on a Notice of Bailiffs attendance, then we didn't have another visit even though they are claiming we did and we didnt receive the letter they claimed they sent. Yesterday we received a bailiff removal with a walking possesion agreement which we have not signed and contains 2 hpi vehicles that are used for business purposes. We have been charged an extra £48.00 levy fee and £150.00 attention fee from the original £92.40.
                      The vehicles the bailiff has levied on cannot be levied on or removed as they are not only third-party property, but are for use in connection with your employment, business or vocation. Also, it is illegal to charge levy and removal fees on the same date.
                      Life is a journey on which we all travel, sometimes together, but never alone.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Re: Please help!! Honest family, dishonest bailiffs. Rossendales

                        Originally posted by mrcraigboo View Post
                        So where do I go next? Shall I still write my letter of complaint but also phone West Berks Council (shall I record the call?), and mention the legislation and that I am willing to pay them, shall I also mention the maladministration?
                        I'd leave that as a little surprise for the council office monkeys. Let them find out about it the nasty way when the elected council and/or the Local Government Ombudsman gives them a kicking.

                        Shall I just start making payments to West Berks Council?
                        If you can, do so - and get receipts. This will be useful if the bailiff company turns really nasty and claims that you have refused to pay.

                        Myself and my partner have never signed anything,
                        You do not need to have signed anything for a levy to be valid. In your case, however, the levy is not valid as it was made on two vehicles that do not yet belong to either of you.

                        The first visit they charged us £92.40 on a Notice of Bailiffs attendance,
                        They couldn't have come up with a "fee" of £92.40 even if they had added in the date!

                        Look here (link) and send the berks at West Berks (apt, eh?) and at Rossendales useful letter #1 from here (link).

                        You also need to tell Rossendales and the council berks that the vehicles levied upon are subject to hire purchase agreements and that they do not, therefore, belong to either of you. Tell them that, if the bailiff had only bothered to ask, he would have been informed of this and shewn a copy of the agreements.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Re: Please help!! Honest family, dishonest bailiffs. Rossendales

                          Good advice so far mrcraigboo, as per the others Rossendales are being malenky droogs, they should be reminded of the tolchocking they had from the Ombudsman on excessive and third party goods being seized, in the Blaby council findings; as to the maladministration, as the payment was to the council directly, it should have been applied to your account, which is why you should always pay the council, he bailiff fees would be paid at the end once they have been established as correct. However if you do as Council prat says and pay the bailiff, they will add more fees ad hoc and pay peanuts to the council off the debt. they will keep most of what you pay for their ill gotten coin to spend on mocca velocette at the Korova Milk Bar

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Re: Please help!! Honest family, dishonest bailiffs. Rossendales

                            Great thanks very much.
                            So I am going to send a letter requesting the breakdown of bailiffs costs and send it recorded delivery as well as an email.
                            I am then going to phone Rossendales and tell them that both vehicles levied are HP and are owned by a third party.
                            I will call the council and tell them that I intend to pay them and not the bailiffs, and insist this is my right.
                            I will then send all information to my local counciller and West Berks Council and Rossendales.
                            I am not going to contact Mr Duffy or listen to any of his threats, do I answer the phone if he calls (i am not sure if he has my number and I also have to answer to private calls for work purposes) and we he comes knocking again I will not open the door and I will post my HP agreement through the letterbox for him to see, as well as receipts of payment to West Berks council. Shall I film him?
                            Will this do the job?

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Re: Please help!! Honest family, dishonest bailiffs. Rossendales

                              Originally posted by mrcraigboo View Post
                              Great thanks very much.
                              So I am going to send a letter requesting the breakdown of bailiffs costs and send it recorded delivery as well as an email.
                              I am then going to phone Rossendales and tell them that both vehicles levied are HP and are owned by a third party. You will need to provide proof.
                              I will call the council and tell them that I intend to pay them and not the bailiffs, and insist this is my right.
                              I will then send all information to my local counciller and West Berks Council and Rossendales.
                              I am not going to contact Mr Duffy or listen to any of his threats, do I answer the phone if he calls (i am not sure if he has my number and I also have to answer to private calls for work purposes) and we he comes knocking again I will not open the door and I will post my HP agreement through the letterbox for him to see, as well as receipts of payment to West Berks council. Shall I film him?
                              Will this do the job?
                              PT
                              PT

                              Comment

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